KL Wisconsin

Contact your credit card company directly and have the amount put "in dispute". You can start this process with a phone call, but will have to follow up with your complaint in writing. The credit card company will then be trying to collect its money from scouter.com. You will not be required to pay the disputed balance until the problem is resolved. That is why you have a major credit card, they have a lot more power than you alone. Good luck

Suggestions:

In addition to Den Chiefs, invite the Webelos to join your troop on campouts or other activities. Make then feel your troop is looking forward to having them as part of the troop.

Look at costs. How do your dues/fees compare to other troops. Parents often don't understand the program as much as the simple bottom line. Our troop had problems with parents percieving us as "expensive" compared to another troop. To overcome that perception, we put in writing that we charged nothing to attend any and all campouts, no extra charges for patches, etc. that the dues were the total cost, period. Our rivals charged less dues, and emphasized that in recruiting, again very negatively. But they failed to mention that they were charging boys $10-25 per weekend campout, and requiring a special fee for tentage.

Put together a simple handout outlining your troop's tradition, philosophy, number of Eagle scouts over the years and the types of Eagle projects accomplished, and distribute that to Webelos leaders and scouts. Include your dues/fees and that you have a uniform exchange available, if one exists. State that you are a traditional troop with pride in your long tradition and wearing your uniforms. Tell of the major trips or camporees your troop has planned in the next year plus. No major events planned? Get cracking, guys. The boys need long term goals to look forward to, and new potential scouts are looking at those adventure opportunities when considering troops.

Another thing we do, our recharter is in April, but Webelos crossover in February. We charge new scouts nothing to join the troop. They pay no dues until after our first fundraiser in April or May. Basically, we're offering them a "90 day free trial". When the dues are due in May, the money (or the greatest part of it) comes directly from the profit the scout earned on his fundraiser, little or no outlay from family. We really compliment the boy on earning his own way, etc, emphasizing a scout is thrifty.

We have separate meeting/information session for Webelos parents during the time the Webelos come to look over our troop at a troop meeting. We outline as much as we can of the program, including our commitment to keeping costs down while providing an interesting and fun program. We make the statement that if the scout participates in the fundraisers, he should be able to cover all his scouting experience without any outlay from the home. We explain our troop committee and its role and emphasize the positives of a boy-run program. The potential scouts'parents begin to realize that even though the program is boy run, there are a lot of adults behind the scenes making things work. The parents leave with the handout and our phone numbers for any questions that come up after they leave.

All these efforts have helped our recruiting, but frankly, nothing helps as much as the boys just telling the younger boys how much fun they are having. Are your existing scouts good salesmen for their program?

It is the scout's responsibility to have his handbook signed off. But remember these are 11-12 year old kids we are talking about. And it is not easy for some young boys to approach adults and ask for their attention. So I'd say, I think it is also the responsibility of the adults to make themselves "accessible". A simple reminder announcement like "I'll be at the rear of the room at the end of the meeting if you have something you want me to see or sign off in your handbook" can work wonders to making the boys feel relaxed and confident to get these signatures.

For low ranks, we also allow a scout who is at least two ranks above the scout to review the candidate and initial his handbook (things like ability to tie knots,etc) which takes a lot of that pressure off the new scout. When they have those items initialed by their peers, they can then go with confidence to see the scoutmaster for a scoutmaster's review, etc.

Scoutmasters can also take the initiative to say, "let me see your handbook so we can look at what you have accomplished and what you need to work on." In my opinion, that's not chasing the kids around to get their books signed off, it's establishing a rapport and having an informal scoutmaster conference.

Could you please define "Patrol Star". Our troop has never heard of it.

I don't know an official appraiser, but most areas have old/antique book stores where someone can help you. I would probably get appraisals from more than one source. Informally, you can get an idea of their value by looking at what price similiar books are selling on ebay. Go in under "boy scout books" or handbooks and be prepared to see a lot of entries. If these are early BS handbooks, the ones with a scout using semaphore on the cover, they will sell for several hundred dollars each, even in poor condition. In checking out ebay, you can also get the email addresses of some of the sellers who are collectable dealers, they may be able to help you determine values, too. Give them the exact titles and copyright dates, etc. Oh, if your friend woul like to do his "good Deed", a lot of councils are now having silent auctions. Donating one book to the council for a auction item assures it will go to a good scout home. And to plug my local area, Milwaukee County Council, Milwaukee, Wisconsin has a great scouting museum that is always willing to take donations. They may be able to give your friend an idea of the books values there, too.

