kari_cardi

I'm sorry. Yours is not an enviable position. I think you've been given some good advice. Best of luck!

KDD, you could also use the argument that the pack cam out will be a better experience if led by someone trained to lead such an event. I'd focus on getting a Wolf or Bear leader to do BALOO so you don't have to do this again next year or the year after. I'd also present it as 'this is the training for Cub Scout leaders to camp, and Webelos leaders need to take WELOTS' so it is matter-of-fact and just part of training and not 'special training that is a PITA that council requires so we can have fun.'

FWIW, my council lets someone with WELOTS or IOLS stand in for BALOO-trained. My council also doesn't require a tour permit for outings within council boundaries, so there isn't any real oversight there anyway. We still follow the rules because 1. it truly does give a better experience to have someone trained, and 2. it's the right thing to do.

We have at least three units in our district that lost charter orgs, one troop and two packs. The troop merged with another nearby troop, One of the packs folded, it was small and struggling before the membership change. I don't know what happened to the third. We have welcomed the cubs to our pack, we are pretty diverse and they should fit in well.

I'm a CC and I have a uniform that I wear for recruitment and in-person training. Otherwise, I don't feel a need to wear it. In your case, I'd probably go with whatever patch was already on the shirt or no position patch at all. Only fellow scouters will know the difference, and it will be less confusing to parents you may encounter in either role.

I have not found ours to be as useful as they could be. They are not well-attended and the information is lacking. Our district is actively working on improving them by offering more and better content with multiple break outs for different roles and identifying leaders in the district who represent successful practices for topics like popcorn, recruitment, camping and unit management.rather than relying on the same tired souls to do the same tired presentations. It's enough that I will give it another go.

I cannot actually think of a Cubmaster in our District that is not also a Den Leader. Most Cubmasters are Den Leaders aren't they ? Or are we just an odd district?

 

My husband goes by the theory of wearing as many hats as you want to until they start to fall off, that is the point where you need to relinquish some jobs/titles.

 

The other thing is, if you look at the Pack structure or "pyramid" of leaders, where you have the COR and CM and CC etc at the top and den leaders at the bottom, you need to invert that pyramid to realize what the most important positions are in a Pack.

 

Your pack will still go even if you have a cubmaster who isn't so great. But your pack will go no where if you have den leaders who are awful. Den leaders are really the most important position in the pack and you should not step back from being a den leader if you don't have a great replacement.

Unit size makes all the difference as well, I suspect. There is a critical point where it is impossible to have a pack without the leaders wearing multiple hats, a different point where more than one hat is difficult to juggle, and a big gray area in the middle.

I agree that a phone call is the way to go. In my experience, you might get a scout back if the parents are willing to share a specific problem for which you can offer a solution. Otherwise, I've found that scouts who have left before are much less likely to be retained a second time. When I follow up with families who have left the pack, I find it helpful to have a list of other local packs with locations and meeting times on hand to share if it happens that our pack is not the best fit.

Good luck!

We used Mirazyme with great success on one of our tents. The stain remains but the smell is gone and the mildew hasn't spread, indicating that it was killed by the enzyme treatment. It was recommended by the tent manufacturer. Mirazyme has directions for treating mildew in tents right on the bottle. I've found that mildew is likely to recur when bleach is used. Bleach will kill mildew on the surface and bleach out the mold so it isn't visible, it doesn't kill the mold in the fibers. It's hard on nylon and other synthetics, too. I like using a borax solution (1 cup to 1 gallon) to kill mildew in other applications, but haven't tried it on our tents because I'm not sure about how it will affect the fabric and special fabric finishes.

Our Pack would like to setup a PayPal account to start collecting dues' date=' and also to be able to accept credit cards at our popcorn Show and Sell. During the registration, it asks for a Federal Tax ID #. Can anyone tell me what Tax ID # they are looking for? Is there an overall Tax ID # for Scouts, or something at our Council level, or is it even something at our chartering organization (elementary school) level?[/quote']

Check with your council re: credit cards for popcorn. My council is loaning out CC scanners this year for booth sales.All of the costs, and liability, is held by the council. The unit simply scans the card, and they are done.

Our council is lending out CC scanners but the account to use the scanner is held by the unit, so all of the cost and liability is still with the unit. If our council would share ANY of the cost or liability of the popcorn sale I'd be a more enthusiastic supporter.

