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JillKB

Required Minimum Popcorn Sales?

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jc2008 wrote: How does our Council still give us camp cards to sell if no Scout Accounts?

 

If you read the BSA presentation on camp cards found at:

http://www.scouting.org/filestore/financeimpact/pdf/Camp_Card_Presentation-National_Meeting.pdf

 

You will see this section:

 

Private Benefit Considerations

 

Councils should make sure that any sales materials, instructions, and support information do not make reference to individual scouts earning money for their own participation in Scouting activities.

 

When the council is remitting proceeds, from any sale, back to units, provide guidance on distribution of funds. Encourage units to develop fund distribution plans that include other criteria than sale of items.

 

These might include:

1. Participation in the camp card sale

2. Participation in the program

3. Leadership

4. Scout Spirit

5. Advancement

 

A portion of the proceeds from any sale or activity should be set aside for general unit expenses and could include funds used for assistance to members with financial need.

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The lesson taught with individual scout accounts is: You fundraise for the benefit of yourself.

 

By using the tax-exempt status of your CO, one is in fact drawing that into question. What's to say a parent makes a $1000 donation designated "donation" to the troop for their son so he can go to Philmont? They get a tax write-off and the money stays in the family. That's money laundering.

 

If boys wish to have individual scout accounts, go down to the bank and open an account. That way, 100% of the proceeds for their walk shoveling, lawn mowing, garden tilling, paper route activities goes right into their accounts! And not only that, it is all above board legal! I find nothing wrong with the sales pitch to the prospective customer, "I am a Boy Scout raising money so I can go to summer camp. Do you need your lawn mowed?" He is making it very clear that the proceeds are going to him and not to his troop. Troop fundraising money goes to the troop. That's why they call it a troop fundraiser and people contribute under that expectation.

 

Stosh

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I posted elsewhere on this. I'm a little surprised at the lack of clarity in this thread on BSA policy, because it's posted pretty openly on their web site:

http://www.scouting.org/filestore/fi..._BSA_Units.pdf

 

If you look at the last page of that, you'll see that individual scout accounts are pretty clearly prohibited. I admit it stinks but it's difficult for me to look my Webelos in the face when reviewing the Citizenship badge and tell them that as law-abiding citizens we all need to follow the law and pay our taxes - and then turn around and skirt IRS regulations.

 

Has this conflict come up with any of you in dealing with your Councils/Districts? Any exceptions?

The original posts on this thread are 8 years old. Not sure if BSA's policy on ISA's was in effect back then.

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In our Council, Camp Cards are 50% Council, 50% Unit. Therefore, 50% of the revenue is going towards Scouting (Council), regardless of anything else. If the Unit gives 100% of the money to the now banned ISA, you might have a substantial problem. If some of the money (even if Camp Costs), is going towards Troop costs (i.e. Camp costs $250 and you charge $300/Scout to cover food, gas, etc., whatever), then 60% of the money is going to Scouting, 40% to individual benefit, probably fair as far as "substantially" is concerned.

 

We charge annual dues/Scout, we do NOT charge a separate re-charter fee.

Next year, we are charging a re-charter fee of $37 to cover National Dues + Boys Life. Anyone who sells $150 in popcorn (netting $50 to the Pack) will have their re-charter fee waived.

 

With the national price increase, we either have to raise dues, fundraise more, or both. This seems like a good way to involve them.

 

We're also creating a voluntary position in the Pack, Friends of Pack 18 Committee, tasked with raising/donating each year. This is a way for some of our well-to-do families that don't want to volunteer (time to valuable/rare/whatever) to "contribute" financially. We'll see how it works.

 

We have some boys whose families can't pay dues, we write it off as Campership, no muss-no fuss, we do ask them to try to participate in the fundraisers.

 

We have some fairly well off families, and many more in the community. We believe that the nature of scouting, making due with inadequate funds/equipment, has discouraged participation from many families because we don't look sharp at our recruiting/public events. Our theory is that investing some resources in higher quality stuff (like a fancy derby track, etc) will help with recruiting, and letting the well off families kick in a little more will help.

 

Selling $150/popcorn takes about an hour in our neck of the woods, if you won't take your son out so he can earn prizes, you can pay to re-charter. We're still the cheapest after-school program by far.

 

We have a handful of families that are doing all the work, all the fundraising, and killing themselves. I want to give other families a way to participate, and for many of them, cutting a check for $250 or $500 may be less painful than fundraising, and would let us be a top-notch organization.

 

What do others think?

 

I think that a minimum is not scout-like, but we've set goals. This year it was $100/scout in Popcorn (next year it will be $150/scout to cover re-charter). At Blue and Gold, we asked for $3/person donations, next year we're going to ask our Friends of Pack 18 "to underwrite it" with their donations.

 

When I took over as Committee Chair, we hadn't fundraised in over a year, so we were 100% dues-financed. Year 1, added Camp Cards, Year 2, Popcorn/Camp Cards. We're now about 50% dues-financed. I want to run a better program.

 

Some things are small but relevant. We don't own Pack Propane Tanks, which means getting a bunch of people to fill their tanks and bring them, which adds work to the leaders. I'm trying to stop burning out the leaders with grunt work to save a few dollars, when I could get a few families (basically the Doctor/Lawyer families) to write small checks and make this less aggravating.

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I'm fairly sure a Pack/Troop can't directly solicit funds (ask for direct donations) for their program. One of the Packs around here got flack for putting a paypal "Donations" link on their webpage.

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I'm fairly sure a Pack/Troop can't directly solicit funds (ask for direct donations) for their program. One of the Packs around here got flack for putting a paypal "Donations" link on their webpage.
So what? Just don't click the link! Suck it up, I've given directly to units over the years and I prefer that all kids get a chance to go to summer camp, not just the kid that showed up at the door.

 

Stosh

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We got flack for it a few years back, link off the site. That's why it's a support role, and it will be to support the CO's Youth Scouting Program.

 

We'll word it carefully, it'll be to sponsor the Blue and Gold Banquet, not soliciting donations. :)

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I'm fairly sure a Pack/Troop can't directly solicit funds (ask for direct donations) for their program. One of the Packs around here got flack for putting a paypal "Donations" link on their webpage.
Giving donations to a Pack or a Troop is just fine, and thank you for that, and units can accept those donations gladly. But going out and asking for them, by way of putting up a "donations" link, is a no-no.

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Our pack sells popcorn and also wreaths/grave blankets/garland from a local farmer. We get a higher margin on the greenery, of course. We set a minimum sales target of something like $260. If a scout doesn't want to sell, the buyout is $130. That is pretty reasonable to fund a whole year of scouting, far cheaper than any sport. Some families do the buyout every year, and some sell every year. We have no trouble funding our pack with this method.

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