DugNevius

we dont have any troop wide attendence policy or rule based on percentage. To do so would seem counter productive, because kids these days have a lot of things going on, from sports to other clubs, school and for some, bouncing between divorced parents. We do keep an informal attendence and have a senior scout that will touch base with scouts that seem to be missing a lot of meetings or trips, just to see how things are going.

The further in the ranks they progress and leadership roles, however, the more it is asked of them, from meetings to trips. There will be times when they cant make it of course, but the SPL and members of his "staff" must lead by example and Showing Up is the first step to anything, especially leading. I ask of my older boys to contact the SPL if they cant make a meeting, and if there is a specific role in which they were on the books to preform (such as a demo) then it is up to them to see it covered.

The higher the rank, the more we ask of them. Those boys going for eagle clearly are under stronger scrutiny then a second class scout. They should be at trips and meetings, not just there but activly participating and leading. A scout going for eagle must have an extremely good reason for not being at the eagle project of another. I say to them, "If you're not willing to go to someone elses project for however long he may need you, how can you ask others to do it for you?" never had much of a problem there.

But because there is no written policy or rule it gets difficult at times. One scout in our troop has been working toward eagle but he has more of Mailed It In rather then worked hard on it. Last year his attendence at meetings was terrible, he failed to preform his duty in a POR for the entire year, made one trip out of 10 and was going to skip out on summer camp. It just wasnt Eagle scout behavior. So the CC, myself and the advancement chair sat him down and had a long talk about what is expected and that he use the next 9 months before his 18th birthday to evaluate what he really wanted to do and if getting eagle scout was what he wanted then we wanted to see in ACTIVE.

These boys are maturing into young men and adults. They have to make decisions and there is not always a wrong answer. With all the things they are involved it they have to decide what they want to do, go to band practice or go to a scout trip and they have to learn time management which is an essential skill to learn and master.

nothing says camping better then DVDs and big screen tv!!

i agree with the last few posts. If scout spirit is to be "assumed" then why even bother mentioning it as a requirment? Scout spirit isnt JUST living the scout oath and law, its a respect for the scouting program and how/what it teaches.

Us scouters are their to guide the youth not judge them. If we are doing our jobs as SMs then this is a process of communication over several years and it should be new mystery to these scouts working on eagle about what to expect to be expected from them. If they are not showing scout spirit IN scouting, how can it be assumed they are doing so elsewhere? during these campouts and meetings and such is when we adults and their peers in the troop interact with them, more directly- in most cases- then anywhere else. By never being around it it makes it hard to make a case that the scout oath and law are being lived up to.

You cant get eagle through correspondence.

even so, a scout never around fails to meet the requirment of completing his leadership.

i agree with the last few posts. If scout spirit is to be "assumed" then why even bother mentioning it as a requirment? Scout spirit isnt JUST living the scout oath and law, its a respect for the scouting program and how/what it teaches.

Us scouters are their to guide the youth not judge them. If we are doing our jobs as SMs then this is a process of communication over several years and it should be new mystery to these scouts working on eagle about what to expect to be expected from them. If they are not showing scout spirit IN scouting, how can it be assumed they are doing so elsewhere? during these campouts and meetings and such is when we adults and their peers in the troop interact with them, more directly- in most cases- then anywhere else. By never being around it it makes it hard to make a case that the scout oath and law are being lived up to.

You cant get eagle through correspondence.

even so, a scout never around fails to meet the requirment of completing his leadership.

I feel your pain.

in my town there are 3 troops and 2 packs. It really becomes a scamble to recruit and reminds me of a pro sport draft. For a long while the Pack leader of the largest cub pack was also an assistant scoutmaster of one of the troops and conditioned the boys and their parents that the most logical step afterwards was to join her troop.

The trick was to make the troop program stand out. Our backpacking, sports and high adventure trips are a huge contrast to this other troop's dinning hall camping and trips to the virgin islands, along with our private cabin and frequency of campouts. We each have our own identity.

So when, one spring, at the blue and gold cross over we managed an upset and pulled 15 weablos from the pack to this ASM's 1, she was more than shocked and since then the momentum has shifted.

Dont give up. My advice it to keep plugging away at the pack and den level. send out Den chiefs. Invite weablos to meetings and on trips. Craft a unique and appealing program and build an identity and you will get those draft years that are overwhelming (in a good way)

we have our PLC meeting tonight. It will go as follows.

The Scoutmaster will go through some news and cancelations, talk about an incident with a broken door. Then the SPL will take over and they will map out their plans for the next month of meetings (demos-games, BOR) and talk about this months trip, our troop olympics.

Normally the Adult leadership just tells them what cant be done or what needs to be done and guides them in the right direction, but the SPL runs the PLC meeting himself and they schedule the trips on the calander and tell us where they want to go.

so a scout who does not attend campouts, summer camp, eagle project and most troop meetings shows no less scout spirit then those that attend nearly everything activly?

when a scout is ready to start serious work towards eagle (after the rank of Life) its a good idea to have a sit down with him and his parents to go over the expectations of the next 6 months or more, that way there can be little to no confusion about what they should and should not be doing.

