Lightcrow

I wanted to thank everyone for their input up to this point. I think my next move will be to talk to the committee chair and see what his opinion is regarding the situation. I might also call the District Director for his input and sort of "so you know" phone call.

Unfortunately some of the ideas put forth don't work for my troop. We are sponsored by a PTA and our COR has the position in title only and only gets involved to sign recharter papers and new adult applications. She is a nice lady, but has no interest in any deeper level of involvement. And also our Unit Commissioner is an older gentlemen, who is so laid back, he can not see the issues in the troop as being problematic. Again, a nice guy, but really he is getting to the point of not contributing much. So again, thanks for all of your help.

Light Crow

I should also add that the current Scoutmaster has been trained. Him and I also went through Woodbadge together, seperate patrols and the old sylabus. Alright, enough responses from me regarding my own post.

I have told the committee chair before that I want to be a Scoutmaster eventually. I've also mentioned to a couple of committee members and other assistant Scoutmasters that I hope to be a candidate when the current Scoutmaster steps down. I have been met with positive remarks from all three of the people. I have the time, training (old Woodbadge), and experience, so hopefully eventually I will be Scoutmaster.

I am fairly new to this forum and have only answered a few posts, but need some advice from those far more experienced in Boy Scouts than myself. I will need to state up front that I am 22, it seems to be an issue at times with some older Scouters. I have been an assistant Scoutmaster since I turned 18 and am currently the crew Advisor for my troop's crew and a Unit Commissioner in addition to those duties. On top of that I was a youth member, earning my Arrow of Light and Eagle rank.

So here is my problem. My troop (this is not the troop I was a Scout in) went through a Scoutmaster transition two years ago this month. The last guy was a great guy, very good at inspiring the Scouts and other adults. He was what the Scoutmaster handbook says a Scoutmaster should be, but had been doing the job for 8 years. He had the committee start seeking out a new Scoutmaster and the only person who would step forward after a 6 month process was not the top candidate in the troop, but the only one willing to do the job.

It has become painfully aware that he is not able to perform the job and my troop needs to find someone else. The man is very authoritarian and a micro-manager. He does not buy into BSA policy on boy ran and the patrol method. The Scoutmaster also has shown little interest in recruitment and the only people who have stepped forward to address recruitment are myself and the committee chair. The troop rechartered with 75 Scouts 3 years ago, we recharted 51 this past year, and only crossed over 3 Webelos last Spring. The committee chair does not think we will beat our crossover number from last year at this point. Well over half the troop is 14 and older and the active membership is roughly 20 Scouts.

It is painfully clear the current status quo must change. Any input anyone in this forum could give would be much appreciated. The old Scoutmaster is a semi-active committee member still, if that helps in reaching a solution.

Light Crow

If you look at the Troop Committee Guidebook, there is very little mention of how committee members interact with the youth. I believe one reference is the troop Scribe assisting the committee secretary. In their development as leaders and program the committee plays a minor role at the boy level. The job of the Scoutmaster core is to train the youth leadership, advise them in planning, and be the main adults interacting with the youth membership. The troop committee, in an ideal situation, is in the background and providing support for the decisions reached by the youth. I think whether your outdoor planner should be a member of the Scoutmaster core or the committee would fall on the troop and how it defines the position in its by-laws. It may also be a matter of who was willing to do the position and had the time; that person just turned out to be an assistant Scoutmaster at that time.

I would also like to know why you use the term "commissioned Scouter" in reference to an assistant Scoutmaster. It is my understanding that only commissioners and professional Scouters are "commissioned Scouters." That is because they wear the wreath of service on their position patch.

I am currently serving as the assitant advancement chairman for our district. We use the unit Eagle board style.

1. The Eagle projects are approved by someone delegated to by the chairman with just that responsbility on the committee. Any one of us can approve them, but in practice he usually handles all of them.

2. We only send one representative to the Eagle board of review.

Our district policy is that a Scout gets to determine all the members of his board. The district advancement member makes sure the policy from national is followed on who can serve. In my experience of doing these, the Scout usually makes very good selection of people to serve. The last Eagle board I was on was comprised of all the scout's former Scoutmasters and his local parish priest. I definately wouldn't have picked such a difficult crowd for my Eagle board.

In fact mine was a district Eagle board when I went up for it. They used to hold them once a month and usually had three boards in a row. I had no clue who the men were that ran it and to this day do not remember their names. I would say that both ways work well. The real rememberence time for me was my court of honor and I got to have all the people involved with it that I liked.

According to the recharting info in the Unit Commissioner Fieldbook for Unit Serice the COR can also register as the Committee Chair or as a committee member. For whatever reason the COR is not allowed to be the Scoutmaster. I suppose the council registar's computer would have a red flag go off if the COR tried to register themself as SM. COR's should be encouraged to attend as many troop committee meetings and troop meetings as possible. The COR is a unit level position (part of the unit key three), but also sits on the District Committee as a voting member. (How many districts actually try to encourage COR participation on the District Committee?)

Registering to be a Unit Commissioner does not create conflict on the level of BSA saying you can not be *registered* as a UC and also as COR. The assigntment of this COR/UC to a troop is done by the District Commissioner or one of their assistants.

To get back to a solution to the original problem at hand though. It would be bad poitics to ask the District Commissioner to remove your unit COR as the UC over that troop. First I would call the Dist. Commissioner and ask who is assigned to your unit as the UC. I would then take the district professional aside and voice my concerns over the arrangement of the COR being the UC. Fill him in on your troop problems and need for an outside opinion. He/She already probably has the opinion a UC should not be a member of the troop they service.

I hope that helps.

In my experience a diversified camp staff was the best thing. When I worked a camp in Alaska last summer most of the senior staff was from a different state in the lower 48 and we each brought ideas from our home camps to build the program.

I wanted to clarrify some of the information posted on the Tribe of Mic-O-Say in this thread. I have been a warrior in the tribe for 4 years and helped build a daughter program in our local council two years ago. I have also been in the OA for ten years, am a Brotherhood member and former lodge officer. Just to make sure you know I have a firm grasp of both programs.

The Tribe of Mic-O-Say was founded in the 1920's in Pony Express Council by legendary Scout Executive H. Roe Bartle. To make a long story short, he had some connections with a Native American from the northern planes who gave him the name Lone Bear. He then started the summercamp program at Camp Geiger in St. Joseph, MO. Bartle ran the program for a few years before taking the Scout Executive position in Kansas City, Heart of America Council. Bartle again started the tribe up in the council camp that was later renamed H. Roe Bartle Scout Reservation in Osceola, MO. Bartle himself served as the Chief of the Tribe for many years after that and eventually retired from Scouting to become KC mayor.

Today the Tribe is still operating at Camp Geiger and Bartle Scout Reservation each summer. It is a summercamp program and has no ceremonies or activities that occur during the rest of the year. The original poster is correct that it is geared more towards personal development and not as an outdoor camping society, like O.A. I have witnessed dedication equal to, if not greater in members of Mic-O-Say than I have in any Arrowmen.

National BSA has attempted on several occassions to take Mic-O-Say natioal. I have even heard the rumor they approached H. Roe Bartle first about the program and was turned down, so they went with O.A. The Tribe draws more older Scouts back than any troop in our area and I am told made Bartle one of the premier Scouting camps in the country. I am a little biased, but then it is a great program that I have seen change many young men, myself included.

Light Crow