It's a common situation in our pack, most of our leaders wear two hats and we are larger than your unit.. My concern for you isn't in being Cubmaster and DL, but that you will end up assuming CC as well since as you say the committee is counting down the months to crossover. How many of the excuses from the other parents in your den are truly valid? Do you have someone that you would really like to work with, that you can recruit more vigorously? Can you identify a parent to begin working on to be CC? If you take CM, you'll basically have to build your own committee from what you've said, and you'll want to start that process ASAP.

Good luck!

Our council sells Trails End. Last year, the amount of commission varied by product within a 27-32% range. This year, the sales commission started at a flat 31% with a 1% bonus for attending popcorn training and an additional 3% given in lieu of prizes. Trails End is no longer offering prizes and the prize fulfillment is through the scout shop. I think these are excellent changes.

Kevin, your district Popcorn Kernel should have your answer and is probably more accessible than your DE. I suggest making that person your best friend, a big part of the job is answering questions. You'll have lots more.

Add me to the list of scouters who uses 'family camp' as pack camping with the whole family, and pack overnighter for any sleepover experience that is not camping. District cub camping are called Cub-O-Rees, Council cub camping is day, twilight or resident camp programs for dens or parent/son pairs.

There seems to be regional differences in how the terms are used.

We sell popcorn. Sometimes I feel like we're the "Selling Stuff Scouts" instead of Cub Scouts. We make just enough to run the program. Thankfully, our Council is changing vendors, (from Trail's End to Camp Master). Rumor has it there will be more low end items, which would help our kids. Many of them live in low income areas and have a hard time selling $25-50 items. If there were extra money, I'm pretty sure we could find good ways to spend it , but it still probably wouldn't be on belt loops.

The basic prizes this year in our council are all from the scout shop, so they all do have some relationship to scouting and most are outdoor-oriented. The Trails End rep at training said that they have left the prize business entirely as it wasn't a strength for them so National is in charge of prize fulfillment, something like that. The special prizes are all experiences, tickets to sports games and things like that, which I also like over more trinkets. The hokiest prize is a plastic crossbow as a bonus prize.

Back to the original question, I think it varies by local culture, so to speak. We've had boys come over from packs that did not award a single belt loop, the parents and scout didn't even know the program existed. We've had others join that had a belt full of jingling bling. My pack trends to the middle. We look to belt loops when we are doing pack-wide activities because they are easy ideas to implement across all the ranks. Awards like LNT fit in the same way. When our den leaders need a quick, small project to fill out a den meeting, rank electives are the choice. Individual scouts tend to earn electives on their own when they see a cool idea in the book. Belt loops are earned as a way to learn more about an activity they are already involved with. To me, its all good.

my 0.02..

I think sewing is an important skill however the results from most boys not interested in sewing should not be on a dress uniform. using a needle and thread for a pack or a tent is one thing insignia that is misaligned and sewn haphazardly while at a consulate discussing world citizenship another.

 

 

Perhaps you could offer to work with the family by helping the scout put together a kit of bedbug-free gear and clothing that stays in your garage or at the home of another leader or friend. Then for outings, he stops there first, stores his clothes and shoes in a tote, changes into his stored clothes and attends the outing. On return, reverse the procedure. I think it would be very fair to offer that solution or the alternative to stop participating until the problem is resolved.

His infested clothing and shoes are stored isolated in a tote, either in a garage or outside. Solar heat can only help, here! If they are in his hair, they should be easily removed by vigorous brushing. If he is 'decontaminated' before the outing, then his gear should remain clean. It's key to start with clean gear, then maintain it by avoiding cross-contamination with stuff from home. After an outing, reverse the process and send him home in the clothes he arrived in for the outing. Clean gear is stored by the leader until the next outing.

It's a PITA, but it IS an alternate idea that allows the scout to continue to participate on outings.

I live in a high bedbug infested area, like to the point that I have identified bed bugs in most of our local stores. I get the pain of dealing with them.

Our past UC was a pain in the butt. He would show up without warning, expect to talk to leaders who were actively working with scouts, and spoke ENDLESSLY about what he was doing for his own units and how trained he was. No one cared, no surprise. He was annoying and not welcomed.

Our current UC is great. He comes to our meetings on a regular basis, waits patiently to talk to someone if he needs to, will help set-up/take-down equipment or otherwise pitch in to help, praises us frequently and acknowledges that we are top-functioning units in the district. He is also a genuinely nice guy. Our DE is also great. He supports us anyway he can, we meet several times a year in person to talk both unit and council needs, and I enjoy working with him.

Compared to many of the other scouters here, I feel like my unit belongs to an alternate-BSA universe. Not complaining!

