Eagle Foot

I had the same problem,,,when I took over as Scoutmaster I had a member of the troop who had not turned over money from a fund raiser. About all you can do is call them and try to make arrangements. In my experience those who are going to pay will pay. Those who let it go generally let it go...there are lessons to learn (granted they may not be the type you want) but lessons to pass down to all who are involved with fundraisers. Make sure you have a good committee, make sure all of you are on the same page!!!

When all else fails asked yourself...are we following the Scout Law and Scout Oath?

In the end I did get some of the money collected. Another lesson to learn is did you interview other troops before selecting, how many? If you had questions did they answer them? Was the answer ok?

You have to match yourself and your son with the right troop. Just crossing over to the local troop isen't always the best direction.

Edited by Eagle Foot

Smoke from the campfire has no specfic direction except when you sit in front of the fire...then the smoke will follow you.

I hate white rabbits, I hate white rabbits, I hate white rabbits....

We have two who do not have sons, one is now our committee chairman and the other is our advancement chairman. Both where Eagle scouts....

I know the feelings, however you may be missing out on some golden help!!!

I told them when the meetings were then I let them do the rest, if truly interested I figured they would show up on their own, and I followed and practiced the Scout Oath with them.

After about four or five meetings I got them signed up...we've never been happier. To put things in more focus they both are member of the church and of our mens group, our support scale has gone up over the chart.

Did BP have a son? How about Green Bar Bill?

Whats all of this stuff about hikeing once in a while, or attend occaisionally...sounds like someone is being to picky. Those that are truly interested will find a way to show up reguarly. I never give anyone the feeling that they are not welcome. (unless it is very clear that they really should find something else to do with their time...such as bad language, power trip, big talker, etc.)

I just turned down a scout for Eagle because his scout sprit was not...

...not helpful to others

...not willing to wear the uniform properly or as requested.

...not willing to set the example of good behavior when around other scouts.

The list goes on, it's not that he's really a bad guy, he just doesen't want to do things the way that present as good scouting image. If he he can slide he will. These things need to be cought in the scoutmaster's conference, before the scout goes to the board of review. I also get feed back from the other ASM's as to what they think, how has this scout done. For Eagle the process is stronger. We can't expect these scout's to be perfect, but if they are doing the best they can...that's all I ask!!!!

Sometimes I give several SM conferences because the first one may make the scout freeze...

If he is fine in the sm conference then he should be fine in the BOR.

As sm we have to be fair, but also we have to do what is right and not let bad behavior, or lack of respect get past the sm conference. Somethimes it happens and that is why the BOR is also there. If conflict happens reguarly between the BOR and scout then both process of the SM conference and BOR need to be viewed...as to corectness and what they are reviewing.

Last March I took over a troop that diden't have any adult who would step up and fill the position of SM. As time went on I have one scout who told me he was going to be an Eagle Scout....very good. Lets see what all you need to do since you are going to be seventeen shortly.

Long stroy short...he as a bad attitude....bully's the other scouts and uses bad language...(**)*_+**&^$#( and the like. He is down to the wire now only five months until his eighteenth birthday. He was always border line but the last camping trip he was bullieing the scouts, hitting them in the lower parts and so on.

I'm sorry that's not scout sprit....how could any SM approve this as scout sprit in the SM conference? He has the MB and has approval for his project....just horific manners, and lack of respect for adults and his SPL.

The bad thing about it he almost had overcome this behavior,,,but has sliped back into it again.

Do you ever see this in your troop? I know I'm going to get hit hard from his parents....but I won't do it... to approve scouts like this does a dis-service to the program...sets a sub-standard.

For the ranks of Star through Eagle each Scout is required to serve in a leadership position, Troop Scribe, Troop Quartermaster, Patrol Leader, etc.

To give this scout credit for that position how strick are you? Does the Scout just have a title for credit or does the Scout really have to work for the credit?

(Edited by Eagle Foot)

For the ranks of Star through Eagle each Scout is required to serve in a leadership position, Troop Scribe, Troop Quartermaster, Patrol Leader, etc.

