cyphertext

37 minutes ago, EmberMike said:

I'd love to know specifically how "the entire experience" would change. Can you explain that?

Teenage boys act very different when they are around an all male group and a coed group.  The social interactions of the group are different.  I've witnessed this with activities between Scouts and JROTC with my son.  Zip lining with an all male troop is different than zip lining with JROTC.  While the activity is the same, the behavior and mannerisms of the boys are very different.

18 minutes ago, WisconsinMomma said:

Do you support females in Scouting, and do you support female Scout leaders? 

In the end it doesn't matter all that much, because the BSA does.  Just try not to contradict them too much in your interactions with the youth, especially because the youth members may have their own viewpoints that differ from yours. 

I'll take a shot at this one...  

Do I support females in Scouting?  Yes, I do...  in a separate organization and a different program from the boys.

Do I support female Scout leaders?  Again, yes I do...  in a separate organization from the boys.

You state that the youth members may have their own viewpoints that differ... Well, did anyone ask them?  Did national send out a poll to all registered Boy Scouts and allow them to have a say?  I know what my own son and his patrol think about the idea.  They don't like it.  They enjoyed those campouts with just the guys... even though he has aged out, he still enjoys camping and hanging out with his old patrol mates.  There is a special bond between those boys that does not exist between my son and his other friends from his coed activities.

1 hour ago, cocomax said:

The real question is when the girls join the troops and we go co-ed, will the boys stick around?  Will the boys still find it fun?  As leaders we can do everything right, but if the boys are not having fun they will leave.   I don't talk to the boys in our troop about the girls joining, but they know from the news and guys at school teasing them about it and I have overheard them talking about it and they all have decided to walk away if it happens.  My other question is why do the boys feel this way?  I honestly do not know.  Are most boys fine with girls joining and the boys in our troop just strange, I don't know.

I don't think the boys in your troop are strange.  In this area, I would not be surprised to see boys opt out of the program when the girls are added.  Boy Scouts isn't exactly seen as the "cool" thing to do by today's youth.  Adding females to the program does not help combat the image that Boy Scouts has in this area of being made up of "weak" and "nerdy" kids.

My son earned Eagle and has aged out of the program, but he is not happy with where it is going.  I doubt his troop will become co-ed...  females were allowed to serve committee positions only, and were not allowed on camp outs.  He moved from a troop that allowed females to be Scout leaders and he preferred the all male leadership.

31 minutes ago, ItsBrian said:

I think we should start a new thread about nobody answering their texts, emails, etc. 

I made this thread to share a system that has proven to work for me.

That's the thing with discussion forums... not everyone will share your opinion.  I have seen the app work as well.  My son and I have both used it with success, but others have had different experiences with it.  You shared your experience, others are sharing theirs.

6 minutes ago, Pselb said:

  My son IS someone else.  It's his program, not mine.  I support his interest in the program, not the program itself.  He doesn't seem to be having any issues and is excited to go back each time without a hassle.  Life is good.  If asked for my expertise and I am available, I will offer what I have.  So far those kinds of requests have not been forthcoming from the den leaders.  Instead they want me to BE a leader.  I haven't got the time to make that kind of commitment.  I'm from the old philosophy of "If it ain't broke, don't fix it."  My son is happy which means to him and HIS program, it ain't broken, and my meddling is not warranted.  You need to couple this with the discussion you have been having concerning helicopter parents.  Is this "involvement" the training ground for future helicopter parents when the boy goes on to Boy Scouts.  Next year my son will be in Webelos.  I have no idea whether or not there will be an increase or decrease expectation coming my way at that point.  I would think it would be ideally a decrease in expectations in light of what others on this thread are calling "boy led" down the road in Boy Scouts.

No, the request for your involvement does not diminish in Webelos, or when he transfers to Boy Scouts.  Even with being boy led, adults are still needed with Boy Scouts.  You need a Scout Master, Assistant Scout Master, Merit Badge Counselors, Committee Chair, Treasurer, Committee members, additional drivers to get boys to camp...  lots of adult roles, many more than in Cub Scouts.

Helicopter parenting and volunteering are two different things.  A volunteer fills his role as described.  He lets the boys plan, lead, and even fail.  For example, for a Cub Scout campout, it is perfectly acceptable and expected that a parent would do the meal planning.  The cub may help, but the parent has the final say and ensures that there is enough food for everyone.  In Boy Scouts, the patrol plans the meal and has one boy, the grubmaster, responsible for getting the food.  If the patrol plans hamburgers for dinner, and the grubmaster buys 1/2 pound of meat for 8 boys, well those boys may be hungry.  As a parent, I may see this...  a helicopter parent would correct it, a Scouter will let it go and let the boys learn from it.

18 minutes ago, mashmaster said:

It is a great app for outward bound communication, not bidirectional.  

True...   more for top down type communications, such as meeting reminders...

5 minutes ago, qwazse said:

Because @Pselb might not have been around when the Law of the Pack was extant, I'll pitch in and make his argument.

