ASM1

Another point. My wife, with backpack on, is a ever present Morman disgruntled victim of female discrimination. I took her from a troop of Mormans who can not drink coffee, or alcholhol. Yet the night I took her from this Troop, her Scoutmaster was drunk. Spare me the hipocracies of the Mormans. She is still devoted Morman, but she also knows she is but a pawn to their movement. I am Methodist, you know them, where we all work together for the betterment of our existance on this Earth.

ASM1

Well, As a CO, I beg to differ. It is clear that BSA policy be adheared to strickly. There is no BSA policy barring females from becoming SM's, or ASM's. I think everyone needs to read the chartered agreements between your CO and the BSA. They are all the same standard form.

ASM1

Bob, My applause for being one of the 50. But if not you, someone else would have made up the 50th person. How does that prove or disprove the statements by White Stag and BSA about the origins of Wood Badge then or Now in the 21st century. I do not see the connection.

I am getting form your statement that you do not endorese White Stag for youth training. This was explained to me by people from White Stag. They called it "entrentched opposition". If there is opposition, then there certainly needs to be an explaination to hold this great resource from our youth.

Like I said, our units will attend and become White Stag units with pride that our youth has the tools to become adult leaders and insure the continuance of this great program. Again, I say you have not read the documents.

ASM1

DAMN! Bob White, wrong twice in the same day. (marking this day on the calendar) It is not left up the the charter organization. Parents are encouraged to attending scouting events under BSA guidlines. If it were left up to the CO, it couple be possible to ban single female parents from becoming SM'a or ASM's. ERROR! Not possible!

ASM1

Oh My! Good thing my wife is not there, she would be there with backback on at the start of the campout with BSA rules in her hand demanding where it says moms can't camp. You should push the envelope and demand to become an ASM. GO CAMPING! I will not let my wife read this post because she will be on a plane for Texas with backpack!!

ASM1

Bob, you better finish reading the document, and the documents about White Stag from BSA. I have no way of knowing if it is true other than what I read in BOTH publications concerning White Stag. If you know better, please state your sources of information to disprove this statement.

ASM1

Well I see this is interesting. A lot of opinion of what White Stag is, all wrong, but still interesting. I contacted the program director and got the poop on it. White Stag was started in 1938 and is now the model for Wood Badge training. Somewhere along the line it got twisted into adult leadership training. It was never intended as such.

I intend on enrolling our older scouts into this course in Indiana and making our Troop and Crew White Stag Units. I have tried to talk to our DE about starting White Stag training here in our council, but he does not seem interested so far.

So, we will start it on a unit level and see what happenes.

ASM1

Following this thread. I may have missed it somehwere, so if I did, please don't get angry with me. But I have a couple questions. 1) What is your position in the Troop? SM, ASM, Committee? If None, 2) WHY?

You should not crash your car into this mom's home. But you should crash your mouth into the Committee Chair's ear and question this. Becareful though, you may be asked to leave the Troop as we were and you will have to start your own Troop and end up with a much better unit. ;-)

ASM1

Yes it is, the original Wood Badge, but for youth leadership.

ASM1

I stayed up late last night and read the entire document. It is the Wood Badge program for youths above the age of 14. Basically for a Venture Crew. Simply outstanding. Unfortunately everyone here on the East Coast just stared at me like a deer caught in the headlights when I mentioned it. Nobody heard of it and because they have not heard of it, they are not interested in it. Shame! I am sending my boys next summer to take this course.

ASM1

Well, I guess this was either far above everyones head, or a deeply unwanted subject. Funny, my DE ignored the request for information also. Hmm, I guess youth training of this kind endorsed by BSA is not a topic of concern.

ASM1

Here is the link, chose Free Download, and download it to your hard drive. open it and read it. You will need Acrobat Reader. This is Awesome!!

http://www.whitestag.org/order/preview_follow.html

ASM1

Ok, Ok, I am reading the document and I am blown away with it. I want everyone to see if your district or council offer this program. The document says that Wood Badge for the 21st century came from this program. And it is Junior Leader Training program. If this is not offered anymore, we have to re-start it on individual unit levels if nothing else.

ASM1

Maybe Bob White or other DEEP folks may be able to help answer this.

I am looking for all information concerning the "White Stag Program" and its current status. I download the 254 page PDF from the national site, but it is deep and I want our unit to be involved in it. Is it still offered?

ASM1

You bet your boots you need to question this. New 6 months and 1st Class? Not impossible I guess but really rare. Did mom sign off in his book? And another question, who did the Scoutmasters Conference?

