One more committee question

[Scoutingmama 10]

I hope you don't mind one more new committee chair question.

 

Since we started our troop last Nov. it has been our goal to start a Den/Pack. When you have a Pack, does the exisiting committee oversee the Pack too? This is how I invision it: Committee meeting with Pack info shared- then seperate meetings for BS only and Den only business. Am I wrong?

 

Also, if the plan is to start a Pack in August ( I believe we have a Den Master volunteer), what else whould the committee be doing right now to prepare?

[hotdesk 10]

The Boy Scout Troop Committee would not oversee the new Cub Scout Pack. These are two seperate units with two seperate leadership teams. If some of the adults wanted to register with both units, and the Chartered Organization allowed this, that would be fine. The only similarity might be the Chartered Organization. Remember that each has its own unique needs which will require dedicated volunteers.

 

 

If you wanted to start a pack in August then you should be talking to your District Executives for help on starting a new unit. They will help your Chartered Organization understand the requirements for this new unit and perhaps identify leadership for the new unit. The next step would be to recruit both scouts and adults to register in the new unit (remember that Cub Scouts go all the way from First Grade through Fifth Grade). Like I said start with talking to your District Executives who will be more than willing to help you with the process.

[Lisabob 13]

Speaking as a district membership chair (it is our job to help get new units going, at least in my council it is): Not only will your DE be delighted to help you because this is a criterion upon which his/her success is judged, your district membership committee should be too. Ask them for assistance promoting the new pack, helping organize cub round-ups, getting the first couple of meetings going, etc.

 

We have several charter orgs that sponsor a pack and a troop. In no case do the pack and troop share a committee, although in some cases they have a couple of adult members in common. I think it could quickly become overwhelming to attempt to have the same people in charge of both. And the needs of each unit will be different, may sometimes even conflict. So separate committee identities are a "must" in my view.

 

I strongly recommend as well that you and whoever else are planning to get in on the ground floor of starting a new cub pack, take Cub Leader Training first. It will help you get the pack off to a solid start and avoid unnecessary confusion about structure of the units and function of different adult positions (like Den Leader and Cub Master).

 

I think it is great that you plan to get a pack going! Please keep in mind though, that as the pack matures, they will take on a separate "personality" from your troop, and also that they don't exist merely to serve as a feeder to your troop. I've seen some start-ups where the folks in charge expected this, and were angry when some of "their" cubs chose other troops to join.

[Beavah 205]

Yah, Scoutingmama, you guys just make an old Beavah want to cheer! Way to be thinkin' strategically about your program!

 

I do know a few CO's where multiple units are run with a joint committee, though it's more common at the older boy levels, eh?

 

The problem is this. Boy Scouting and Varsity and Venturing all work based on youth leadership, coached by an adult. So at those levels, the daily activities and some or most of the planning are done by the kids and unit leaders without the committee, leavin' the committee to be more like a true Board of Directors. Cub Scoutin', on the other hand, is led and run by adults. So Cub Committees typically have a lot of operations work to do - planning the details of the Rain Gutter Regatta, getting set up for the family camping trip, etc.

 

So cub committees spend most of their time in operations, handling the details of the refreshments for the next pack meetin'. That's way too much load to do jointly, and it sets the wrong tone for the older programs. Unfortunately, it also means that Cub Committees are like Scoutmasters... they spend their time in the daily operations and a bit in mid-range plannin', but nobody at all is doin' the rest of mid-range planning, long-range planning, or thinkin' about vision.

 

I think you're goin' to need a dedicated cub committee for the operation stuff, even if yeh call it somethin' different. But then yeh need to think about how your troop committee or CO can provide deeper, mid- to long-range support for your cub program. Maybe that's a joint committee for those things (like leadership recruiting/selection/training, etc.), and then a separate "operations committee" for the cubs. I think that could be quite strong, and help avoid some of the classic cub pack mistakes like appointing "any warm body" to important program roles just because nobody is handling that longer-term view. One of the toughest things for cub packs is that turnover is pretty high, and havin' a long-range committee workin' that problem would be a real strength.

 

Now... deep breath! I don't want to damp your enthusiasm, but be careful about doin' too much too fast, eh? Startin' a new troop is a lot of work. Startin' a cub pack at the same time runs a risk of burnin' the candle at both ends and the middle, eh? I think what you're thinkin' is great, but don't kill all your golden goose volunteers by settin' up too much work for 'em.

 

Last thing to store in the back of your brain - husband/wife SM/CC teams are a real risk, and somethin' a lot of us discourage. Even when you're both doin' your best, the thing that can happen is that the two of you have natural, daily "backchannel" communication, eh? Nobody else gets to see those conversations, understand the reasoning, or participate. So it's really easy for the two of you to show up with a set of understandings/decisions/plans that don't have "buy in", eh? And that really harms the group, and makes 'em think your family is unfairly controlling things. Be aware of that. Consciously try to avoid it. And try to plan for rotating out of the CC job in 2 years. One of the best things yeh can give your troop is the experience of orderly and friendly transition of leadership.

