Eamonn

Finding myself with a few extra minutes, I dug up "A Self -Evaluation Guide For Successful District Operation.(#34207C) Have to admit that it has been a while, in fact the last time I looked at it, I was the District Commish, and really only looked at what I thought pertained to me in that position. Anyway this time I did the Whole thing. While there are areas that need work, some more then others. When I got to page 7: District Finance, item 9 it states: " Fireside Chats are held annualy and involve representation from at least 75 percent of the units." I'm not sure, but I have been around for a long time, and feel sure that we have never had one. In fact I have no idea what it is. Please let me know if you have these Fireside Chats, and what you do or what topics are covered. Yes I know it has something to do with Finance, but why are 75% of the units needed to attend ? I do have two really great looking dogs, but no fireplace !!!

We do it by the Book. If you are not going to do it by the Book. Why bother having the Book ? If there is a problem, it is because people are not doing it by the book. If there is something that isn't working, have your Council Training Chair, bring it to the attention of the Regional and National staff. I have a real problem with the New Leader Essentials course, not being offered as a stand alone course. Our aim must be to launch these new Adults into Scouting. Not one program, all of the programs. We also have to get used to calling these Courses by the correct names ? (This message has been edited by Eamonn)

Everyone attending Wood Badge is to have completed the Training for the position that they hold. New Leader Essentials,does not in any program area constitute, complete training. The Tiger Den Leader, would need to do the specific training, before attending Wood Badge. Tenure requirements, to my mind are ok, but I have seen people that are very intense and want to get all the training that they can as fast as they can. In my own district, we have a Unit Commissioner, who many years back was involved in Scouting, for reasons that are only known to him, he was "out" for over twenty years, then came back and within the year was taking the old Wood Badge course. He had the tenure, but a few things had changed a lot, while he was away. In fact even today, he spends a lot of his time telling me that things and boys are not what they were. When he isn't telling me, he is telling the Scouts that he meets. Needless to say the Scouts don't like him and sad to say . Make fun of him. We also have a Membership Chair. who has never had any contact with Scouting, she is a superintendent of a school district. Doing a great job for our Scout district, she has done the New Leader Essentials, and District Training, never set foot on a Scout/Cubscout camp, but is signed up for the course. Her contribution to Scouting and our district is significant. Maybe with time she would learn her way around, a little better, but is doing a good job now. Tenure is going to do little to improve her performance. To my mind, we have given her the tools that she needs already, Wood Badge will add to these. One of the "Big" things that I want to do as a District Chair. Is not to ask unit people to do stuff that takes them away from the unit. In order to do this, we have to bring more and more people who may not be "Scout People" on board. They will enhance our program, and depending what position they hold have no need for tenure to get the job done. So maybe the Course Activities are not challenging enough for the Scoutmaster, who can tie knots with one hand, and is faster then a speeding Tenderfoot.Or the Den Leader who can do wondrous crafts with old editions of the Readers Digest and trains others in the outdoor skills of Cubscouting. But I would love to see the day, when we have just as many people doing things to support the program as we do people delivering it.

I'm at present employed by, UPMC Senior Living as the Assistant Director of Dietary Services. We are about the, if not the biggest provider of Assisted Living facilities in the state of Pennsylvania. While we are "Owned by the Medical Center, we are a for profit corporation, and accept no State or Federal funds. In the past I have owned and operated several restaurants. Worked as a Dietitian. Taught English History.(First "Real Job") Been a Royal Gardener. A bartender. Worked in a Hardware Store.(This paid my way through school.) We (Her that must be obeyed and self,) own a small farm in Ireland, and are looking into buying a Dairy Queen. If all goes to plan we hope to retire in ten years and move to some place warm. The Winter in PA. is starting to get much too cold.(This message has been edited by Eamonn)

At the last National Jamboree, we took along a washing machine, made out of a five gal. plastic bucket with a cover, the cover had a hole in it, to allow a plunger to move up and down, add water,Tide (Not A Lot !!) Boys had a good time. And didn't have to wear stinky uniforms. As to the rights of sweaty people. My take on this, has a lot to how they became that way. Someone laying on a beach, with an adult beverage in hand,makes me envious. A bunch of guys on a roof job, when it's really hot, make me glad that I work in the A/C. A person who always stinks makes me want to avoid them.

