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Rip Van Scouter

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Everything posted by Rip Van Scouter

  1. How "definitive" do you need? The BSA Insignia Guide says: "Religious emblem square knot, cloth, silver knot on purple, No. 05007, may be worn by youth or adult members who earned the knot as a youth, above left pocket." It says the same thing in three sections, under Cub Scouts, Boy Scouts, and Universal Insignia. There is no distinction drawn between the two programs. If it is earned "as a youth" it can be worn! There is also a footnote in the latter section which, I believe, further clarifies the situation: "*The miniature device worn with the youth religious embl
  2. jnclement wrote: "Wow. I check to back in to find my whole scouting career reduced to my pushy parents, and popularity." Reply: I never said that. I was referring to myself and my own troop if you check what I actually wrote. If you were self-motivated enough as a teen to complete Eagle all on your own without parental urging, kudos to you, sir! Most teens, including myself at that age, are not that self-motivated. That is why parental involvement is so important. "When there are more uniform questions on the forum than camping questions, do you think that shows we're relevant t
  3. Sorry for any misunderstanding. Poly-wool long pants are my "dress" and winter indoor meeting pants. Poly-cotton shorts was my other choice when I ordered my custom-made pants (2 pc. minimum) else I would have just ordered one pair of the poly-cotton "utility" long pants and been done with it. Now I wish I had the "utility" pants also, and am considering obtaining a slightly used pair (e-bay?) to make my shorts into convertibles.
  4. Bravo! Good answer and good info Oak Tree! Kittle, congrats, yet I am appalled that your pack was so poorly uniformed. Tell whoever told you he had to take off his religious knot to go check the BSA Insignia Guide. Not only can he wear his knot, but if he earns it multiple times at different age/grade levels, he can wear a pin device in the knot indicating additional awards for each addition award, but not more than one youth religious square knot. I think there are Cub, Webelos, Boys Scout, and Venturing devices which can be worn indicating previously earned awards at those levels.
  5. "As a new user of this forum, all I can say is.........you guys need more to do. You could have planned and executed an outing with your troops with the time and energy put into this thread. Bottom line is......let your conscience be your guide, no one is grading your troops' salute." "jnclement" misses the point entirely, just like on the thread about Cubs uniform pants (or lack thereof). These people are showing proper concern for two serious issues, respect for the Flag, and proper uniforming. It's all about patriotism, citizenship, and "esprit de corps", which I hope you will agree AR
  6. jnclement wrote: "After returning to Scouting after a 30 year layoff, I am surprised to see the things emphasized in the programs, and the lack of emphasis placed on learning the outdoors. I'm kind of shocked I was able to obtain Eagle, Vigil, attend Philmont TLD, and a National Jamboree without knowing what the term "Class A" was, or owning a pair of BSA pants." Wait a minute, forget "Class A" (bogus military term), but, you NEVER OWNED "a pair of BSA pants", yet attended your Eagle BOR, Court-of-Honor, and National Jamboree in non-uniform pants? Now, I am SHOCKED! I started th
  7. hops_scout wrote (a couple pages back): >I believe that oranizations must be chartered by the US Congress in order to have the right to salute the flag as we do.< Really? Where did you get that? Police and Firefighters in uniform salute the flag. Are they "chartered by the US Congress"? According to the US code, during the Pledge of Allegiance, "Persons in uniform should remain silent, face the flag, and render the military salute." Although the code does not specifically address the definition of "Persons in uniform" or what organizations they might represent there is a hint i
  8. Proud Eagle wrote: >I have some zip-off pants made of similar material to Scout pants. They are horrible. They type and weight of the fabric causes the zippers to rub. The weight of the fabric requires heavier zippers than most zip-offs, and so they really don't feel very nice.< Hmmmm. Maybe velcro WOULD be better. >Zip-offs are fine for very light materials like thin, quick-dry nylon. It isn't such a good idea for most other types of material.< I have some fairly heavy cotton utility pants with zip-off legs and they work great. They have a strong, but lightweight pla
  9. Not only does the religious award (square knot)stay on his uniform as a Boy Scout, but if he decides to become a Scouter (say, Jr. Assistant Scoutmaster at 18) he can continue to wear the youth religious knot. There is also a knot for AOL award and one for Eagle rank that a Scouter can wear if he earned them as a youth, but I do not think a Scout would wear both the knot and the actual award, would he? I never made it to Eagle as a Scout, but I proudly wear my AOL red-and-green square knot on my Scouter uniform. As an Asst. Cubmaster, the Cubs often ask me what it is for and I am happy to tell
  10. Well, I was not suggesting it for kids, necessarily. However, I have worn convertible pants on several camping trips and let me tell you, it is very nice on those early spring and late fall days, when it is a little bit chilly in the morning, but warms up nicely by afternoon, then cools off again after sunset. The convenience, and somewhat of a novelty still, of zipping off the legs when it warms up, or to go wading in a stream, then putting them back on later when it is cold or when bugs start to bite, and not having to go into a tent or find a hiding place to change back and forth between lo
  11. I noticed that the poly-cotton "utility" pants are the same as the shorts. My problem is that I got the poly-wool dress pants for meetings and ceremonies, and the poly-cotton utility shorts for warm-weather activity wear. Would my uniform still be official if I added a hidden zipper to my short's pant legs and cut off the legs from an otherwise useless (broken zipper, torn bottom, etc.)and put the other half of the zipper on them, to make zip-off pants? As shorts they would be indistinguishable, except for an extra bit of hemming for the zipper. As long pants, there would be a faint "sea