Good luck.

You say the pack is very small and has no troop to feed into. Perhaps it would be appropriate to suggest the pack combine with another, larger pack with a better leader base and a charter organization that is willing to assume a positive function. If the parent who is willing to participate and believes in the scouting program for his son sees that his child's scouting experience would be improved by joining another pack, maybe that is what is needed for all the boys. You don't say who your charter organization is whether it is a grade school or church or what, but it may be time to make some radical changes.

A quick addition to the crossing over to multiple troops. I've seen it with each boy being given the kerchief, etc by his new troop. But then at the end, a Scoutmaster invited all the new scouts to join all Scouts from all the troops in reciting the Scout Oath and Law together. It made a very warm, unifying closing. Then the scouts all left the Pack meeting together in a quiet procession. It was quite moving and impressive for the Cubs, too.

From Wisconsin, our council troop for Philmont in 2001 is estimated at $650. I think that includes roundtrip bus travel. I would recommend including costs of some of the necessary equipment such as a frame backpack, lightweight sleeping bag, and lightweight sleeping pad in your estimates for the scouts and parents, if your scouts do not already have that type of equipment.

We are getting the same thing here. I contacted council because I am a Sea Scouting advisor in a neighboring council. The two councils are quite near one another, and do many joint fund-raising programs, etc. We intended to offer this specialized program to all the older scouts in the area. Instead of simply taking the information of when we meet, etc. the council New Troop staffer immediately tried to recruit me to start a parallel program for them, simply because I was trained. I pointed out that Sea Scouting generally required some equipment, somewhat special equipment,like a Body of Water, Boats, and a Charter Organization, all of which we already had in place,and none of which he could supply (particularly the body of water, that's a tough one). He was extremely indignant when I told him that I couldn't handle running/advising a second unit, especially one without any of the above, water, boats, organization or members. Initially he told me that they would put something in the monthly newletter regarding our Ship. But he later called me back, told me he'd talked to his boss and that they felt scouts wouldn't be interested in going to another council's program, so forget the newsletter article. He further informed me that his role was to establish new units so he would try to see if he could find a group interested in starting a ship for their council. Period, end of story. It was definitely numbers, not servicing needs of youth that was the primary consideration.

We've also had a new troop established because one dad wanted to be Scoutmaster but wasn't selected so went out and formed his own troop, to the general detriment of the existing troops. And council recently approved a new Venturing unit being started by a mom who told me she wants to have this unit so "selfishly, I want my daughter to go camping with the rest of the family" and so her 19 yr old son can go back to Philmont one more time as a youth. They have no intention of working on advancements or venturing awards. But the council has another new unit.

Our troop is relatively new and just got large enough to really make a patrol system work in the last year or so. We have been reconfiguring patrols every 6 months when new SPL and ASPL are elected.

Up to now, we've had patrols of mixed ages of scouts plus one New Scout patrol. This time the Scoutmaster made up 4 patrols of scouts divided by their longevity in scouting: 1st year scouts, 2nd year, 3rd year and a new Venture Patrol of 4th year and above, in effect the High school-aged scouts. I commented that this seemed like a continuation of Cub Scouting to me with Wolf, Bear, etc, age group divisions. These patrols each have 5 - 6 scouts in them. I think the patrols are too small, in practice the scouts cannot always attend meetings and if the patrol leader and asst. patrol leaders and only one or two others from the patrol attend a meeting, it's all chiefs and no indians.

I'd like to hear how other troops handle patrol configurations. Thanks.

Try checking with council for boys who attended the last National Jamboree or World Jamboree. The scouts often exchange uniforms and those boys may have some they could show your group.

Where is THE auction site. Would love to get a copy of this movie, too, and was told it wasn't available on video. Thanks