Tie ? Whats that? (Do you mean Neckerchief?)

Way To Go Twocubdad. You covered everything that I would have said. Horse Hockey ?? Leader Sheep ?? This is a great language.

Looked at this a few hours back. The idea was/is new to me, or so I thought. I did try to think outside the box. Then it hit me. Hey !! This isn't new. I did, done that. Yes the Ticket for the old Cub Wood Badge. Everything was focused on Training. Some of the problems were: Time. With only two years to complete the ticket, if you missed an event, you had your back against the wall, trying to make it in time.One of my Ticket items was to do Den Chief training, which we offer once a year at Pow Wow, something came up and I didn't make Pow Wow. If I hadn't managed to get the Ticket changed (Not as easy as it sounds, due to the Cubmaster moving to Germany.) My Ticket would have been un-workable. Your Ticket Should be written for you primary position. We have so many different primary positions in Scouting. A list of categories just would not work. One thing that I think that we have to be very careful about is judging other Scouters by our commitment, to the program. We have no way of knowing what is going on in the other persons life. So the Ticket has to be in the ownership of the person who wrote it. Lastly, I really would hate to play into the hands of the Anti-Wood Badge Brigade, who for years have professed, that the Ticket is just a way to get people to do more work for the District / Council. They will never take my word, that the last thing that I want is for any Unit Leader to lose the focus of leading a unit. After all that is the most important job; Delivering the program to our youth.All the rest of us:District/Council,people are only here to support the units and help the program grow by bringing in more youth. Still this did get the little gray cells working.

Where to start? First and foremost, we need to get away from the idea / notion, that any Training Course is the be all and end all of becoming a trained leader. Training is ongoing. Wood Badge is a training course, which does and to my mind has over the years served Scouting well. However some people and some councils have held it up on much too high a pedestal. Yes I have met the nice chap who has served on numerous courses,but he hasn't seen a boy or been involved in the program in any way, other then staffing this event. Hopefully, if the rules are followed he will become a relic. We can't look at Wood Badge as a stand alone Training, it is part of the whole. Most of the stuff we need to know about a specific area is part of that areas specific training. For the course that we are hosting this Fall, we have a council president, and our Scout Exec. Signed up as well as members of our Executive Board. Some of these people will never have the need to use things like a tour permit.But if we as a Training Committee have done a good job, that will have been covered in trainings that the people who will. As far as the numbers. I don't have any "real" numbers, I do know that everyone who attended the last course that we hosted four years ago, completed the ticket and is now "Beaded" That was the old Boy Scout course. Out of the six members of my den,from a Cub Scout Leader Trainer course, that I took only four of us managed to get the ticket done. One is no longer in Scouting, and one is happy now serving on the Troop Committee, of her sons Troop. I have heard that this new course will be "tweeked" in a year or two. I really don't know, what was left out. If anything. There are some things that I'm not that mad about, and areas that do need to be more then "tweeked". In fact I'm still not sure if we are trying to keep too many people happy, by offering what at times are symbolic gestures, that at best do nothing to break down barriers about program areas and at worst add to the frustrations that some adults feel, because their area is not represented, in the way that they would like.

dsteele, I was of course teasing, however the thought of having a "On Demand Raspberry Blower" is very appealing. I may have spent too much time watching Monty Python. Have you seen the National Report on FOS ? Sad to say my little council is very near the bottom of the page. This year for the first time, I'm inviting all my FOS workers to camp for dinner, when summer camp is up and running. My hope is that seeing the camp in action will spur them on to do bigger and better things next year. We always give them a small gift, but this is something that I think will work. We will see.

Just asking. Is there anyway to revoke/invalidate a Merit Badge? I really don't know. Have to admit to using the Algebra theme to :Scout earns MB.Adult is despondent regarding Scout S=MB+A-= (S- MB)?

