Duty To God?

[DenLeaderDad 10]

HELP!

 

My Wolf Scout is begging me to help him complete Achievement 11, "Duty To God". My problem is that I just don't know what that means? As a child and a teen I always went to church with my family and had become quite involved with church activities. Then I met the Pastor's daughter, married her and eventually divorced. Throughout that whole process (the divorce part), there was so much ugliness at our church that my family ended up changing churches and I just ended up leaving church altogether. That's the past. Now the present. I did meet and eventually marry my current wife with which we have 2 sons. Hence the reason that I'm involved in Scouting. My problem, however, is that I still have a bad taste in my mouth for religion and "Duty to God".

 

Does anyone have any suggestions on how I can help my son to complete this Achievement? I think that if we suddenly start going to church my son will realize that we are doing it solely for him to complete his Achievement and he'll get the wrong impression about what the Achievement is supposed to be about.

 

Any help would be helpful and very much appreciated.

[Laurie 10]

DenLeaderDad,

 

Welcome to these forums! You don't need to answer me, but do ask yourself this: how do you define God? How do you define your belief in God? As a leader, you signed an application, and in doing that, you have agreed that you believe in God. That will be defined differently by different people and different faiths; the BSA has allowed for the differences though it does allow for God to be optional. The important thing is to first be able to define God for yourself; they you will be better able to help your son. As for the specific requirement, I'd have to look at it, but I've got 3 kids asking me questions at the moment I commend you for seeking a better understanding for your son's sake, especially when this is a tough area for you.

[acco40 95]

Let's look at the requirements:

 

DUTY TO GOD - Do the following:

 

1) Talk with your folks about what they believe is their duty to God.

 

2) Give some ideas on how you can practice or demonstrate your religious beliefs.

 

3) Find out how you can help your church, synagogue, or religious fellowship.

 

The first one should be a piece of cake. Be honest with your son about what you feel is your duty to God. There is no wrong answer. Same for your wife.

 

The second one will require some thought from your son but with your guidance, again it should be easy.

 

For the third, if by "church" you meant your local church, i.e. St. Mary's Church on 4th and main as opposed to The Roman Catholic Church, simply have your son find out how he may help the Catholic Church. The third may be tricky if you feel you do not belong to any organized religion. Then, I suggest that you discuss what you feel is your "church" and discuss with your son how he could help it (show respect to the environment, be kind to his fellow man, etc.) Remember, he has to find out how he can help it, not help it per se. If you do not believe in a higher being or beings (i.e. do not profess a belief in God) then Scouting may have a problem with you! In that case, you need to discuss what your son's present beliefs are and act accordingly.

[dsteele 20]

Excellent post, Acco.

 

I think the third part of the requirement is left vague deliberately. In reading it and thinking of my own life, I would have to consider my religious fellowship to be myself and my wife. We are both very religious, but I'm not much for church attendance.

 

Before I forget, Laurie left out a three letter word that is very important when she said "the BSA . . . God is optional." No offense to Lauie, but the word she left out is "not."

 

Her intent was good and she is correct, there is room in the BSA for flexibility in religous matters. The intent of the requirement is to get parents involved in open discussions with their children in matters of their personal beliefs, family beliefs and other important parts of spiritual development.

 

DS

[Bob White 20]

Hi Denleaderdad,

i have sent you a private message. Please check your mail.

BW

[Laurie 10]

Oh my! No offense taken, Dave, and thank you for catching that. I did indeed mean "not optional".

[DenLeaderDad 10]

I didn't mean to start a Holy War!

 

I'd like to thank all those who responded to my message for help in understanding what "Duty To God" is. In reading your responses it has made me realize that maybe I didn't quite express myself clearly. I DO belive that there is a "higher power" greater than myself (I know, sounds like an AA meeting). Do I call that "higher power" God. ??? That is the queston that I've struggled with for the last 15 years. Sometimes I feel like the child that wakes up one morning only to realize that their "belief" in Chris Cringle or the Tooth Fairy is not real, the sudden conclusion that those figures were concocted just to explain certain events or holidays. I guess over the years I found it easier to resond to people that ask if I belive in God by saying yes, rather than trying to explain myself as to why I don't feel the need to attend or belong to any church which is where my real problem lies. I suppose I just got tired of seeing people claiming their beliefs in God on Sunday and then Monday through Saturday it was every man for himself. In my own situatiion this attitude was not only with the church members but also the church staff.

