Terrible dilemma

[janssenil 10]

We've got a very touchy situation brewing in our Pack and really are having a hard time finding the right resolution.

 

We're a small Pack that has had a hard time filling all positions. Right now my husband who is the Committe Chair is filling in as Cub Master because our Cub Master had to quit as of June (he moved). Since that time the Den Leader for our Tiger Cubs stepped up to become Cub Master officially beginning in December. He's divorced and his wife has full custody of his son. After a little coaxing on our part, he decided to step up to the position because he found it to be a great way to spend time with his son.

 

I will try not to fill this post with tons of detail so, long story short, his ex-wife has decided she and her new husband want to become more active in the meetings. His son, a Wolf this year, is one of 20 Wolfs. When we discovered we had that many Wolfs this year the two new Den Leaders divided them up by cutting the list in half alphabetically (A thru J in Den 1 and K thru Z in Den 2). The Cub Master's son (I'll call him Joe) landed in Den 2 and his cousin landed in Den 1. Mother has decided she wants to go to Den 1 meetings so Joe can be with his cousin and to avoid being around 'new Cub Master' along with a few other petty reasons like location. In the meantime, to complicate matters even more 'new Cub Master' has discovered that Joe's Den 2 Den Leader needs assistance so he volunteers to be his "helper." Unbeknownst to everyone involved, Mom & Stepdad go to the Den 1 meeting even though new Cub Master expected Joe to be at Den 2 meeting. Both meetings are on the same night in two different locations. After he figures out what's happening he goes to the location of Den 1 and trys to straigten things out (quietly). Mom won't even let him talk to his son so he calls us very upset.

 

It's now a no-win situation. Mom tells us she will take Joe out of Cub Scouts if we refuse to put Joe in Den 1 which she can do because she has full custody. If that occurs 'New Cub Master' will quit also. If we allow Joe to go to Den 1, 'new Cub Master' will quit as his whole reason for being involved is because of his son.

 

Mom & Step-Dad tell us they started taking Joe to Scouts last year as a Tiger Cub until new Cub Master started to get involved. We have, however, never seen them at any Pack Meetings. All we know is that new Cub Master has been extemely involved and was a very successfull Tiger Leader and seems to be a very ambitious Cub Master. We think his ambition is what resulted in 20 Wolves this year. Of course, both sets of parents have their problems (that we really didn't want to know about). Tonight we spent the evening on the phone with Stepdad and Den 1 Den Leader and could not come up with a solution.

Help - how should this be handled?

[Bob White 20]

janssenil,

You raise two problems, but only one is yours (the packs) and that is having enough leaders to deliver a quality program to the boys in your community.

 

Take the family problems happening between the boys parents and put them aside. You are not a judge or a marriage counselor do not try to find a compromise between the parents. Instead, do what serves the boy the best. If the boy wants to be in a den with his cousin, make it happen. If Dad wants to be cubmaster or den leader have him pick ONE. If mom wants to be a den leader let her. Don't put yourself in the middle of their problems. Let them know that you intend to put the needs of their son first, and you expect them to do the same.

 

Don't think that you have a small pack when you have 20 wolves. You do not have a small pack you just need to improve your adult leadership selection process. Get a copy of Foundations for Selecting Unit Leaders from your council service center. Folow the program it lays out for you.

 

By the way you really need to have 3 Wolf Dens. 10 boys in a den is too big.

 

Good Luck,

Bob White

 

[evmori 11]

Bob brings up excellents points! The only thing I can think of is to stick to your guns. You can't let one person dictate how you Pack will be run.

 

Ed Mori

[Twocubdad 665]

The only thing I would add to Bob's suggestions would be to take the three adults outside, line them up and smack them a few good times.

[acco40 95]

My philosophy (not necessarily endorsed by the BSA) it to let the Den leaders (who volunteered) choose who is in their dens. Let them work it out. If the Pack has 20 Wolfs (Wolves?), and each den leader agrees to take seven boys, guess what? The families of the other six need to find another den leader. Boys should not be thrust upon the den leaders.

[SR540Beaver 116]

If a boy has to be moved to make the two kids happy, how about moving the cousin to the den with the CM's son. The boys are together and the dad sees his son.

[evmori 11]

Atta boy, twocubdad! I was thinking along the same line! And after ya smack them around, toss 'em a piece of cheese to go with their whine!

[janssenil 10]

Thanks!! I, too, particularly enjoyed Twocubdad's advice and REALLY wish I could practice it!!

 

So now that we have our priorities straight and begin to soley focus on having having enough leaders to deliver a quality program to the boys in our community, we're still left in a very precarious position - We're going to loose our Cub Master. That in itself could fold the entire Pack, but in addition to that my husband and I are parents of a Webelo II so come December, husband passes the torch then come February I move on, also. The new Committee Chair, due to many other committments (he's an Athletic Director at Jr. High), cannot get involved until late January so New Cub Master was willing to hold down the fort until then. I'm pretty much broken hearted since we've worked extremely hard to leave them in good shape and with sufficient funds.