To give this scout credit for that position how strick are you? Does the Scout just have a title for credit or does the Scout really have to work for the credit?

(Edited by Eagle Foot)

I rescently steped up to the position of SM of a troop (March 04) when the SM said that he had, enough. It seems there is always some one who thinks we shoulden't be doing what we are doing, and that their way would be better, or that someone else whould do a better job.

Last week I had one of my ASM's tell me he thought my plate was too full and that ASM xyz whould make a good SM. (I'm also District Camping Chariman)

---Same person former SM had issues with--- This guy even went to our DE...DE called me to give me heads up that this was happening. He doesn't like the guy, said to watch your back....

This guy and a couple of others think I should or somebody else should be SM because my son is no longer involve actively with the troop. (Girls & Fumes) I feel just because my son is not coming too meetings or camping right now does not mean I have to leave. (I'm just a good Ole Eagle) This troop is on the map now.

Our COR and CC are behind me...just a few who think things should go more their way. I don't want to step down yet, nor to I want these guys to have their way (they are not fully trained)

I know presenting these problems on the forum may seem slight but it seems to be a good way to get advise. This seems to be a common problem now, never had this years ago.

What does one do?

(Edited by Eagle Foot)

Check out this web page

http://www.ptcumcscouts.org/troop175/

You may want to contact them they use a lot of passwords.

Normally we do it the last week in July or the first week in August.

In May through June I suggest that the scouts be thinking about what they would like to do next year. Make a list...over produce so a compleate list can be made.

We meet generally during a weekend campout and go over the list whittleing it down to 12 months of camping and some weekend day trips.

Each trip,fund raiser, or activity must be asked------

Who--What---When----How?????-----Where....

Scouts should fund these....not mom & dad writing a check...as some do because it't the easiest thing to do. Try...Try...Try to get as much funded by the Scouts....they will apprecieate it more!!!!

When we have a (what seems to be a workable)calender the SPL presents it to the Troop Committee for approval. It's kind of like the Scoutmaster's conference before the board of review....it should be realistic and practical....and do-able. Going to Alaska next month or even two months from today is a little hard to do if you don't allready live there.

As Scoutmaster I stick to what the boys plan....some dates are moved for holidays and adult two leader positioning. I include district dates....i.e. training and special events and try not to conflict with them when posible...some cases you just can't.

I include Troop Courts of honors, Committee meeting dates, Board of Review dates, all school holidays, federal & state holidays, and NESA day, arbor day.

Print and distribute the calendar as guickly as possible....if some activies are ifffy....make it TBA or TBD....To be announced ...To be determined. Get the PLC to meet before hand on these.

Good luck

(edited by Eagle Foot)

To best of your ability at the time!!!!

Eagle Foot's policy....aways carry a BSA 'Guide to Safe Scouting' ....when in question... look it up. Better yet have "Those" look it up so we both can be on the same page.

Saves problems, clears the air real fast. I can always stand to be corrected when I'm wrong. That's part of it all.

Something else...I've always had more trouble out of the adults than I do the kids no matter how bad the adults say they are.

(Edited by Eagle Foot)

In our troop it is written in the troop "Guide" that dues must be paid ever quarter. If the scout is unable to meet this obligation please contact the scoutmaster and or the troop CC. It also states that if the scout is more than 3 months behind we can not advance or attend any activity outside the regular troop meeting. This was put into place by the boys and with the advice of the scoutmaster and approval from the troop commettee. If it's not written as part the the troop operations then it is really not formal. In your cases it is best to discuss it with the SM....and or the CC. If too no avail bring it to the attention of the COR....they may not no this is in place...where ultamaltly they may be able to make some sort of change.

If a scout can not pay...it should never be taken to such extent that the scout can't go on. Some sort of proof of finicial delimia and or understanding should be made between the parents and the troop if money is the problem.