Perhaps you could offer to work with the family by helping the scout put together a kit of bedbug-free gear and clothing that stays in your garage or at the home of another leader or friend. Then for outings, he stops there first, stores his clothes and shoes in a tote, changes into his stored clothes and attends the outing. On return, reverse the procedure. I think it would be very fair to offer that solution or the alternative to stop participating until the problem is resolved.

I've done most of the recruiting for adult volunteers for our units in the last 5 years or so. My method works as follows:

 

1. Start small. Design some meetings early on that require adults to work with their own scouts. Show them that they are needed and that BSA isn't a babysitting service. If the adults are left to sit in the back of the room, they will eventually leave the room. Or, for a troop, ask the parents to stay and help with the trailer or storage unit or other small job with another leader.

 

2. Give them a few simple jobs to do, one-time responsibilities. Praise them wildly.

 

3. Offer a volunteer position in flattering tones. Make them feel needed for the unit to function. Tell them why you think they are a good fit for the job, and how much you will enjoy working with them. Matching the person to the position really is key.

 

4. Promise cookies.

 

The above method works over time, but when you need a warm body RIGHT NOW:

 

1. Beg shamelessly. Ask everyone and ask often.

 

2 Promise cookies. Take requests for favorite cookie flavor, and follow-up with a warm, fresh batch ASAP.

I've done most of the recruiting for adult volunteers for our units in the last 5 years or so. My method works as follows:

1. Start small. Design some meetings early on that require adults to work with their own scouts. Show them that they are needed and that BSA isn't a babysitting service. If the adults are left to sit in the back of the room, they will eventually leave the room. Or, for a troop, ask the parents to stay and help with the trailer or storage unit or other small job with another leader.

2. Give them a few simple jobs to do, one-time responsibilities. Praise them wildly.

3. Offer a volunteer position in flattering tones. Make them feel needed for the unit to function. Tell them why you think they are a good fit for the job, and how much you will enjoy working with them. Matching the person to the position really is key.

4. Promise cookies.

The above method works over time, but when you need a warm body RIGHT NOW:

1. Beg shamelessly. Ask everyone and ask often.

2 Promise cookies. Take requests for favorite cookie flavor, and follow-up with a warm, fresh batch ASAP.

Thought you would all get a chuckle out of this. I found it on the BSA website:

 

"There's no guarantee that you will be selected for a leadership position right away. The selection process is fairly competitive, and you may be competing with a large number of candidates for a small number of positions. But packs and councils are always grateful for volunteers and should be able to find a place where you can help out until the exact position you're interested in comes open."

 

Seriously?!?

We've used ScoutTrack, we've used ScoutManage. Looking at something new for this year. Anyone try Scout Spirit?

 

I like using a program to manage advancements and awards. I do most of the pack recordkeeping and am AC it helps me be more organized. I also like it as a scout parent, as I can see very easily and clearly what my scout needs to accomplish for awards. My den leaders also find that it is a source of ideas for new activities. We don't use a program for the troop and it's a constant question of who has earned what, whether it has been awarded,etc. I like online programs that everyone can access so there are no mysteries or surprises.

 

Getting everyone to use a program is a different issue. I've offered to teach the other leaders and for the leaders who are not at all computer-literate or who do not have computer access, I offer to enter the data for them. When they realize that their scouts are earning fewer awards than the other scouts, they generally come around. I also enter data for pack events, like achievements completed at family camp. I send out reminders of when data needs to be submitted, but I don't go chasing after it. It takes time to change a culture, I suggest patience.

 

I've not seen scoutspirit. I'll plan on taking a look today.

 

In the spirit of this thread, why are you getting away form scoutrack and scoutmanage?

ScoutManage looked promising. It looks good. It has tutorials for the most common functions. Parents/leaders can sign in using Facebook, Google, Twitter or OpenID. Admins can add their own awards, easy peasy. It's easy to look at a rank badge or belt loop and see what the requirements are and what requirements are still needed. Achievements can be added in bulk or individually. Records are kept year to year, including belt loops. Scouts who leave can be archived and records retrieved if they return. There are functions for the treasurer and unit event planning. Lots of stuff done right.