 

The only way we're going to keep new Cub Master is if Mom & Stepdad realize they are really screwing with their child's mind and relationship with his Dad ALONG WITH THE ENTIRE PACK. They don't care about Scouts; it's all like a big chess game to them. I can't believe there are such shallow people in this world.

 

Anyway.... a few comments. Yes, twenty Wolf's make it seem like it might be a big Pack, but that's a huge jump this year. Last year they were 10 Tigers. We combined 2 schools last year, but it didn't really start showing a difference until this year. The rest of our Dens have 5 or 6 kids at the most. We thought we were lucky to get two Wolf Leaders, but know three would have been ideal. We're also not sure how many are going to really stick with it. I think we've lost two already. We did let the leaders decide how they wanted to set it up and they both said 10 would be fine if parents were involved (way too involved in this case).

 

One thing that you said is part of what I keep pondering and having a hard time with: The Mother is the one who decided she wanted her son with his cousin in a different Den (who knows what the child wanted). It's the Pack (Den Leaders) who decided who should be in each of their Dens. So, altho, there probably is room for Joe to switch due to a dropout, what will we do if other parents want to switch their kids around? Should we keep trying to please everyone or shouldn't we set a policy now before things get crazy?

 

I don't know - it all really makes me want ot run and hide. :-)

[CubsRgr8 10]

I strongly agree with Bob White, you can't and shouldn't even try to mediate between this poor boy's parents. Don't let your fear of losing one volunteer prevent you from providing a good Cub Scouting experience for the other boys in your pack. I also agree that the Wolves need to be split up into three dens. Maybe Joe and his cousin will end up in the den needing leaders, giving Mom & Stepdad the opportunity to put up or shut up.

 

It sounds like Dad thinks he really wants to be a den leader, not a Cubmaster. I would speak with Dad and explain that, as Cubmaster, he will be very involved with his son over the next four years. He will lead Pack meetings, outings, campouts, ceremonies, etc. in which his son participates. He will proudly award his son his awards, ranks, and maybe even his Arrow of Light. His son will beam with pride to see his Dad up in front, a leader and role model not just for him, but for all the boys.

 

I invite Dad to send me a Private Message (use the face/PM icon) and I'll gladly answer any questions about being a Cubmaster. I truly enjoyed being Cubmaster and feel it will "be a great way to spend time with his son."

[matuawarrior 10]

It's sad to see adults use thier children as pawns for their ego trips. I feel for Cubmaster Dad. Scouting is a great way for a Dad and son to invest Quality and Quantity Time together.

 

But, BW is right. Focus on the Pack. 10 Wolves in a Den is to big. I normally like the dens in my Pack to be 5 scouts max.

 

Also, CubsRgr8 mentioned that Cubmaster Dad may have an opportunity to serve long term and still have time to work along side his son.

 

If by adding two more dens would help, place the son and cousin in a new den and ask mom and step-dad to be its leaders. You'll see where their hearts are at if they can't step up. Cubmaster Dad may have an opportunity to step in. But that's just me.

 

Seems to me that mom doesn't like dad to be involved with thier son.

 

I pray that it all works out.

 

 

Matua

[LPasn 10]

Take heart! We had the same situation in our pack several years ago. Dad became Cubmaster then den leader, Mom became den leader, Step-Dad became Committee Chair. The oldest son is now a scout and doing well. The second son is one of twelve Weblos I, Dad is his den leader. Next year he will be with Mom. She is leading the fourteen Weblos II den.

 

If they do not settle this in private, settle it for them by asking that they all step aside for the good of the pack.

[janssenil 10]

Thought I'd let you know how things turned out... Unfortunately, Cubmaster Dad did quit. We really tried to convince him he would still spend a lot of time with his son, but I think he felt like we stabbed him in the back. I've apologized to him several times because it is really sad. He did do many things to help our Pack out. On the other hand, I do remind myself that the problem is really his and his Ex and I have no power over that. We couldn't start a new Den because the attendance at both Dens has dropped to 5 or 6 boys. (We probably should have put the cousin and Joe in one by themselves hehehe).

 

The good news is that one of our Den Leaders stepped up to be Pack Leader and his wife will take his place as Den Leader. So, I guess, all has worked out, but it was an experience I will long remember.

 

I, too, am divorced and remember how painful the experience is, but I have never seen anything as pitiful as this before. They've been divorced at least 2 years and still jab each other whenever possible.

 

Thank you all for responding!! It's WONDERFUL to have your support.