Scoutmaster Conf. ?

[Region 7 Voyageur 10]

I am asking Bob White, or anyone with an answer that can be backed up:

 

Can a Scoutmaster retest a scout during a Scoutmaster Conference?

[KA6BSA 10]

Your question is retest the boy because he couldn't remember something and needed a minute to compose his thoughts? Or he got a knot all tangled up and needed a second try to be successful? Or start all over and do a completely new SM comference right after the first one... for what reason? If the boy is unprepared it would be good for him to understand the value of "Be Prepared" and go home to work on his skill and knowledge some more and return when he is ready. I think this question is at the judgement of the Scoutmaster, but a good one will know how to make a failed conference become a "learning process" to help the boy be encouraged to follow through to earn his rank. In doing that they may have "given away the answers" and retesting immediately doesn't seem fair. And the boy does not learn the value of Be Prepared.

[Bob White 20]

The answer can be found in the Boy Scout Handbook page 11 and the Scoutmaser Handbook page 120.

 

Read those two sections and then tell me how they relate to your question.

 

Bob

 

KA6BSA, you might want to read those sections as well(This message has been edited by Bob White)

[FScouter 24]

Page 11 of the Boy Scout Handbook explains to the boy what he should expect at a Scoutmaster conference. The advancment chapter in the Scoutmaster Handbook has an in-depth discussion about what should be covered during the Scoutmaster conference and how to approach it. There's a lot of good information there, and nothing at all about testing the boy again.

[Laurie 10]

Boy Scout Handbook: no mention of retesting; focus seems to be on reveiwing the experience, helping set goals, and developing a relationship with the SM.

 

Scoutmaster Handbook: Again, no reference is made to retesting or even to testing during a SM conference. The four steps are 1) a Scout learns, 2) a Scout is tested, 3) a Scout is reviewed (SM Conference then BOR), and 4) a Scout is recognized. In bold print under BOR, it is stated that the board is not to retest. That isn't said in the SM conference portion.

 

Troop Committee Guidebook: "The purpose of the conference is to ensure that the Scout is ready for his board of review." No mention of testing here either.

 

To me this seems to leave the door open to retest at the SM Conference, but I'd also like to hear more. What is the difference between reviewing and retesting?

[FScouter 24]

Didn't mean to step on Bob. Guess we're on the same "page". I'd just add that a boy prepares for his Scoutmaster conference by completing the other requirements for the rank. There's not much else that he needs to prepare for unless it would be to think about questions he may want to ask, or to suggest ways to make the troop better.

[Region 7 Voyageur 10]

I asked the original question because I have witnessed retesting in a local unit. The scoutmaster will often have a rope in hand when a scout presents himself for a conference. A retest of knots and lashings follows. I have even seen this at a SM conference for Star or Life ranks. The scoutmaster has the position that he has to make sure that basic scout skills are known by the higher ranking scouts. I have been troubled by this but I want to be on firm ground when I voice opposition to the practice.

[Bob White 20]

Laurie, you really need to read page 120 of the Scoutmaster handbook where it outlines the elements and purpose of the Scoutmaster Conference, and you need to attend or read the syllabus for Scoutmaster Leader Specific training.

 

Think about this...if one purpose of the SM conference is to prepare the scout for the BOR, and the BOR is not allowed to retest...then what would be the purpose of the scoutmaster retesting the Scout? The SM prepares the scout by explaining to him the BOR process and telling him the kinds of things he should be thinking about be fore he goes in. The Scoutmaster should remind him to be on time, wear his uniform correctly, have his handbook, be ready to answer questions about his character, behavior and suggestions for improving the troop program.

 

The only time retesting appears in the advancement policies and procedures is after the words "cannot". Retesting is not an element of the BSA advancement program, period.

(This message has been edited by Bob White)

[KA6BSA 10]

I went and read the BSA books as Bob suggested. Now from Region 7 Voyager's last comment I see we have been discussing the wrong kind of "re-testing." So the question is about reviewing previous lower-rank materials with a boy going for a higher-rank conference. I think the best ways to make sure the boys retain the earlier knowledge is for the more advanced boys to do the teaching of this material to the new Scouts. Then this question of retesting won't even come up. And certainly the SM has better ways of spending the time at the conference on current progress.

[Bob White 20]

The best ways to get scouts to retain skills is through a planned program where they are given opportunities to practice and apply their skills regularly.

[Laurie 10]

I personally don't consider review the same as retest. It seems that everything in the SM book on page 120, which I did read, is about developing a relationship between the Scout and the SM. It would seem to be a time to express concerns, goals, likes and dislikes, a time to encourage the Scout and get to know him better as the Scout gets to know the SM better. This is not what I have seen in practice though, and I've not yet attended any Scout training (just Cub training), but it seems as though the word review is used as retest by some. That's what I've seen, and that's why I asked the question.

[Region 7 Voyageur 10]

Thank you all for your replies and discussion. What Laurie said about "review is used as retest by some" described the situation that I have been observing. What Bob White said about being given the opportunities to practice and apply their skills regularly is the real solution to assuring that scouts retain knowledge and skills.

 

I have work on my hands to try to get these past practices changed.