 

To sum it all up. I suppose if the BSA allows flexibility in religious beliefs by allowing me to believe in my "God", whatever that way may be, without requiring me to actually belong or attend some weekly ritual, then I've got no problem. Right?

 

In Response,

 

Laurie - I spent most of last night searching any BSA websites for any references to my agreement in a "belief in God" as far as my signing a BSA application. I didn't find any. I did, however, find a repeated reference to "subscribes to the BSA statement of religious principle". What is that? I couldn't find any expanded definition of what the "BSA statement of religios principle" is. Does anyone a link to the definition?

 

acco40 - In reading your response I now realize that maybe I was reading too much into the actual achievement, mainly #3. My interpretation was that my son/family would actually need to belong to a church to satisfy this requirement.

 

dsteele - I commend you for being able to be very religious without the neccessity for regular church attendance. It seems to me that too many people equate one with the other so that if you don't attend church regularly then you can't be very religious. Hogwash!

 

Bob - Got your private message. Thank You.

[Laurie 10]

You didn't start a holy war at all--if I made you feel uncomfortable with my response, I apologize.

 

The declaration of religious principle (I think I got the name right--I tend to mess up the exact wording) is on the inside cover of the adult application. If you don't have that handy, let me know and I'll send it to you.

 

I'll say it again: I commend you for doing this with your son. That is key to any requirement in Cubs--families spending time together

[DenLeaderDad 10]

Laurie

 

I don't have any portion of the Adult Leader Application at all. Should I? My son and I signed up earlier in the summer and avoided the "Roundup rush", as I call it. That was a crazy night. Is it always that crazy at Roundups? Kids everywhere, Leaders trying to convince parents to volunteer, etc. I've been told that our Pack has an excellent resource in that one gentleman (who has been involved in Scouting in our particular area for a long time) does most of the Adult recruiting. I've even heard some of the Leaders that he has recruited compare his method as if they were standing at a three card monty table up against the slickest dealer around. (Laughing to myself). I guess he's really good at getting people to volunteer.

Anyhow, if you have the Declaration of Religious Principle, I'd love to read it. (Should have paid better attention the first time).

 

Shoulda, Woulda, Coulda...I guess

[Laurie 10]

I tried responding twice, but each time my computer crashed! If you did not receive the private message, please let me know. I did type up and send what is included on the leader app. The other option you have is to simply ask your unit for an leader app so you can read that page. It's short, and really, all info in it has already been touched on right here.

 

Regards,

Laurie (who is keeping fingers crossed that I don't crash again as I post send!)

 

p.s. Our roundup was chaotic too, and I remember coming home feeling like it lasted a looooong time. And with all our planning, we did forget to give back some leader pages too Check out the forums here; roundup is a topic covered as well as many other parts of the pack program. Good luck!(This message has been edited by Laurie)

[DenLeaderDad 10]

Didn't get your private message Laurie. It surprises me that I can't find the info I'm looking for online. Thanks for your help.

[scoutldr 732]

BSA DECLARATION

OF RELIGIOUS PRINCIPLE

Excerpted: from Adult Registration Application B.S.A. No. 28-501K.

 

 

The Boy Scouts of America maintains that no member can grow into the best kind of citizen without recognizing an obligation to God and, therefore, recognizes the religious element in the training of the member, but is absolutely non-sectarian in its attitude toward that religious training. The Boy Scouts of America's policy is that the home and the organization or group with which the member is connected shall give definite attention to religious life.

Only persons willing to subscribe to this Declaration of Religious Principle and to the Bylaws of the Boy Scouts of America shall be entitled to certificates of leadership.