How to get rid of the SM

[Fat Old Guy 11]

Shell,

 

Maybe we should sit down and write a book with generic descriptions of poorly run troops.

 

The problem with the old SM wasn't that he was a martinet, the problem was that he thought that rules were silly. Advancement was rubber stamped. Troop meetings were merit badge sessions with the blue card getting signed if you just sat there. A martinet might have been the better option, at least the Scouts would have learned to listen.

 

LauraT7 is right, it is tougher to teach the boys to do things than it is to do it yourself. Just think about trying to get your kids to do the dishes or clean the bathroom.

 

In the latest issue of Scouting magazine, there was a comment that it takes boys four times longer to plan something than it take adults. I can believe that because we have 40 or so years of experience and can draw on that. All too often, we expect the boys to plan the year's activities in an hour because we know that we could do it that way.

 

As they said in the song, "Life in the fastlane . . ."

[MrsSmith 10]

Over the weekend I managed to borrow from a neighbor a copy of a SM handbook and a Committee Members' Handbook. Very interesting reading. It confirms what I knew intuitively and from reading the posts on this website. This troop is a hobby for the men. Its not really about training boys to be leaders. Lots of what has been written describes our situation; actually a combo of FOG and Laura; nobody seems to have any idea what is happening from one meeting to the next, and then suddenly one of the men announces that there will be a camping trip in two weeks and the itinerary is X. SM attends NOTHING the boys do, boys get merit badges for just showing up, new scouts are deprived of a rank advancement because their patrol leader (SMs son) is MIA. I am reluctant to spell out details; they are so ridiculous that anyone familiar with the troop could probably identify it.

 

It sounds like many troops are either in disarray, just coming out of disarray, or heading for disarray. Maybe this is the natural progression (or degeneration).

[LauraT7 13]

I guess the real question becomes then - is it just you that is unhappy with the troop as it is? or are there other like-minded parents/boys that want changes made?

 

I have seen troops like this that are very happy to STAY that way. there are parents who are very happy to send their boys off with the 'big boys club' and they never bother their heads about what scouting REALLY is supposed to be. If the troop has a strong group leading and you don't want to lead yourself, or don't have a group of like-minded people with you - then you'd be hitting your head against a brick wall trying to change everyone else.

 

Your choice then is to let your son stay with his friends there and try to get him as many opportunities as you can. If you want to try and change the troop - it's going to take more than one person & alot of work to get the job done. Not to discourage you from trying - but there are far more parents who are willing to let someone ELSE do the work with their kids, than those who are willing to WORK for ALL the boys.

 

your other choice is to convince your son to move to another troop - preferably, a better one. this is hard, too -because all the boys see at this point is their friends and they don't want to leave them - they don't see the lack of program or realize (or care, now) what they are missing until they get more mature. And once they start realizing (if ever) what they are missing out on - they are even more entwined with their friends in the stagnant troop, and STILL don't want to leave.

[Fat Old Guy 11]

"I have seen troops like this that are very happy to STAY that way. there are parents who are very happy to send their boys off with the 'big boys club' and they never bother their heads about what scouting REALLY is supposed to be."

 

As they say, "ignorance is bliss."

 

If you enrolled your son in the local baseball clinic and found that they were teaching the boys that the pitcher didn't have to pitch from the mound, would you accept it?

 

A game should be played by the rules, even if we think that those rules are silly (for one, I think that the balk rule is silly but I called them).

[MrsSmith 10]

I have been following the threads in "Committee Membership" and "Utopian". Its interesting that there are so many differences of opinion regarding topics one would think would be as clear as upon which arm one places the troop numbers. BSA has been doing this for 96 years; can there be any subject that hasn't been examined from every angle? Haven't all of the wrinkles been ironed out? It seems impossible a troop like ours could develop, if one keeps in mind the 3 aims and 8 methods of Scouting (trying to impress you with my vast store of BSA knowledge)and reads the material which lays it all out step by step.

 

I realize there are 4 choices: 1)Try and start a Mutiny on the Bounty; find a Fletcher Christian(yes there are other disgruntled parents) and set Captain Bligh and his cronies (yes there are some who like it this way and some who are oblivious) adrift (with a map, compass and trailmix); 2)Head for greener pastures(hopefully) 3) Silence. Option 4, asking the SM to explain himself, etc etc is probably just a prologue to mutiny or hitting the road. But thanks for making the choices clear and educating me on the procedures.

 

I will continue to read, listen and learn.

[Fat Old Guy 11]

" BSA has been doing this for 96 years; can there be any subject that hasn't been examined from every angle? Haven't all of the wrinkles been ironed out?"

 

The wrinkles have been ironed out for the most part, the problem is that people keep crumpling the program up.

 

One problem is that there is limited oversight and no incentive to follow the program. If your son's soccer coach was teaching his players to pick up the ball and run with it, they'd have immediate feedback about how wrong that was at their first game. The referees in Scouting don't carry whistles and don't have red and yellow cards to show. Add in that most parents worry about the quality of the soccer program but as long as their son is advancing and going camping, they don't care about the quality of Scouting.

 

Maybe Scouting could use a system of oversight with penalties for units that have turned into "The Ol' Boys Camping Club," "The East Podunk Eagle Mill," or "Baby Sitters of America."

 

[MrsSmith 10]

I agree. A program which lends its very visible name to small groups should have a mechanism of oversight. But maybe that's what new recruits are. Maybe the well meaning people who suggest not stirring up trouble unwittingly perpetuate the charade.

 

BTW, you said Bob White was too by the book and he accuses you of disparaging scouting, but you sound to me like the two of you think alike. May I ask, what is your interest in scouting?

[Fat Old Guy 11]

"May I ask, what is your interest in scouting?"

 

My son is a Boy Scout and I am a committee member.

 

The big difference between Bobo and myself is that I don't believe that everything as it stands today is the best that it could be. I believe in following rules but I don't believe that you have to be happy about it. I pay my taxes but I don't enjoy it. :-)

 

[MrsSmith 10]

So noted. Thanks.

[EagleInKY 14]

Mrs. Smith, These have been some great threads and I encourage you to continue to learn from them - as I do. I'm nearing my 20 year veteran status, but still seek to learn and improve the program.

 

Why is there so much disagreement? Simply put, we're human. We've all been taught different things. We've been trained by Scouters with different philosophies or understandings. And, the rules have changed over the years, and not everyone has changed with them. For example, I grew up in a great troop. We always had around 30 boys and had a couple of Eagles every year. We went on a high adventure trip every other year (I did three trips to Philmont as a scout/young adult). However, even that troop, as great as it was, did not follow the program to perfection. Consequently, I and other scouts from it, may not be leading strictly according to the book in our own units.

 

Can a unit be doing a great job and not follow the methods perfectly? Sure they can. Would a unit be even better if it followed all eight methods? It probably would.

 

Your unit may only be following a couple of the methods and blowing off the others. That may be the primary problem you are facing. On the other hand, I've seen units over-emphasizing some of the methods (e.g. the recent thread regarding the SM who sent boys home if they weren't in uniform, or a troop that I'm aware of where they have let boys lead the program right into the ground). As leaders, we should all strive to follow the aims & methods, realizing that perfect adherence is a goal, not a destination.

 

I agree with FOG on this, the rules are there and I follow them to the best of my and my unit's ability. However, I always look for improvements, both to the rules and to how I can follow them.

[MrsSmith 10]

EagleInKY " the rules have changed over the years..."

For better or worse? But maybe that's a different thread.