WVCubDad

I'm in a similar position to Two Sirius, my CM is planning on stepping down in a year when his youngest crosses over. He suggested that I consider stepping up to CM next year with him as the Assistant. I've been mulling it over, currently I'm one of three Tiger Den Leaders and I am having a lot of fun with that.

So this morning I asked my son over breakfast about this (we'd been discussing last night's pack meeting and talking about PWD, etc.) His comment was that he would rather have me be his Wolf DL, Bear DL and Webelos DL than become the CM. Of course he restated his desire to quit after he finished Webelos because he doesn't want to be a "real Eagle Scout." I hid a smile as I acknowledged his statement, but I have a feeling he'll cross over and have a great time. If he makes Eagle, even better, but it will be his decision not mine.

Based on my son's desire for me to continue as his DL I will probably pass on the CM position this time around, gain some more experience to include day camps, etc. and then offer to step up when he becomes a Bear and realizes that it's not always fun having Dad around.

Good luck with your decision Two Sirius, I think there have been some great points made here, especially the one about only being the CM and nothing else. I wouldn't want to have to juggle a Den and the Pack, both will suffer.

John

Hi Paul,

I think the alumni night is a great idea. Since your CO is a church, are there former Scouts (not necessarily alums, but that would be great) who might be interested in getting back into Scouting and helping their pack?

I currently am a member at a church with a dormant pack and I'm a Tiger Den Leader in a very strong Pack just two blocks away chartered with a church in the same denomination. Long story short, the churches were on different sides during the Civil War and we've also got 4 other UMC churches in the downtown area. I would love to see my church's Pack come alive again, but I don't want to compete with my current Pack and I am not sure that my church would support us the way the other one does. We recently sold our Scout Hall and would have to share a lot of space with other church users, find a good night to hold meetings, etc. It's not impossible, but there's a lot more there than I am willing to do as a first year Scouter. I would like to get some experience in my current Pack and then when my son ages up to Scouts, perhaps get my church's pack going again.

Good luck with your situation. I hope it works out and you can keep your Pack alive.

John

Thanks for the Hancock Fabrics tip. I checked for Cub fabric and found a neat Allover Fleece design. 2 yards are on the way to be made into a nice camping blanket for our son.

John

BTW on my list is the Scout Expedition Hat.

We just got our first issues of BL and Scouting yesterday after having filled out apps in May (for my son), July (for me) and September (replacement app for my son). We apparently had several misplaced apps because I've had other Tiger parents ask me about when they would get their magazines. Hopefully they'll tell me at next week's pack meeting that they've started recieving it.

I was somewhat disappointed with the quality of BL, remembering what I used to get in the mid to late 70's. Still it is nice for my son to have a magazine that he doesn't have to share with his sister, although he didn't seem too interested in it. Might be because his favorite aunt was visiting for Thanksgiving.

John

Tiger Den Leader

Pack 13

I try to set the example for my entire pack, in fact the other den leaders made some comments in jest about me showing them up by wearing a complete uniform to every meeting. Besides myself, only the CM and ACM wear a uniform of sorts - shirts usually. The boys are usually uniformed from the waist up.

My wife and kids ran into last year's Tiger den leader at the store who made a comment about not even having a uniform and Karen said, "That's just John's way, he'll wear the uniform or not do it at all." I guess after 13 years she knows me.

That being said, I still couldn't get her to pony up the money for a pair of cub scout pants for our Tiger. Guess what will be under the tree from Santa in a few weeks? Now to get him to keep his shirt tucked in....

John

Tiger Den Leader

Pack 13

AnEagle,

As to water, I sweat like crazy even in freezing weather. I know that I need to keep hydrated and therefore I carry at least 3 quarts of water - 1 GI 2qt bladder canteen and one 1qt canteen or 1 liter bottle. Since most of my outdoors experience was courtesy of Uncle Sam, I'm trying to get away from carrying a lot of my old military gear and move more into the civillian world.

Also the camping I'm doing now is more family/Cub camping and we don't get too far from water sources. In fact in my camping supplies tub there is now a collapsable 5 gallon water jug - definitely not practical when hiking but great in a campsite.

I like the 2 qt canteen because you can hook a shoulder strap on it, clip on a few accessory pouches for first aid, compass, etc. through it over your shoulder and walk away.

Definite ditto to getting copies of the merit badge books, I did that after our first Pack overnighter and refreshed myself on a lot of stuff I'd forgotten. Pay attention to the 10 essentials list, it's been around in one form or another for many, many years and is based on experience.

My personal hydration plan is that every time I stop (which in an out of shape condition, is too often) I drink a couple mouthfuls of water and make my son do the same. As they used to tell us in jump school - "Beat the heat--Drink Water!!!" It works well in the winter too.