The full line read "The Cub Scout helps the pack go."

There was no mention of parents in The Law of the Pack. Except, when the parent is Akela, but that was to emphasize that the behavior that the Cubs were learning also applied at home, where their "Pack" was their family.

True, but it also says "The pack helps the Cub Scout grow"... and that pack is a lot more than just the kids.  The point is, unlike Boy Scouts, Cub Scouts is not boy led and is not intended to be.  It shouldn't be his son's program, or some one else's program...

1 hour ago, Pale Horse said:

Honestly, it would be incredibly easy to put forth a little effort to "make the pack go."

They did away with the Pack Law and now use the Scout Oath and Law...  I liked it better the old way!

@Pselb You keep referring to Cub Scouts as "someone else's program".  Your son is in it, so it is his program, and since he is under 10, by default, it is your program too.  Like others have said, maybe you don't need to be the den leader, but you definitely have something to add to the program.  

By the way, my wife is also a teacher.  Although she wasn't the den leader, she saw the chaos of our first couple of meetings and helped me with planning the meetings to keep the kids engaged and under control...  She was my coach behind the scenes.  She was not a registered volunteer, but she added greatly to "my" program and it benefited all the boys, not just my own.  

She also has to run her own copies for her tests... no magically appearing in her box in this district. 

Maybe your son's den leader has the meetings well under control and doesn't need your help there, but could use help with planning an activity...  not asking you to create the activity, but you might suggest "Hey, the state park has this great program and it would be a great activity for the outdoor requirement.  I can email you the info on it."  Just sharing your experience or knowledge with the den leader may help as he is trying to find activities and things for the boys to do.  

Yes, Remind 101 is a great app.  My son's JROTC unit used it.  Great for sending info to a large group.

3 hours ago, SpEdScouter said:

Well it was something I have been thinking about, since the scout troops already have tents (and I've seen some pretty great ones) why cant we step it up a bit and stay in a pop up? Plus the scouts already can travel on buses and stay in hotels. Especially when the weather is really bad and having an enclosed area to cook and bringing your bathroom along when the campgrounds toilets are far away and nasty. I'm not talking those big class C motorhomes. Just maybe a popup or a basic trailer.

 

And really when it comes down to it, most of scout "camping" is really car camping anyways.

How big is your troop?  If you have more than a handful of boys, this wouldn't be very practical at all...  Let's say you have 25 boys in your troop... that would be 4 to 5 trailers for just the boys!  Where would you store these?  Who would pull them to camp outs?  Where would the funds to purchase them come from?  

And as far as car camping, that really does depend upon your troop.  The troop my son was in did quite a bit of backpacking.  

We had our Scouts submit 5 targets that met the score.  They got to shoot 5 groups of 5, and if they only had 2 targets that qualified, they could shoot again later after everyone else who wanted to shoot got a turn.  At the end of the campout, if they could show us 5 targets that met the scoring requirements, we signed them off.

The rifles we used had iron sights, however I don't see that optics are banned in the requirements.  If I remember correctly, when I took the NRA course, we were restricted to iron sights only.

You may use sand bags or some other means to support the rifle, and I recommend doing that.

I am certified for RSO, rifle, shotgun, and pistol instructor.

I'm sure I will become active again at some point... probably as a merit badge counselor. 

Thanks for all the warm welcomes!

No, I don't.  I've gone back to school myself, so I don't have that "one hour a week" right now. 

Hello All!

Long time listener, first time caller here!  Been lurking for a long time...  long enough for my son to age out!    But I still enjoy reading here and seeing what is going on with Scouting.

I thought I would share about my son's journey to Eagle.  My son was a 17yr and 11 month type of Eagle.  His attendance with the troop started to decline during high school.  His freshman and sophomore years, he was on the wrestling team with meets on Saturdays during the fall, so he missed some camp outs.  But he participated in the Spring.  He was also involved with Junior ROTC at his high school.  His Junior year, he was Spirit Team commander for his AFJROTC unit, which meant on Friday nights, he had to attend the school football games.  Again, this took him out of participation in the Fall.  So yes, he was missing on many camp outs as he got into high school.

However, let me tell you about the positives.  He was a member of OA.  He attended Summer Camp most years.  He was awarded the Grand Slam, attending all four high adventure bases.  He also attended the 2013 Jamboree.  He served as Troop Guide with his troop for two terms at the request of his Scoutmaster (troop guides were assigned as the patrol leader for the first year patrols to teach them scouting skills in his troop), as well as patrol leader, and ASPL.  I would say he had a great Scouting experience!

He was a fast burner when he first joined a troop, but he started to suffer burnout.  He was well on his way to being an Eagle at 13.  His troop focused a lot on starting merit badges, but offered very little in adventure...  I can't tell you how many incomplete badges he had.  We changed troops to one that focused on adventure, and that was the best thing we could have done.  I told him to not worry about merit badges and advancement, just have fun... there will be time for advancement.