Jump to content

    • @MrjeffI respect that you don't want to engage in a discussion on this and that you don't see yourself changing your mind.  Permit me to choose some quotes from your comment: I fully understand your perspective here.  In fact, the longer I volunteer, the more often than I make the same argument.  However, I'm commenting as I think this sets up a false choice.   Programming is the most important thing we do as Scouters.  Scouting has to be fun - without doubt.  But, I also think Scouting is about role modeling.  Scouting calls is "adult association".  How we as adults conduct ourselves is important.  Choice comments that we make from time to time are important.  If Scouts see us show up in well presented uniform, that says something.  If in the midst of a 90 minute troop meeting you make a comment to a Scout to tuck in his shirt - that is noticed.   Whether in large part or in small part, Scout leaders serve as role models.  I'm not suggesting for a minute that a leader needs to be endlessly talking about uniforms.  But, when those moments present themselves - well placed uniform comments help provide life lessons. Again - It's not that uniforming is more important than fun. It's that there will be many opportunities between the fun to help Scouts internalize why uniforming is important.  When one ignores the impact of those lessons they become missed opportunities.   I get your point here.  I'd suggest that our Scouting community is confused about what standards we should set.  Scouters, just like Scouts & parents, are confused by the dichotomy of Scouting as a "game" and as a "game with a purpose".  Are we here simply to have fun or are we here to have fun and help these kids to grow in the process?  If subscribe to the latter and believe that uniforming provides a golden opportunity to help Scouts learn some important life lessons. On "uniform police" - again, as I stated above, we need to raise standards in a way that provides some dignity.  Being that Scouter who runs around telling others how their uniform is wrong isn't the answer.  But, when placed into a position of authority, we should be setting the example and encouraging others constructively.  A unit leader or seasoned leader that discourages proper uniforming is doing those newer adult leaders a disservice.  Those newer adults leaders look to us for the example.  
    • I became a Neighborhood Commissioner and was assigned a group of Troops with veteran SMs. One troop has known as the "Battalion" due to the leadership style of the retired Marine Major who was its Scoutmaster.  i learned it was true; his voice was the only voice you heard during troop meetings. (Fortunately, its patrols met independently every week.) The DC counselled me to be helpful before any thought of being a teacher/counselor.  So updates, offers to help, information on resources - my job for months until I had some "cred' with the unit Scouters,  and then questions before statements.  "Softly, softly."   I hope i would have figured this out on my own., but I only had to follow his advice.  It was an interesting two years. My relative youth was a problem to overcome.  I am not sure if being the SM of a strong troop helped or hindered. (At least T43 was known not to "poach" from other troops.). You already are sensitive too the "fine line."  👍  
    • For those scouts and their families who have completed the Common App for college admission, have  you mentioned  your scouting experience and if so in what sections Activities, Questions, Supplemental,...?
    • Like I clearly stated, I have my own opinion and if its offensive or off-putting to you, I dont care. I made no assumptions about issues like character or values. I did say THAT IF YOU ARE THAT FOCUSED ON THE UNIFORM perhaps you should focus on the person and not his CLOTHES. I would also suggest that I am very aware of proper uniformity after having spent many years in the United States Marine Corps, and as a senior law enforcement.  Covers or hats were mandatory regardless of the emergence of a situation, footwear and undergarments were regulated. I grew up in a scouting world where socks and LEATHER SHOES WERE REQUIRED, as were necherchief and slide. During my first Wood Badge course your shirt was devoid of insignia, shorts and knee socks were required and a detailed uniform inspection was conducted every morning.   As far as I can tell this rigidity had little or no effect on my value,  character, work ethic, or overall view of humanity. I heard a Wood Badge scoutmaster make the statement that a hand made woggle is only for use by Wooc Badge participants; and I heard an adult tell a scout that they can't wear a handmade woggle as it is only for use by Wood Badgers. Well when I had to wear shorts and knee socks it was clearly explained that everything we did, including wiggles was to be applied to our units. Somewhere the entire focused has shifted from having a grand time to regulation, oversize, teaching lifes lessons, and control.  Even the mission statement fails to mention "fun".  Perhaps that is why our membership is down and young people would rather do something else.  My training, education, and experience has led me to believe that "if it ain't fun, the kids wont do it".  So, continue to focuse on the clothes and lesson teaching if you want to; but I will continue to focus on the youth and their desire to have good clean fun.  As I previously stated, THIS IS MY OPINION AND NO AMOUNT OF ELOQUENT DIALOGUE IS GOING TO CHANGE IT.  Your opinion is important even if I dont agree with it and I would respectfully suggest that you do what you do, and mind your own opinion without attempting to change the important opinions of others.  Unit leaders are responsible for the appearance of their unit and adults are responsible for their own appearance.  And since I agree that there are no real uniform or patch police no one has the responsibility of correcting or criticizing another's choice in what they put on their shirt. If someone feels that it is their duty to do so they assume the position of the mythical uniform police.        
    • I've enduring abuse in the name of religion as a youth, and find some of the comments above flip, and almost offensive.  Legal or illegal abuse, those who embrace such behavior have a perverted sense of entitlement.  I might would be ok with this person attending events, but hell no on leadership. The CO, District Exec, and the Council exec, should be made aware of your concerns.  The CO should have their own rules regarding child safety.  CO rules should be reviewed with the key three, and CO board of directors or Pastor.  The CO can do what the heck they want with this guy, and the BSA has no say so in the matter.  If you are still uncomfortable, then push it up the ladder with your DE or CE Leave the commissioner corp out of this.  This is not their fight.
  • Who's Online (See full list)