I just have a hard time when the parents drive up in new 4x4 trucks @ 40 thousand dollars each...crying they can't come up with his dues or campout money. (they probully can't it's in the vehicle's)

It's up to each individual unit....if there's no working room...it maybe the wrong unit to be hooked up with...or the wrong leadership in place.

We provide this information up front... we interview each scout and the parents, we let them know what we do, when we go, how we go, and what is expected from each parent and their scout.

edited by Eagle Foot

1) What type of scouting unit is it? Boy Scout Troop going into it's 25th. year

2) Do you feel you have a well functioning committee? ....absolutly not

2) How many memebers are on it and what are their specific assignments? Five members...

We have a committee chairman...she is leaving after some ten years...has done a terrfic job.

We have other members listed on the charter but with know specfic duties...

We can post meeting dates all day long...no one shows up.

I'm going in the back door approach and calling for a parents meeting...they show up for those.

As this is being written I am re-grouping our committee. Not having a funtioning committee is a real problem...I assumed the SM role in March, and I am going slow with changes. It's like some like it better with out organization.

If we don't get a funtioning committee I see the troop not growing, but just a buch of boys who are meeting once a week....going through the motions of calling themselves Boy Scouts. Same problem with ASM's no commitment. ---My thoughts are to lay it out to them. Let them know what will be expected. Hopfully I'll get some takers.

As a side note: I recently asked one of my ASM's what part did he see himself fullfilling in the troop, what did he think that he would like to do best? ANS...to plan everything for the outdoors, make all of the decisions as to where the scouts will go, what type of camping, backpacking, hikes, ets. -----I thought that was great...except that most of that I tried to leave up to the boys. Responce was...well then I just don't know,,,,I don't like some of the things they choose.....(I'm trying to get him trained)

edidted by Eagle Foot

This is also a common in our district. I arrange the camporees where the Spring Camporee is for Webelos and Boy Scouts...the Boy Scouts teach the Webelos...in return the Boy Scouts get to do something special...that is Boy Scouts only...ie. climbing towers, repelling, etc. The Fall Camporee is for Boy Scouts only. It is competition with a challange. Last year it was the survival challange, based on the TV show with different stations, puzzles, challanges, and patrol competition. This year it is a raft race down the river. The rafts have to be built on site the day of the event. I look at having the Spring Camporee as the first camping trip for the new Webelos that crossed over. They will have a big part in training the new Webelos. Both a recruiting and camping experience. The program is geared for Webelos. Everybody seems tothink that Webelos must be included in a Boy Scout Camporee,,,not so the way I understand, but we try to keep everyone happy and the boys interested. I like the yesteryear camporee...Boy Scouts only, never saw a Webelos Scout. I'm looking for good ideas that Boy Scouts and Weblos Scouts can have fun together at a camporee.

Edited by Eagle Foot

Does your system allow a unit to conduct an activity without your (SM's) signature?

Ans. Nothing in writing about this...gray area...they consider these non scouting.

Or are they doing this not under your Troop's umbrella?

Ans. Not doing this under the troop's umbrella but doing this on scout property, they never had a proplem yet!!!!!

They claim these are non scouting...but claim advancement on these on some occasions when it fits or favors them.

The SM is not one of these people I am the SM.

About every 2 months we have a couple of our adult leaders (ASM's)who take it upon them selves to conduct an activity that involves their little group. This group involves about 4-5 scouts from the troop. These activities are things like repelling, canoeig, hiking, etc....but just their group. They give no notice nor do they invite or include other members of the troop.

These activities cut into such things like having to leave early from camping (troop camping)or not being able to attend weekend camping because they did something the weekend before. Not only does this cut into adult leader ship it cuts into troop program.

We have crossed this path more than once, I've explained they need to include all the others...they don't. My unit commis. says I may have to ask them to leave the troop. I'm beginning to agree.

What whould be a word to the wise?

We use permission forms for all activities away form the troop meeting. I believe that the permission form also insures that insurance is covered.

I also make a list of equipment/clothing needed...I mostly do it for parents, the boys pretty much get it!