A couple years ago in our old unit under the old SM my son was "Stompped" and kept from his Star rank. I was very angry. But the SM explained that he was not ready and that it had only been six month since his 1st Class rank had been granted.

After long reflection on this and now that 2 years have past, the SM was right. My son was not ready for Star. Since then he has gotten Star and Life and is working his Eagle project. And yes, my son has come back to Scouting with a vengence! He is helping organize our new unit and heavy into recruitment.

Question this advancement, the boy need to be ready in mind as well as time requirements.

ASM1

WOW! Good questions. Now I got one. My wife I sit on several district committees and were presented with the blue district committee members patches and given silver shoulder loops. We were told that when we wear the district patch and silver loops, we can not wear unit numbers. Although I have seen SM's and ASM's who sit on district committees wear the silver loops with their unit uniform without the district patches. What is the correct way?

ASM1

Yeah, you sure have gone and done it now! But relax ,it's only one hour a week!

From one new SM to another, we will make it work somehow won't we?

ASM1

I think I will do just that!

Bob White,

As usual you bring valid points to the conversation. This matter has taken on its own life. Now that my compnay has chareted two units, my business is suffering greatly. A lot of my clients are council members who also own businesses. They are turning away until the dust settles. I consulted my attorney this morning and he said if I persue this, I have to persue it to the council level for allowing this behavior, and the CO (in which I am a member) for the same. I do not wish to bring our council into this. My wife and I are very involved with the district and council and have made very close friends with many professional members. But given that, we have tried to walk away and be done with it. This SM, & ASM keep it in the face of the district and council. I am starting to beleive that I am left with little choice but to bring the legal end to this matter as my attorney suggests. I wish it would just go away. But that does not seem likely.

ASM1

My Scoutmaster when I was a youth was the most generous, compassionate, and understanding person I have ever known. He and my father were best friends but my father could not be involved in scouting becuase he traveled all the time. When my father died when I was 15 years old, this Scoutmaster took me into his home for a month until my mother could get all the details taken care of and find a job to support our family. We were forced to move out of state to be closer to family. When this Scoutmaster found out I had dropped out of scouting, he drove several states to our new home, found a troop and got me back into scouting. I am not sure if he is still alive or not, but if he is not, he is certainly helping scouts and scouters in Heaven.

ASM1

I really thought this was finished and done with. Several weeks have past since we were thrown out of the troop. Our DE came to the rescue and suggested my company charter our own troop. We decided it was a good idea and chartered a troop and a venture crew. Signed the papers two weeks ago. Everything was going fine and all things looked up. Now disaster has struck once again. While I was at Wood Badge training last weekend, out DE came to me and said that this person who caused all of our problems has raised a serious objection to our chartering a troop and he insists the charter be revoked. Our DE said he doubts very seriously that that can happen and not to worry about it. When I returned home I was discussing this with my wife and my son, (who was working on his Eagle project) overhead us talking and went into the new troop records and tore up his records and quit scouting. He said this is no honorable institute he wishes to be affiliated with. I am at a total loss and heartbroken. We have tried with no luck to date to change his mind. He will not even discuss it anymore. What should we do?

ASM1

Well, Bob White. I got you over a barrel so to speak. Your only right in one instance. BSA commercials are a part of the PSA network. But if you think for a minute that the PSA Network is not a tax deduction for air time play for networks, both local and national, then you live in a box. Use of all BSA material for promotion of a council, district, or troop is not only approved by BSA, but encouraged.

We have done our homework and are being supplied with all the current BSA promotions by our council and district.

ASM1

Well, I think I may have to disagree this time with Bob White. I run a marketing and advertising company. Most of our work is in Internet Marketing and Advertising, but we do, and have done television advertising. I would think now above all times in the past television stations, especially on a local market would be willing to run BSA commercials for tax deduction dollars. That is how they are run anyway. But nobody seems to be pressing the issue. I intend to press the issue extremely hard here starting in about a week. You should be able to get video taped copies of the National BSA commercials from you district or council. I intend to edit our troop information onto the end of the commercial and snag some local stations we have dealt with in the past to run them in prime time. I know Comcast cable, or most local cable companies that sell advertising will be interested in tax deductable vouchers for double what the commercial actually cost. Get smart, and press the issue.

ASM1

Yes to all of your questions. And we have a 26 year old Eagle Scout that will be heading the Venture Crew as an adult leader.

To be completely honest, I even thought of chartering a Cub Pack for recruitment purposes. But my wife reminded me that I am only human and that would be too much to bite off.

ASM1

Thank you, those are good ones.

ASM1