BUT...from a function point of view, it requires parents and leaders to be defined as 'users' as well as parents and leaders. The admin sets up a user for everyone who needs access or emails from the unit, setting permissions for each. This duplicates the data entry already completed when the scout is added to the system, because the admin has to enter the email address for each parent in the scout's record and the 'user' records. The system sends an automated email to the user at setup requesting that the user create an account at ScoutManage. The vast majority of our parents did not do this even with encouragement. For those parents who did, I have no idea what email address they used. I cannot export the email addresses for the users, just for the scout records. If a parent updated their own email address, they naturally assume that I can see the update when I cannot. Archive a scout? Wait, you didn't delete the parents as users, they are still getting emails. The whole 'user' thing is clunky and confusing to parents and leaders. My leaders can use the program but it doesn't help them. They hate it. And while I think the advancement reports are good and there are other reports that are nice, the report macros have two limitations. First, I can't make a list of scouts without including dens, parents, emails, and phone numbers. And second, I can't get a total number of scouts in my unit without counting them one by one on my screen or a printed report. Kind of lame.

Furthermore, after we signed with ScoutManage, the support/help guy disappeared behind ANOTHER forum that we were all suppose to use for support that required registration complete with login and password, barely answered questions and basically left all the clients high and dry. He started a FB page and seldoms appears on it, either. Add to this the sudden appearance of merchandise ads from Amazon with a kickback to the site, and I'm not impressed.

We just started with ScoutTrack last fall. Our renewal is coming up soon, also. As CC and unofficial Webelos leader again for youngest son, I have a love/hate relationship with it. Could be interested in something else or maybe the grass is just greener over there............. We primarily purchased the software for a simplified Awards database. One location instead of multiple DL emails. Yes, there have been growing pains--DL not putting them in at all or incorrectly--i.e. Religious Emblem instead of Faith Requirement. Our Awards Chair does send out an email of awards for everyone to check prior heading over to the Scout Shop.

 

We did not hold leader, parent training last year. We need to this year. And, I need some training.

 

Pros:

Love the calendar feature with the ability to add location and event details. I can also set up email reminders for events.

Entering parent and scout data was easy.

Setting up dens was easy.

Advancing dens to the next rank was simple.

24/7 access by all is easy especially over mobile phones/tablets.

I like the ability to see who is logging in and how often. I can tell if the DL has been in the system or not.

Den Progess advancement report is good. I can check and invite Webelos from the other den to our den meeting if they haven't earned a particular Activity Pin.

The price is reasonable.

Quick Entry feature is nice.

 

Cons:

There is no way to 'inactivate" or "hide" scouts that have quit as you would hide an inactivated account in Quicken. I was told by ScoutTrack owners to create a separate "Inactivated" den for these scouts. Once you delete a scout, all rank advancement is gone forever. The "Inactivated" den maintains the data which is important for the 18 mo. Webelos program--just in case scout returns.

 

My son's and his friend's belt is ridiculously full of belt loops. I don't want anymore and neither does his parent--scouts OK with this, too. For Webelos year, scouts need to re-earn some belt loops so they need to be entered in the system for rank advancement. Since I don't have access like the Awards Chair, I can't mark them as distributed. (Unless I add myself as an Awards Chair.) Therefore, I am sending the Awards Chair a separate email to tell him not to purchase belt loops for these 2 scouts.

 

The parents aren't logging in on a routine basis. In fact, most haven't logged in at all. I get several requests over the year for so-and-so's phone number and I have to remind folks to check ScoutTrack for the info.

 

I just entered summer camp belt loops, asked the Awards Chair to double check my work and he couldn't find them as entered. Right after I entered them and ran a report, the belt loops were all there on my end. His fault or mine??? So, I am using Webelos Trax as a back up. (IMHO, I like Webelos Trax better.)

 

I am not using it for Charter Renewal especially since the scout numbers are off with the Inactivated Webelos. I have my own spreadsheet with equations for that purpose. Double work, I know.

 

I hope my topic made sense but if not let me clarify. If I want to take the boys on a road trip I have to fill out all the paperwork on who's going' date=' what kind of vehicle, insurance info, etc... also does everyone going (adults) have all the required training. I've had some parents initially seem interested in helping until they hear about all the training/paperwork that's required. Thoughts???[/quote']

 

I think the training is a dual edged sword. On one hand, it allows us to recruit more scouts, with the assurance that the leaders are checked out and know the rules. On the other hand, it is offputting to new leaders. To me, the bigger problem is the loss and slow processing of records by the Council. I've submitted a MBC form 4 times, and am not approved. This is despite having been a Scout leader with the Council for 7 yrs. When asked why, they told me they have no idea why I haven't been approved.

I recently learned that the MBC apps in our district fall into a black hole created by a district volunteer who doesn't like to do paperwork. Wonderful. So much disregard for the volunteers willing to step up and the work I've put into recruiting them, not to mention the scouts looking for a counselor in our district. The person in question was just awarded a Silver Beaver which makes me cynical about any change happening soon.