 

Beavah

 

[Scoutingmama 10]

Talked with the DE this am and will pick up chartering paper work this afternoon. Now to see if we can get the Committee members and adults to step up. We already have about 10 boys chompin' at the bit! I will ask about Cub Leader training then- nothing on the Council web site with dates.

 

Bevah, again advice well taken. Most of those that have volunteered to help with the Pack so far- do not have a BS yet. Only two of us on the current committee will potentially have boys in both the Pack and the troop.

 

So far the back channel communication has not been an issue because most of our committee has not had previous scouting experience, so what has been happening is that the system is currently running kinda backward in that when a decision has to be made, the committee members want to know what SM desires as he had the original vision for the troop. I know that is not the committee/SM relationship in a "perfect world", but that is how it has been working. This communication issue is why I am desperate to get all of these policies on paper. As the committee stands now I don't think there will be an issue, but as it continues to grow- it might become one.

 

Two years is sound advice and I feel we can have most of the foundaton/policy issues worked out by then.

 

Thanks again.

 

 

 

 

[Lisabob 13]

Scoutingmama, glad to hear it is working out so well so far for you. A quick recommendation - before you get too wrapped up in writing a bunch of policies, look very closely at those policies and guidelines already in existence from the BSA - for both the cub and the boy scout units. Many times, well-meaning individuals go about writing unit by-laws and policies that prove to be a) redundant and/or b) in opposition to the way the BSA program is actually organized. These can take on a life of their own and become a major source of headaches down the line.

 

About training - if you have a bunch of people who need training and the district and/or council isn't offering it anytime soon, contact your district training chair and ask him or her to come to your unit and conduct a training session specifically for you. Having all your adults present at the same training session together can be really helpful. And in the meantime, don't forget to make good use of the BSA's online training material, which is actually pretty decent. IMO - Every new adult (even just parents) should be encouraged to go through the Fast Start training and Youth Protection at the bare minimum. These can be done together or at home, and don't take long.

 

Good luck!

[John-in-KC 311]

One thing to think about:

 

Working two different units as a Committee means extra burden to the worker bees. In start-up units, that means more time. Your volunteers are going to be on a healthy learning curve as it is.

 

That said, there is no reason not to have the Chartered Partner support two units. The COR, as keeper of the vision, can be the lynchpin in this.

 

BTW, and this feels important to me: Please remember that just because units share numerals and chartered partners does not guarantee the Cubs will naturally migrate to the Troop. In fact, there is nothing at all stopping them from going wherever they want. From my experience, the quality of the program delivered at the Boy Scouting level is the secondmost strong determining factor in boys migrating up.

 

What's the strongest factor? It's a negative, actually: Urinating and defecating contests between the adults. I've seen it happen more than once Promoting solid adult interrelationships may not get you more boys, but it will certainly help keep those you have from running away.(This message has been edited by John-in-KC)

[Scoutingmama 10]

Lisabob,

Can you direct me to these:

 

A quick recommendation - before you get too wrapped up in writing a bunch of policies, look very closely at those policies and guidelines already in existence from the BSA - for both the cub and the boy scout units. Many times, well-meaning individuals go about writing unit by-laws and policies that prove to be a) redundant and/or b) in opposition to the way the BSA program is actually organized. These can take on a life of their own and become a major source of headaches down the line.

 

 

I can never find anything on the BSA National site!

 

[Lisabob 13]

I don't care much for the BSA national website either! Best place to find these is in the Cub Leader's Handbook and the Committee and Scoutmaster's Handbook, depending on whether we're talking cub pack or troop. (At the troop level, I also strongly recommend you read through the patrol leader's book and the plain old boy scout handbook - lots of useful stuff in those, even though they are written for the boys). You can buy all of these at your local scout shop. I am not aware of them being on line.

 

However, you can get at least some of the info from these handbooks in the various leader trainings available through the BSA online learning center, here: http://olc.scouting.org/ (You can do fast start training for packs and troops, youth protection training, and troop committee challenge training here, all of which should give you a good feel for the programs you are about to start)

 

There is also the Guide to Safe Scouting, which is online and which lays out some boundaries for what is/is not permissible or advisable. It is easy to get "lost" in the G2SS though and some parts are not as clearly written as they might be, leading to differences of opinion about what they mean, FYI. Here's a link to the online G2SS: http://www.scouting.org/HealthandSafety/GSS/toc.aspx

 

 

 

 

[hotdesk 10]

I would hope that in a pack the Committee Chairman could work on long-range goals and planning while the Cubmaster and Assistant Cubmaster worry about program details.

 

In older pack there are often going to be Pack Trainers and Den Leader Coaches who have been there and done that who are able to provide great resources for pack leadership.

 

Both units should have someone in charge of their Membership Recruitment. In our district there are usually 2 or 3 annual recruitment events for Cub Scouts where the district works with the unit's membership coordinator in recruiting new scouts.

 

The Pack Committee can and should be built to help with program and long-range stuff. The key is going to be getting a lot of adult participation.