John

Tiger Den Leader

Pack 13

Potomac District

Shenandoah Area Council

2 weekends ago we had our fall pack overnighter. It was colder than normal (40's overnight) and only 55 during the day and it rained off and on during Saturday and overnight. However the next morning when I unzipped the tent, I was treated to a very nice sight of the full moon setting in the west over the mountain ridge and the beginnings of a clear blue sky. I took a picture.

My son, a Tiger, didn't mind the rain, we even went fishing in it - caught plenty! Some of the families bailed, one had a bona fide problem with a leaky tent, the others were concerned with the health of their boys. I told one Mom that she didn't have to pitch her tent, they could stay for the day and see how it went. They ended up leaving in the afternoon.

This coming weekend one of the local troops is sponsoring a Bring a Buddy Camp for Scouts (Fri to Sun) and Cubs (Sat to Sun) as a recruiting effort. Long range forecast is calling for a few showers Saturday and Sunday with daytime highs of 49 to 51 and nighttime temps of 37 and 41 respectively. Currently there are only 10 Cubs and Parents signed up to go, but we'll dress in layers, change clothes before we slip into the bags and I'm bringing my poncho liner again to wrap over my son and I in the tent.

My only concern is that this is my first camping experience as the leader in charge and I want it to be a good one for all concerned. Thank goodness I got all the leader training requirements done this weekend, including BALOO. I just need to get all the pack gear together, finalize the menu and decide if we're taking the portable campfire washtub or not.

The activities that are planned include a belt loop midway - Map & Compass, Astronomy, Fishing and Ultimate. There's also a pumpkin painting contest, trick or treating through the other troops and packs as well as a campfire program and Sunday worship service. As long as there isn't a named hike, my son will be happy. He really dislikes hiking.

John

SSSCout -

Perchance Western MD or close to the WV Eastern Panhandle?

I thought I saw a small sign by the side of Route 9 heading west to Hedgesville advertising an SCA event a few months back. I'll have to Google...

John

As a lad many, many years ago in a state far, far away a distinguished silver-haired gentleman took the stage to lecture the Cadet Corps (approximately 50 boys from 4th grade to 8th). These lectures were after the normal school day between 3-5 pm, usually on a Monday and given in the school auditorium. They were commonly known as "Formation". At the time I thought it meant that the cadets formed up to hear our Commandant speak, now I know that it meant something much, much different.

"Character," Major Ormsby intoned, "is the sum total of what you are."

I'm certain there was much more that he said, but that is what has remained with me through the years.

There are other sayings such as "Command the wind!" - i.e. don't slouch and pull yourself into your coat, shove your hands into you pockets and turn your back to the wind. Stand tall, face the wind and don't cower. Tough to do on a cold winter day in Western New York, but worth it to hear him commend you for doing it.

Major Louis J. Ormsby died earlier this year. My mother sent me the obituary from the local paper. Unfortunately while it gave a good thumbnail sketch of his life, it couldn't begin to measure the enormous impact he had on hundreds of boys who were cadets at Stella Niagara during his 50 year teaching career. Boys from WNY, Mexico, Canada and many other locations.

I was fortunate to be able to visit Major Ormsby last year at the nursing home he was staying in. Occupying the place of honor on his dresser was a framed school crest above crossed infantry rifles bearing the letters SN. The motto on the crest is "Fortes en Fides", strength in faith. The Major exemplified that and his definition of character. I am truly thankful and humbled that he provide such a good example.

There are many more stories I could tell, but those are for another time.

Thank You Sir!

John

Jeff,

We did that as well Tuesday night. The Tigers were so energized to pick up leaves on the hike that we had plenty for the boys that didn't go camping to participate.

The one thing that I couldn't do is find thin enough paper to get really good rubbings. I was surprised that Wal-Mart didn't have tracing paper or really thin writing paper, but then I guess I shouldn't have waited until an hour before the meeting to get my supplies!

With the exception of my son who had an oak leaf that wouldn't fit under a regular sheet of copy paper, the boys had fun.

John

We had a huge Tiger recruiting success. We now have three dens of 8-9 each. We split them according to schools - we recruit from 4 elementary schools. 2 of the dens (mine and another) meet in the same room and usually do things together. The third den really got off the ground last week and we're working to incorporate them into our activities.

So far we've only had a couple miss each week. I too would like to see all of them cross over to Boy Scouts, but as my son put it this past weekend when we were walking back from the latrine at our second camping trip in as many weeks -

"Dad, I want to quit Scouts."

"You can't quit Scouts, why would you want to do that?"