Some Thoughts That Have Come To Me. I think that is very strange that we have had no hits, from a District Finance Chair. Our Council is really lucky that the United Way hasn't cut any of its funding. Yes I'm guilty of asking people to "Up" their donatation, but try to be polite, and understanding if /when they say no. I'm really lucky that my retirement account is only down by about 2.3%. I want Twocubdad, in my district. I really hope that the $250k that RMV, is looking for is a council goal - I'm gray but a goal like that would put me over the edge. I also think that Bob White, would do a great job of keeping me on the stright and narrow. Dsteele, in another thread is threatening to blow raspberries. Maybe next year I will do a better job of communicating with my Scout Exec. If things don't go well, the need for a talented Raspberry blower might arise. When all is said and done, we must never forget the end user. Take a trip to a day camp, watch the Cub Scouts, that extra few bucks, IS money well spent.

These Adults need a swift kick in the pants. Ok,that might be going way to far. But what they are doing is so wrong. Boy, Oh Boy, this is so wrong. My son has over 30 Merit Badges. Some were taken just because they were there: Things done at the first year of summer camp. Others were taken because he had or at that time had a real interest in that area, but just like the girls on the phone, posters on the bedroom wall these interests can change from week to week. To put a Scout on the spot like this is just so wrong. I may be wrong, but I know of no way that once a boy has earned a merit badge (Please note Earned.) that it can be revoked. This has to be taken to the Troop Committee. Treating a boy in this way does nothing for the boy and has no part in Scouting. Yes, yes it makes me so mad.

The news that you will soon be wearing your beads, is really good. I'm pleased that the "Damper" was pushed in and pulled out but the Scouter came out just the same. Maybe a wee bit better ? Jolly Well Done.

johnsned: I would hope that we would all try to make this forum "A safe Haven." Yes there will be times when we may not be as understanding as we ought to be. I would also hope that we do everything possible too allow the Safe Haven, be part of all that we do. If I had to deal with someone that for a valid reason required something or was uncomfortable doing something, I would do my upmost to put things right. However, again things don't always go as they ought. For example, a couple of Fridays ago my son was at a JLTC development weekend. I looked in to make sure everything was ok, and there they all are munching on hamburgers !! We are Roman Catholic, and hamburger munching during Lent, is a no,no. Of course O J, could have, should have, said No.

I think that I might be willing to pay money to see dsteele perform that one !! How much do you need for that FOS goal ?? I have for some weeks being "Pushing" The Full Family Of Scouting. We had a board meeting that ended on time !! So I looked in on one of these new Venture Crews. It was outstanding, really GREAT. They were discussing what their uniform was going to be. One Lad was all for a tie-dye T-shirt, they wanted details of what the "Real Uniform" was. The debate went on, till at last they all decided that they would go with a Green T-shirt, and screen print it at the next meeting. I don't watch that much TV, but there was a show some years back, I think it was the "A Team" The leader would always say before the big shoot out near the end "I love it when a plan comes together." Of course the hard part for me was to sit back and say and do nothing. Maybe these Guys, (They also set one of their own to make fliers to recruit some gals) will come up with a tie-dye jacket. Then our Assistant Scout Exec. can make that noise backwards. Oh my life is good.

I think that I might be willing to pay money to see dsteele perform that one !! How much do you need for that FOS goal ?? I have for some weeks being "Pushing" The Full Family Of Scouting. We had a board meeting that ended on time !! So I looked in on one of these new Venture Crews. It was outstanding, really GREAT. They were discussing what their uniform was going to be. One Lad was all for a tie-dye T-shirt, they wanted details of what the "Real Uniform" was. The debate went on, till at last they all decided that they would go with a Green T-shirt, and screen print it at the next meeting. I don't watch that much TV, but there was a show some years back, I think it was the "A Team" The leader would always say before the big shoot out near the end "I love it when a plan comes together." Of course the hard part for me was to sit back and say and do nothing. Maybe these Guys, (They also set one of their own to make fliers to recruit some gals) will come up with a tie-dye jacket. Then our Assistant Scout Exec. can make that noise backwards. Oh my life is good.