In our district we have a district planning person, who is also the District Boy Scout Camping Chairman. This person plans the camporees and builds a camporee committee. It has worked very well...we also tried to use the troops to plan it, some times it was great, sometimes it diden't happen.

At present I am this person, if you would like more information feel fee to contact me I be happy to share with you what ever I can.

Eagle Foot.

I believe the reason is because of the liability is on the camp if a failure in equipment happens. It's not that your equipment is bad, they (the camp)needs to have total responsibility when it comes to activities that involve life or death such as climbing and repeling. They are the ones held accountable and not you and your equipment. Talk to your cope insturctor they should know.

Eagle Foot

I would prefere to call it Troop Guide / Handbook. There is always those who (those being adults) who must have everything written out that directly applys to the troop. I just get the COR and the CO to make policy for that CO and incorporate it into the Troop Handbook. I also gave tons of information using the Troop Committee Guide Book and other BSA publications.

(edited by Eagle Foot)

As the new SM of an older troop that was spinning out of control, the ASM's seem to do what they want too.

They do not really openly cause conflict but behind the seens they are together...making contact with "Their Boys" to do things. They keep the SM pretty much in the dark. I'm watching this situation closly trying to decide how to deal with it.

For example: We are going on our spring camporee this weekend. None could come except one who is not with them. Come to find out they are taking COPE training, I think this is good...but....they sure diden't let their SM know. Not that they are required too, just the acceptable thing to do. Again it is so they can take "Their Boys". This is the problem the other SM had...this is why he left.....Ummmmmmm there is always something!!!!

Any body got any ideas about dealing with those who have "Their Boys"?????

These ASM's are for their group and are not working for the good of the troop. "Their group" will show up. "They" can make it when other members of the troop have been left out. They have "Their Group" (Before I came)

Looking for some sugestions

Eagle Foot

I stand corrected...I thought that I read that the CC and Tres. sign the check and purchase's were at the recomendation of the SM.

I need to find another copy of Committee Guide Book and read up.

Thanks

Eagle Foot

Wow!!!!

I have told other scouters things like this really happen.

You must or I should say you should have all checks made to the troop....If you

write checks to parents then have them write to the troop, this is bad business.

In our legalistic life styles this will protect the innocent. Use the committee guide

Book as to how checks are signed by the

Committee chair & Treasurer...as a Scoutmaster

I dont want to sign checks.Ill spend the money.

It was good your DC was there, Im sure he helped opened the door for your (x)Treasurer so she wouldnt knock a whole in it when she left.

They are banks who will provide free checking for BSAthis is good business for those

who do this. We have a local banker on our district committee. Our troop has free checking. If the bank ever starts charging well move the account. In most councils you

can deposit money with them say $200.00 then buy against this at the local council scout shop. This makes it the logistics easier for the SM or advancement Chairman to purchase for the troop.

Sounds like her way of getting out of the responsibility rather than saying Im not up to this.

(comments by Eagle Foot)

FOG...you are right!!! I thought I was the only person with these thoughts. Adults and even scouts tried to make me feel guilty about being "To much by the book" meaning if you aren't paying attention, your gonna miss out. If you don't turn in that permission form by the said date....you really are not considered going!!!

I adhear to the method "Never do something a Scout could do" when it comes to scouting.

The second issue is advancement...Scouts should know their stuff.

The first issue is the uniform and all of the discriptions reguarding Class A, B, & C...diden't know there was a class C untill last month!

I've always called (class A) the Field Uniform, and it will open doors for you.

Scouting is what it is...do it the way that it is presented and what you learned in training.

Consider the task

Consider the resources available

Consider the alternative procedures

Write the final plan

Put the plan into action

Evaluate and Celebrate

Keep the aims of scouting in front of you

Work the methods of scouting

It is a test, to challange your abilities and personal behavior, it contributes to disapline and development. Just because most of us volunteer doesen't mean be slack. Keep in mind the thought "what you do when nobody is watching"

"CHARACTER"

(comments by Eagle Foot)