  12. OK, I see there are strong opinions on both sides of this question. My only question now is, when did the whole idea of wearing only the shirt become commonly accepted? When I was in Cubs and Boy Scouts in the '60s and '70's, there was never any question of wearing a partial uniform. It just wasn't done. Scouts and their parents took pride in wearing the uniform. If for some reason you were unable to wear the complete uniform, then you wore Civvies to the meeting and you had better had a pretty good reason for not wearing your uniform. And it wasn't like my Pack and Troop were some d
  13. Sitrep: I have come to the same conclusion. If you earned it, you can display it. You just may not be able to wear it on your uniform. The insiginia guide makes provision for one and only one "temporary" patch to be worn on the right pocket. This applies to the World Conservation Award that WinterFlames asked about above, as well as the Philmont Arrowhead and other patches. So if you want to display your previous awards, unless there is a specific adult squareknot equivalent, or the insignia guide makes a provision for adult scouter wear (jamboree patch is one example), only one can be
  14. On adult wear of the Eagle cloth patch, the insignia quide is quite clear: Adults wear the Eagle square knot, not the patch, however the actual Eagle MEDAL may be worn "on formal Eagle occasions". I would take that to mean an Eagle COH, NESA events, etc. Whether that would include other formal events, like district and council recognition dinners, etc., would be open to interpretation. Here is the actual text: Eagle rank. cloth, silver, white, and blue on red, No. 00489, Boy Scout, left pocket. Adults wear square knot, No. 05011. Eagle Award. silver medal suspended from
  15. He may have been referring to a non-BSA jac-shirt sold by a Woolrich distributor, not the Scout Shops. Woolrich makes several varieties of Jac-shirts, some have liners. Interestingly, there is no BSA jac-shirt shown on their website.
  16. Sylvar, I did a search on the Scoutstuff.org website for "aloha", "hawaiian", even "tropical", with no result. I looked at all the garment catagories and only found "Island Camp Shirt - Prints" and "Island Camp Shirt - Solids" in the Custom Garment section. As a 50/50 cotton/poly blend I don't know how good a Hawaiian shirt it would be. Aren't the better ones made out of silk? Well, I guess you could get a BSA logo embroidered on the pocket, big deal! What I really want is a nice BSA fleece zip up jacket, but the Custom Garment available does not come in my size. Do you think the uni
  17. I talked to the manager of our local scout shop a few days ago. She informed me that the Jac-Shirt prices went up BECAUSE they got a new supplier last year. Now, she has never received any new stock, having plenty of the older Woolrich jac-shirts available in all sizes (...even in my 5X size, although no other standard uniform parts go to my size! Go figure!). Don't most retailers sell old stock as clearance merchandise at reduced prices, rather than marking it up to the price of the replacement item?
  18. I talked to the manager of our local scout shop a few days ago. She informed me that the Jac-Shirt prices went up BECAUSE they got a new supplier last year. Now, she has never received any new stock, having plenty of the older Woolrich jac-shirts available. Don't most retailers sell old stock as clearance merchandise at reduced prices, rather than marking it up to the price of the replacement item? Yes, PLEASE stop the insanity! Oh yeah, here is another insane item: I had to order custom uniforms for my 5x size body, since nothing on the rack fit me (except the $157 Jac-Shi
  19. New link is dead too, John. Can you describe what you found on the Woolrich website? I have searched there and found no references to BSA or any jac-shirts that look like it. Most of theirs have shoulder cape fronts, single button pockets, or long tails.
  20. AHEM!...... Thanks to all for the info and input on the jac-shirt, very interesting,....but does anyone have any answers to my questions on the nylon jacket manufacturer(s)?
  21. Hmmmm....perhaps this is BSA's new supplier and Norther Tier is doing the field testing through their Trading Post. I can't imagine a BSA-affiliated organization selling a "knock-off", complete with BSA patch, without the blessing of Supply Division. That may be why Scout Shops that are out of stock in the Woolrich jac-shirt cannot get any replacement stock, until the field test reports come back positive or BSA gets a contract at the price they want. Interestingly, at the Bemidji Woolen Mills website they offer two different jac-shirts, although the one with slash pockets as you describ
  22. John in KC, I tried your link and it did not work. I even went to the TinyURL website, downloaded their toolbar, but still nothing. How about telling us the main URL for Woolrich that you used and what you did to find the info so we can get to the same page? Thanks!
  23. NWScouter said: "The picture shows her wearing an complete vintage Second Class uniform..." I take exception to the use of the word "complete". If you look closely at the pictures on the website he suggested, the singer is simply wearing a vintage Boy Scout shirt. No overseas (flat) cap, no neckerchief or slide, no web belt and brass buckle (or optional Philmont belt and buckle), and no uniform pants or shorts (or socks for that matter). Then again, when I see the boys in our Cub Pack and some Scout troops, perhaps the definition of "complete uniform" has changed, since many we
  24. What is Transpor and why is it a concern?
  25. I have seen several references on this forum that Woolrich no longer makes the red wool Jack-shirt, however, the BSA catalog and Scoutstuff.org website still refer to it as the "Woolrich Jac-shirt". Can anyone verify if there is a new manufacturer and who it might be? The current inventory at the Scout shop only has the BSA label. Also, I saw at the scout shop that the red nylon jackets they were selling had the manufacturers label, which was "Auburn". I found the Auburn website where you can order the jackets for roughly the same price (with shipping) as the scout shop. You can buy the
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