"Well, I don't want to quit yet, I just don't want to be a real Boy Scout, I want to stop after Webelos." (He had a bad experience with a Webelos at Family Camp who didn't know when to back off in showing his knowledge to a younger Cub.) I told him that we had a while to wait and he could make that decision in a few years.

It is my hope to be standing proud at his Eagle ceremony at some point in the future, but it is his decision to go all the way.

Our Tigers have had fun so far - tonight we made edible ship snacks out of apples, cheese and pretzels. They really got into it. We also played the game from the program helps of blowing a toy golf ball through a maze with a straw. Due to time constraints we fashioned the course out of 2x2's and Duplo blocks and lined up the boys along the length of the table in two teams. Each team worked together to "con" their ship through the channel. One of my Tiger dad's corrected my use of the term drive with respect to ships. He's a recently retired SWO Lt. Cdr. The boys had fun and this old treadhead (Army tanker) learned something new!

Next week all three dens will visit the local fire station and walk over from our meeting place so those who missed the Tiger hike this past weekend will have a hike to complete 5G.

Fun stuff.

John

With respect to the requirement to fill out the adult application for a non-parent partner, it's still there. Ran into that on a couple of new Cubs during our recent recruiting drive.

John

Sprocket,

We had a pretty good recruiting night as well and now it appears that we'll have 17 Tigers. Our plan is to split into at least 2 dens, but the other potential den leader is now talking about just keeping everybody together if all the parents are there. We have two fairly large rooms that we can use in the church if it heads that way. I'm not sure that it should, I'd rather see two dens but he's been down this road before (DL all the way through CM) and doesn't want to do it on his own.

One of the problems is that his boy, my son and another Tiger are all friends and don't really want to split up. My perspective is that even though there will be two dens, the Tigers will more than likely do a lot of stuff together and they won't be apart like they think.

Fortunately we have until October to really decide how to split things up as next week's meeting we will be in the gym and will probably play wiffleball. (There's not really a large enough grass area outside since it's a downtown church and the parking lot gets pretty full.) The following meeting is the pack meeting and we'll all be together anyhow.

My suggestion would be to let the boys figure out the dens with some guidance from the adults on the sticky choices. I may be giving first graders too much credit here, but I don't think so. This might be the way we do it, or we could go by application date and make the cut at 8 or 9 boys to start the second den. I got to admit I am kind of partial to my first 6 Tigers, but one of them is the new DL's son and the other is the best friend, so I'm sure we'll have some new boys to replace them.

Don't know if this helps at all, sort of thinking out loud I guess.

John

Way Cool Elizabeth!!! Congrats on a great sign-up. It sounds like it really worked out well.

I got an e-mail from my CM today and he told me that we have a total of 11 new Tigers for next week, so we'll split into 2 Tiger Dens now. One of my Tiger Teams is the former CM and his youngest son, so maybe he'll take the new den.

Congrats again!

John

Elizabeth,

I'm sorry I didn't see this sooner today, but may you have the same success I had last night - 80% or better signing up.

Your program sounds much more organized than mine, I'm curious to hear how it worked.

John

Shenandoah Area Council has it scheduled for the 2nd and 3rd Saturdays in November.

I like Moxieman's reasoning for moving it to February, although we could probably do it several times a year in our area and they'd still need more help.

John

Jeff,

My son and I joined in May and participated in the Pack acitivities over the summer. Since it appeared in the literature that the Cub Scout year starts in June, after I agreed to be the den leader I told the incoming Tiger teams to go ahead and start to work on their requirements since we wouldn't have any den meetings until September 5th.

I focused mainly on getting the Bobcat stuff done with my son since that was a change to the Tiger program and I remembered having to work hard on it when I was a Cub. We did do a couple of the electives - help in the kitchen, go to work, and we could count a couple family and go see it items as well.

I would agree that a Tiger who just joined last month probably shouldn't be able to count stuff he did in June and July towards belt loops and achievements. I thought maybe you had some really well clued in parents, but maybe they're reliving their childhood through their boy.

I think Oak Tree has a good approach to the problem. It could definitely be an issue down the line, best to nip it in the bud now.

John

We had the first of two recruiting nights at our local schools tonight. We got 1 new Webelos, 1 Bear, 2 Wolves and 2 Tigers at my son's school. The Webelos was unexpected since his school only goes from K to 3rd grade.

My CM gave me a well stocked box of forms and information sheets, pens and a sample New Cub Kit that our District gives out (racing lunch/pencil box, Cub Scout bumper sticker, wristband, Pinewood Derby card and Matchbox car). He also let me choose from several fold-out display boards of pack activities photos from the last few years. I let my son choose the board that appealed most to him - lots of rain gutter regatta, fishing derby, and Pack overnighter photos as well as series of photos from a Pack trip to see a Hagerstown Suns minor league baseball game.