I have found this to be important becaue there have been occasions where parents will take too agressive a role in the eagle project.

SS, i think those are pretty solid rules.

Beaver, yu have a point. If we were going as a troop, using troop transportation and equipment it could be seen as erroneous. However, if you are simply providing an alternate to the BSA to participate in activities not supported by the BSA then thats perfectly fine. We are not orginizing a troop activity. I know a few guys, troop alumni that go paintballing frequently and offering the oppurtunity to tag along to the boys in the troop.

10 years ago, several guys from our troop including myself began a club hockey program, meeting every saturday that a Troop event wasnt planned and playing hockey. Troop members made up that majority of the group but it also included many guys that were not. When guys joined the troop and showed interest in hockey they got the invitation. Yu can call it "solicitation" but i dont agree.

Safety, not convienence

"One rule I heard was no vehicles past the parking lot, on the camp roads, or in camp, only trailers. Question: how is the trailer going to get to the campsite?"

We have never had a vehicle up past the summer camp parking lot. When we get to camp we hump that gear up and at the end we bring it all back. It takes a few trips but not at all too challanging. Plus, this is why we love backpacking.(This message has been edited by DugNevius)

"Does that help prepare young people to make ethical choices over their lifetimes?"

why is that unethical? Because the BSA doesnt support Fencing, does that mean those boys in my troop are being unethical when they play for the state championship highschool team?

Our boys wanted to do a paintbal trip but its not sanctioned by the BSA. Simple solution, not go as a boyscout trip, simply as an outside activity which includes some guys in the BSA but also includes friends and family that are not.

What about fencing?

Im curious, why is Paintballing not supported by the BSA?

Hey, fellow Jersey scouter.

The Lehigh river is a great whitewater rafting trip, right after they release the damn April-May. As far as the AT, skip the NJ stretch and go up to Harriman/Bear mt state park. With 68 guys yu can split into smaller crews and take different treks to the same campsite, and the State park is a lot of fun.

Try a Bike hike. Our troop is doing that this weekend down in that giant state park by Atlantic City (I forgot the name)

There are a lot more things to do at summer camp then just go to merit badge classes and most if not all are as valuble to the scouting experience. Patrol cooking, sports, side hikes, high and low cope, ziplines, cave exploration, nature hikes...

At our camp there is a near by peak only about 4 miles away from our site that our troop likes to hike up to after dinner for a night under the stars once a week. It is suprising how few troops in camp ever go up there. They are too fixed on meritbadges to enjoy it.

ha, i have the opposite problem, getting my boys away from the female life guards at the waterfront, putting down the frisbee or putting out the campfire to go to class.

well, Kraut, i have been to Philmont twice, so i hope you dont mind if I answer your question. You COULD bring the long sleeve shirt but i wouldnt see the purpose. The only time you need a long sleeve shirt is early in the morning or at night time. Since its best to get up early before sunrise to beat the heat (we got up at 5:15 every day to get on th etrail by 6)and so the long sleeve shirt is going to be used to stay warm. A Uniform shirt only keeps you so warm, and it will probably get colder then the temperature in which the shirt can keep yu comfortable.

So what we did was we had a real light long sleeve shirt (Under Armour, Duofold or the like) for sleeping in, and everyone had our troop fleeces (which im actually wearing right this second) that worked great at keeping us warm and quick to throw on and off again when we are ready to hike at 6 am in our T-shirts and shorts.

while its true the uniform pants are better then jeans they arent the best. They are a bit warm to be wearing around here from may to mid-september and they are on the expensive side so not that cost effective. Spring thru fall backpacking has no real use for uniform outside of travel.

We are not that different from GWD. When travelling to summer camp in our bus, during the mid weekend in which we visit the local town. to church and multi-troop functions like council trips (very very rare) or public places like Gettysburg or Washington DC we were full class A's. The rest of the time its up to the scout, and because most of those are hiking trips the scout uniform really isnt appropriate.

well, just inform them that Jethro Tull was the very first grammy winner for Heavy Metal. Sad but true. Nothing says metal like a flute.

comming back from one trip i was shocked that the guys didnt know Metallica. It made me feel old.

Luckily im not so old that i cant handle some of their music. That said, My Humps is just down right stupid.(This message has been edited by DugNevius)

This is another reason why Patrol cooking at summer camp is a wonderful wonderful thing.

One thing that helps older scouts find a new sense of motivation and inspiration is to give them something to do. Ive learned that when faced with an older guy (12-13) thats drifting is to pair him up with a brand new guy to work with on advancement. Its good for a few reasons, it gives the new blood a sort of older mentor to look up to, it adds to the self esteem and purpose for the older guy and it keeps both parties busy. I have found in the past that this has turned around scouts in our troop that were constant issues, making us adults mutter in hushed tones over a pint at the local pub after meetings "That ones never going to make Eagle", but 6 months later these boys are scout of the year.

So, if yu were to place the new blood in the older patrol it will take close monitoring and guidance from adults but it could be great for both parties. It just needs to be all out on the table when talking to the older guy, "look, this is what id like to see, show me what yu are capable of."