Eamonn 61 Posted October 14, 2009 Share Posted October 14, 2009 Have to admit that since I'm not as active as I once was, I don't keep up with things like I used to. The other day a forum member and myself were exchanging emails. He mentioned the Trainer's Code of Conduct. Me being the twit that I am, thought he was talking about the Wood Badge Course Directors Pledge; we were talking about Wood Badge. Needless to say I got it wrong! He was indeed talking about this Trainer's Code of Conduct. Thanks to Google I found this Trainer's Code of Conduct. On the last page of the Trainer's EDGE syllabus. http://www.scouting.org/filestore/pdf/26-242.pdf As I read this Trainer's Code of Conduct, my first thought was that somebody needs to get a life! To my way of thinking stuff like this is just way over the top and does little to help get anything done. Eamonn Link to post Share on other sites
shortridge 184 Posted October 14, 2009 Share Posted October 14, 2009 Invented codes, bylaws, pledges, vows - anything above and beyond the Scout Oath, Law, Motto and Slogan are all over the top. They're generally developed by well-meaning but out-of-touch people who have an inflated sense of importance of what they do, and thus try to surround themselves with the trappings of importance to reinforce that. Link to post Share on other sites
emb021 16 Posted October 14, 2009 Share Posted October 14, 2009 Sorry, don't agree. the BSA has had a 'trainer code of conduct' for decades. AFAIK, its printed in the Training Committee booklet. The fact is, too many trainers lose sight (or never had it) as to what their job is. Such code helps make sure we all keep in mind what we should do as trainers. Link to post Share on other sites
Eamonn 61 Posted October 14, 2009 Author Share Posted October 14, 2009 "Such code helps make sure we all keep in mind what we should do as trainers." I really don't have a problem with what I might call a friendly reminder of what has to be done and how to go about getting it done. My problem is the way it is written. Like it's some add on to the Oath and Law. If we feel that the person selected to present the training's can't do the job? Maybe we need to look at how we are selecting the person? What's next signing a document in blood? Ea. Link to post Share on other sites
shortridge 184 Posted October 14, 2009 Share Posted October 14, 2009 I won't disagree with you - job descriptions are essential. But that "code of conduct" seems to me to be just a high-falutin' bunch of mush. It's not a job description. If a trainer really needs to be told this -- "Trainers refrain from interjecting or interrupting another trainers presentation. Trainers display good manners to all others. Trainers display a gracious attitude toward others." -- then they have no business being a trainer in the first place. I mean, that's just basic manners. And this? "I promise to Be Prepared for all sessions to assure an exciting and worthwhile training experience." Does a grown man or woman really need to to agree to live by a "Trainers' Creed" to get them to do something that every Tenderfoot Scout should do automatically? Link to post Share on other sites
emb021 16 Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 "Does a grown man or woman really need to to agree to live by a "Trainers' Creed" to get them to do something that every Tenderfoot Scout should do automatically?" Considering some of the horror stories I see and hear regarding training, I think you do need something like this. A good example was one I heard of someone presenting a training session that runs 5 hours, and they did it in 3. Hmmm, think they might have skipped over stuff? And this was done by the local 'expert'. Riiight. Link to post Share on other sites
trainerlady 10 Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 Emb021 I'm an instuctor for an internationally recognized organization and have been for 20 years. Over the years I've learned how to teach a program scheduled to last 6 hours in just over 4 hours. My students get all the time to practice their skills that they want, can ask all the questions they want and feel comfortable with their knowledge when they leave my classroom. How do I do it? I stick to the program, don't embellish with my own stories, and make sure I have enough equipment for each student - they don't have to share. By doing this I cut the required practice time by up to 2/3s. This allows more Q&A time, and time for what the scedule doesn't include (potty breaks). In the end I have happier students that are capable in the skills I've taught. Most "canned" programs (ones that have a script to follow and some sort of AV materials that go with the scipt) have a course timeline that allows for any and every problem to occur during the class. You know the kind, CPR, first aid classes, driver's training, etc. If your experienced and prepared, you can often head off a problem before it occurs. "Canned" programs also tend to be extremely repetitve, a great way to actually lose your students. So your "expert" may be just that, someone that has delivered the program so many times that he can shorten the timeframe and not lose anything in the process. Link to post Share on other sites
eghiglie 10 Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 I had started doing training for leaders. I thought it would be fun to share my knowledge. The book said the SM fundamentals class was supposed to last eight hours with lunch, we did it in five because there were only 3 people in the class and 3 teachers. We ate lunch during the class. We were told after the fact that we should cancel for that small of a group. A few day later the leader of the course got an call from the training director from Council who said we were wrong for not having everyone stay the full time even if there was nothing to do. The person threatened to revoke the cards we issued. The only training I do now is the JLT/TLT within my troop. Link to post Share on other sites
Eamonn 61 Posted October 15, 2009 Author Share Posted October 15, 2009 I'm willing to admit that I while Council Training Chair. Selected a couple of people who did a really bad job. They didn't get to do it twice! (I made some changes to the way I went about selecting and preparing the people who would be doing presentations.) I really don't think this Creed would have changed the way these guys did their job. Poor presentations and poor training's are the fault of the District and Council Training Chairs. It is up to these chairs to select and train the people who will be doing the trainings. We seem both able and willing to do this with the people selected to staff Wood Badge courses. For myself, I didn't have any problem with the Course Directors Pledge. It didn't have the "Add ons" and wasn't dressed up to look like an add on to the Oath and Law. Ea. Link to post Share on other sites
shortridge 184 Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 What is the Course Director's Pledge? I haven't been able to find it online. Link to post Share on other sites
JFL49 10 Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 eghiglie, Thank you for running the course with 3 participants. Canceling ANY course, even with low attendance, is a bad idea. It sets a miserable precedent Course lengths are best estimates, depending upon attendance, number of instructors, weather, all sorts of things. Sitting idle until the clock reaches the end of the "scheduled" time will virtually guarantee that those participants will never sign up for a future course, and will also chase off good instructors. Go have a chat with your District or Council Training Chair, about your experience. Hopefully they will see the light. Link to post Share on other sites
John-in-KC 311 Posted October 15, 2009 Share Posted October 15, 2009 You just have to love bloody fools who believe in training to time, not to standard! eghiglie, I'm afraid my responses to your training director would have been not friendly, not courteous, and not kind. Scathingly sarcastic, telling him where he blow the smoke would have been more like it. That man is an epic example of why too much training in BSA is garbage. OH!!! Thank you as well for doing the training, although there be but 3 there. Link to post Share on other sites
emb021 16 Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 If, due to a smaller class or what have you, a trainer is able to cover the course completly, and happens to do it in a short time, so be it. I have no problems with that. If, due to cutting corners, leaving stuff out, etc, a trainer comes in under time, there are problems with that. (and the problem isn't coming under time). There is a difference. I would think most of us would understand the difference. Link to post Share on other sites
sherminator505 10 Posted October 16, 2009 Share Posted October 16, 2009 "Invented codes, bylaws, pledges, vows - anything above and beyond the Scout Oath, Law, Motto and Slogan are all over the top." Perhaps, but Scouting seems to have more than a few of them! I would include the Trainer's Creed (most recently seen in the Trainer's EDGE syllabus), the Eagle Challenge, and the Outdoor Code as examples, although I've probably overlooked at least a dozen. Link to post Share on other sites
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