One thing that struck me as kind of odd was that although the District had listed about 10 packs along with contact information, I was the only Pack at our school for the event. Just my son and I in uniforms with the display. Fortunately I remembered to get the meeting days and times for the other packs and had one boy who needed to meet on a night other than Tuesday.

In the packet that I got there was a whole plan for the evening as well as a layout for a flip chart brief. It looked like a schoolhouse solution for how to run a recruiting event, good but really structured. Since I didn't know how many others would be there, I decided to go off the cuff and I guess it worked out well since there were about 8 families there.

What have others experiences been with events like this? Do you usually compete with other Packs at the same schools for kids?

We live in a small city of about 15,000 in a county of approximately 79,000. My Pack had people at 5 or 6 schools and I haven't heard what their response was yet.

Thanks for any insight. I get to do this again a week from Thursday and would like to be better prepared.

John

Hi Jeff,

I'm also a new Tiger Den Leader. We had our first den meeting last Tuesday. We'll have our second den meeting next week, tonight was a recruiting drive instead of a meeting, so I haven't had to deal with a huge amount of sign-offs yet.

Was this boy active over the summer in working on some of the achievements/electives? Does he have an older brother who clued him in on the belt loops program?

I have two boys (including my son) who did some work over the summer on their requirements and will be eligible to recieve their Tiger Paw and some beads at our Pack meeting in two weeks. A third has an older brother WB1 that has been active since he was a Tiger and he's aware of some of the other program elements.

We'll see what next week brings. I know it's at least two more Tigers for my den!

Let us know how it works out.

John

The "2" comes from the military. A salute is a two count movement. Count 1 raises the hand to the eyebrow or bill of the cap. After the salute is held, Count 2 brings the hand back down to the position of attention. Since salutes could be held for long periods of time, think "To the Colors", "Star Spangeled Banner" (4 verses if you're lucky) the order to drop the salute was given to ensure a uniform appearance.

John

Thanks for all the encouragement and good tips. I sent an e-mail to all my Tiger Partners today thanking them for coming last night and gave them some links to online helps for the Tigers, along with reminders about upcoming events and a list of the monthly themes. Hopefully some will spot the month(s) they'd like to help.

The binder that the CM gave me had a basic attendance roster among other things, but I've found that using the two Tiger Record forms in the back of the Leaders Guide printed back to back works pretty well. I thought about using one of the spreadsheets, but I'm not planning on bringing my laptop to the meetings. We'll see how it goes.

I mentioned the Den Doodles last night and I like the idea of using a flag. I'll let you know what the boys decide (it's never too soon to start the boy-lead troop method!)

John

Well, tonight was our first Tiger Den meeting. I've got a great bunch of boys and parents - 6 Tiger Teams so far. Everybody is interested in the program, the parents are supportive (and so far receptive to the shared leadership plan). It should be a good Pack meeting on the 26th, with several advancements to present. I've got two Tigers that are already close to getting the Bobcat Badge as well as the Tiger Paw IRB!

Yes, one of them is my son and we've worked hard to get there. The rest of the boys are already excited about moving up the trail and have promised to work hard on the Tiger IRB requirements before our next meeting.

Next week is a recruiting night at the local schools so we'll be at my son's school looking for new Tigers, Wolves and Bears. The Cubmaster was very helpful and gave me a box of stuff for recruiting as well as a nice display.

We've got a Council Family Camp in 2 weeks and 2 weeks after that a Pack Overnighter not to mention a Pack Float in mid October for our local Apple Harvest Festival. We're going to be busy! Did I mention NLT/LS/BALOO is the same weekend! I guess I'll have to hear second hand how the parade goes.

One thing I wasn't prepared for was the paperwork/recordkeeping, but I think I've got that under control so that the next meeting flows smoothly.

So far, so good. I love this Cub Scouting stuff! Thanks for letting me share.

John

dibbus1987 -

That's the first thing my wife told me when I showed her my new pants. Good advice.

John

ScoutNut has some great suggestions and it wasn't until I saw poetry that I recalled some of my favorite yarns as a boy were from "The Collected Poems of Robert Service."

"There are strange things done in the midnight sun

By the men who toil for gold;..."

A good online source for the poems is http://www.artdamage.com/service.htm

Follow the links at the bottom to get to the poems.

John

Great article Steve, thanks.

Here's an 11th reason:

Because it's my turn to step up, just like Harry, Steve, Ken, Bill, Mark, Joel, and George did for me when I was a boy.

And, hopefully when my Tiger is grown and my grandson asks, "Dad can I join Cub Scouts?", he'll say "Yes, let's find our Pack."

John