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    • I think it started with a historical reference but the attempted defense of the Klan crossed a line. For example, we could talk about the fact that Hezbollah operates the Imam al-Mahdi Scouts which is a member of WOSM.  I think that would be acceptable and an interesting discussion.  Perhaps some may try and say that see … this is really interesting that they do things other than being terrorists.  That is also fine with me but a careful discussion.  There are a lot of organizations Nazis, al Qaeda, ISIS that I’m sure have done nice things…. but I mean come on.   Where I think the thread would cross a line would be a defense of Hezbollah the organization.   Perhaps someone can, but I don’t think it would belong in this Forum.   I think for the most part this thread about the KKK in scouts stayed in category 1 above and perhaps occasionally slipped into category 2. Where it went bad was an attempt to defend the KKK itself.   The KKK is a domestic terrorist organization.   There is no defense of the KKK.  Just like other terrorists, they did some good things from time to time, but it doesn’t mean they are not terrorists.
    • I don't know if that was the OP's intent, but it was certainly the intent of the KKK members who first used that title in their publications.  I can tell you, from first hand experience, that this is exactly how the KKK presents themselves to prospective recruits.  
    • @HelpfulTracks has it right.  The advancement requirement is for the individual.  Though I could see it as a sign of achievement, having it as an explicit requirement seems wrong.   The requirement seems ambiguous if you are looking to weigh a result.  The GTA is taking it more like a process; a conversation.  If the SM does not think the scout is doing enough, the SM should talk to the scout.  Have a conversation.  That's what the GTA is saying.   The GTA is also saying it's wrong to arbitrarily say now after-the-fact.  The unit needs to have clear expectations before the scout starts.  The unit needs to discuss with the scout why those expectations are not being med.  The scout needs a chance to explain, defend, change behavior.  The unit needs to do it early and not wait to judge.  AFTER-THE-FACT judgement is a sign of failure of the unit; not the scout.     
    • There is NO WAY anyone will persuade me that the title "Just Ku Kluxin Around" is anything but shining a jovial, light-hearted touch on racism. I have represented clients who spoke of their family documents pertaining to their family's ancestor's enslavement.  Or tracing their family tree back to when their ancestors who were slaves and no records exist, to their knowledge. A sobering moment in the course of an office conference. Well, for a naive white boy like me, though slavery was a part of their family history.   Get an education and a copy of "Treblenka" by Steiner.  Learn.   Or, extra for experts:   Can It Happen Again, by Chartock, et. al. Quiet Neighbors, by Ryan Five Chimneys by Lengyel Eichmann In Jerusalem, by Arendt Minister Of Death, by Aldouby   The Abandonment Of The Jews, by Wyman   Anything by Simon Wiesenthal.   And, if none of those:   Babi Yar, by Kuznetsov.  This above all, read this.   And when you find yourself in the bottom of an inescapable canyon of despair, read:    A Night of Watching.   And remember this from Rev. Niemoller, Protestant Minister during Nazi times:    First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist. Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a trade unionist. Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew. Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.   And then volunteers of the BSA craft arguments that support the Ku Klux Klan?   Anyone here have ever heard of a slight-framed guy named "Korematsu?"   (All of the titles above are from my library, which I have read.  Babi Yar twice.  And there are many more not mentioned.)
    • I am not a fan of requiring earning Honor Patrol to count PL toward rank advancement. To much is outside of the control of the Scout.  I had a patrol that would have not been able to achieve this and they were very good. It was a six member patrol of older scouts (5 of which achieved Eagle Scout), all had recently earned Star rank together. Their PL would have failed because none achieved Life Scout within the next 6 month period . They also had no chance to grow unless we broke up another patrol (in which case the PL's PoR would not have counted) so they could not grow. Now with the rule of 2 - 21+ registered leaders makes doing patrol outings extremely difficult.  I have no problem setting a standard, but it should be a standard that does not reply so much on the efforts of others. 
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