jborganjr: It really does sadden me, as a Training Chair. and Wood Badge Course Director to be. That things didn't work out for you. It is my understanding that Trite and hackneyed mean the same thing :Stale. While some of the material has been in use for sometime elsewhere, it is very new in Scouting. You do make a very good point about seating. This was mentioned at a meeting that I was at about a year ago, another council had done the same thing and vowed never to do it again. The term "Leader Sheep" Is new to me, and I have to admit to not knowing what it means, or understanding it. While I suppose there is little or nothing that can be done to rectify what you feel about your experience. I do hope you voiced your dissatisfaction in the course assessment. You might want to go back and take a look at the pre-course assignment; The Twenty Questions, and think really hard, as to if things have got better then they were ? Again I'm sorry that it didn't work out for you.

Eagledad: You bring up a lot of good stuff. As far as I know, while there is a recommendation that all leaders take the training, it is not mandatory,and there are no plans to make it so. Another big part of the new course is Diversity, if we who are involved with training and the course are to do a good job, we must meet the issues of diversity on every level, this will and does mean economic diversity. We need to get the adults from the less advantaged areas, on the course. This might mean that we have to offer the course at a lesser cost, or find other ways of funding the way. Just as we manage to deal with learning and physical challenges, we have to deal with any financial challenges.

I don't know very much about Girl Scouts or Girl Guides. But if I were you, I would give some serious thought to joining the BSA. We may have our faults and some of our Camp Directors may be a little odd, but anyone like who you have described, would be "Run Out Of Town"

The Coin is part of the Course, given to each participant as they leave Gilwell Field, that last time. The note book is to keep all the handouts in and your notes, which you have made with the pen you got on day one. I just added up the cost of all the odds and ends that the Guide has in it, without food,handouts etc. I got to $108.00 However, I think that we are, in some ways not doing such a great job, when we run the course at the Council Camp. Unless there is housing for the first 3 days. It gets really silly on a six day course, when half way through you have to play "Musical Camp Sites" With the participants moving from the Wall tents, in "Their Site" To the new site, where they move into back-packing tents. I would love to hear from anyone who was at one of the pilot courses. I can see how there was not a problem at Philmont or one of the National sites.

Question for 4theboys: What would happen if the Scouts, Star and above were to start teaching the skills to the Scouts of the lesser ranks ? Would this start to give more then "Lip Service" To the Boy Led Troop? Welcome to the Forum

nldscout: While I don't have all the numbers close to hand. Some of the items that drive the cost up are: $15.00 per person Video usage. This goes to National to cover the copyright for the movies. $5.00 For the coin. Approx $25.00 For a couple of T- Shirts and a cap. $25.00 Approx. The:Beads, Woggle, and Neckerchief. The participants get a 3 ring folder. The cost of recruiting is high, due to the high cost of mailings. There is also the need for some "High tech" Equipment. The Bulb on the projector costs $375.00, with a limited life span, this usage must be charged for, if not come the time to buy a new one, there is no money. Add in the cost of food, handouts, overhead and new equipment. The cost of Staffing a Wood Badge is now high, as all the staff pay this is in the Staff Guide. Our Region also requires that the Course Director attend the Conference, which costs $160.00 For a weekend, plus the cost of getting there. Then the staff will more then lightly have to buy at least some new uniform parts. It's not cheap to be on staff.

AdvanceOn: I'm pleased to say that the relationship between our two councils is really good. In fact I met with both the Course directors, last fall at Camp Alpine, and Mooly, one of this years directors, has worked at Camp Buck Run, our council Cub Scout camp for a good many years. In fact Camp Twin Echo, where you hold your W/B Training is in our council. I have heard, but as yet not officially, that due to lack of numbers one of the two courses, will not be held, We have Penns Woods Council, on our other side, they ran the 2X3 course last year at a cost of $195.00, and lost money.

Korea Scouter: Wow !!