jens3sons

As a pack we are also going to be having our first camp out this spring. Talking with another CM that our 2 packs have done a couple activities with, I heard their pack does a "movie under the stars". Although, I would prefer to just star gaze myself, I have heard it is a HUGE hit, and all the children were quiet by 8pm and you couldn't hear a pin drop! Like I said, it is not an idea I am overly fond of, but thought I would pass the suggestion on anyways (especially if doing the 2 nights, might need something different to do one of the nights). Happy Camping!

Jennifer

Torveaux, Although I am not into sewing or crafty in that manner, I was thinking of 2 possible options. I believe there is printer paper that becomes an iron-on-transfer, so an image could be downloaded, and then printed on the transfer. My second option would be to use a t-shirt with a logo on it cut into patch size and shape to be sewn on it.

Also, if instead you would prefer the brag vests, we have found someone in the pack who sews, and we make them ourselves for a lot cheaper than the ones that can be purchased in the scout shops.

Jennifer

Zippie...does the COR really have to be there? Every year we invite the COR, past CM and CC and anyone from district who can come, but if they can't come, they can't come, and they know they were at least thought of by the invitation. We are not a HUGE pack (47 boys) but between boys, parents and siblings there would be no way everyone could agree on a 2nd date. As long as you still have your location for B & G, I would go ahead with your plans and explain to the COR that although you would've loved it if he/she could've been present, there was just no other feasible day to have it, and maybe they could attend another pack meeting/outing instead. Best of luck!

My son's den was responsible for researching the 40's for old photos for our B & G centerpiece. I also found the Norman Rockwell pictures to be the best. Some other hints are look on e-bay and also do some google searches such as "Scouting 1940's" or Scouting during WWII. Good Luck, I found it a very difficult task!

Scout Nut has some great ideas, but the one he gave you...(I can tell you from experience of going to that website during my search) the only way to get those pictures is to print out the page, it will not let you copy any image on that site. Best of Luck!

zippee...I would NOT suggest getting every parent trained. That will just be one more deterant(sp?) to joining for the parents time commitment.

One thing we always do, is invite the kindergarten boys to attend the PWD, it gives them a chance to see one of the "big" moments in the scouting year, and gets them excited to join.

I'm sure most haven't heard this, but National is VERY concerned about the #'s of boys dropping out after their Tiger year of scouting. I am in one of two councils nationwide that is in the middle of a pilot program that does NOT require the parent to attend den meetings, only the outing for the month. (It is thought, that the parents think the time commitment will be the same for other scouting years, not realizing they don't need to attend the meetings like they had to during Tiger year.) At the begining of the next scouting year in the fall we are supposed to fill out surveys etc on how the year went for us and how many boys we have retained. It is the hope that the parents having a feel for how the rest of their scouting years will be, might retain some of these boys. I come from a pack of 48 boys, and 9 of those are currently Tiger cubs, and so far I haven't heard any complaints about time frustrations or boys dropping out. If this goes well it will become the new standard much like the Tigers now wearing the blue shirt instead of the orange ones.

As for the committee. You are right on track for having parents attend the meetings. We require at least one parent from every den to attend so all the dens are well informed, and I don't have to track everyone down and have a meeting all over again on the phone with each den leader. We require one parent, but the meetings are open for any and all who have something to say or wish to attend.

One more suggestion...maybe poll the parents and find out why they are dropping out, and then poll the ones that are staying in...maybe that will help you to find out what went right and what could use improving on. Make sure you include questions about recruitment night and if they left it full of knowledge etc.

Good Luck

Jennifer (CC)

Maybe the "proud parent" ribbon with the pins for all the ranks her son has made? They are available at the scout shop. I just picked one up for myself w/ tiger-wolf pins and all four pieces i think maybe cost me $8.00 max. Happy Scouting!

From my understanding, for the pledge, is if you are in uniform you salute. If you are not wearing the hat, the fingers go to right above the right eyebrow, if you are wearing the hat they go to the brim of the cap. No uniform....the hand goes over the heart. I did in the begining find it awkward to do a salute, mostly with what to do with my left arm and hand. I am getting more comfortable with it the more I do it however, and i just keep my left arm straight down and try and square up my shoulders.

As for the uniforms, I wear the tan shirt...personally I don't think many people look good with yellow shirts (its a very difficult color to wear) and I personally look horrible with yellow on. The question of "tucking" was never a question for me as mine has the man tailored bottom to it, so I always tuck it.

Have you talked to your pack committee? When we heard of a boy who wanted to sign up, but money was an issue, we took it under our responsibility to make sure the boy got his shirt, slide and neckercheif and slide and start up patches. The pack although doesn't have a uniform bank per say, the pack has had a few shirts turned in, and there are always neckercheifs and slides that are lost. We as a pack already have someone make up the brag vests and none of the boys pay for that or the patch on that. That is one way the pack welcomes the boys into the pack. We make a big deal of handing out the vests on the boys 2nd pack meeting attending. Other parents in the boy's den are willing to pitch in for his outings etc. Fortunately for our pack we live in a pretty affluent area and quite a lot of the parents are able to handle the costs of another child for the sporting outings we are going to. I don't even know the last time there was a boy who couldn't afford scouting in our pack up until this year, and then shortly after the new year (2005), we had a boy who has been displaced from his home for a fire, and once again the pack came together to make sure his scouting expenses don't exist for the rest of the year, and then also have pitched in by giving things to the family that they need. It was a good learning experience for our pack with both boys about charity, not gossiping, but keeping to what others needed to know and what they don't. One more thought...maybe your charter could help???

-goodoldeagle2- hopefully this will help your "problem". Although I didn't come up with the idea, and didn't orchestrate what was done to resolve it, our Pack definetly benefitted from it. Last Scouting year I only had about 3 boys go on to BSing out of about 13. (Last year was my first yr. as CC and we were still trying to find a permanent CM.) When I finally got a CM one of our top priorities was trying to figure out how to get boys to continue on to BS. What I hadn't really realized at the time was, our council and our district had gone from one of the top to now one of the worst and they were also very concerned about the same thing. The BS were able to maintain their #'s not from Weblos transfering in, but by boys joining troops later on. Our district decided to set up a weblo transition "team". They gave a directory of all the toops to the packs (which made it much easier to try and contact them), and they also set up an open house. They invited all the troops to set up tables and then they invited all Weblos and Bear scouts to the open house to begin checking out troops. This allowed for them to figure out which troops they were most interested in, to then contact them for further investigation on camp outs etc. Although I did have one 2nd yr Weblo den completely disban with 3 months to go to their AOL, the other den invited one of the boys who didn't want to drop-out into their den, and I had all 8 boys from that den end up crossing over all into the same troop. This troop is known for having a 50% rate of boys getting their Eagle! At the begining of this scouting yr I was only told about 3 boys would crossover, and was so surprised to find all 8 boys went on! It may not seem like much, but it sure meant a lot to me and my CM that our concerns were FINALLY being heard and met by our district/council! Happy Scouting!

Jennifer

Me Again...Just to let all of you know, I did email Trail's End and they passed my email to the prize people, who in turn emailed me back to say that from now on they are going to require that no boy orders the pocket knife w/o the Whittl'n Chip.

-EagleInKY...thank you for letting me know they can earn that requirement before they are a Bear Cub. I know a lot of things, but obviously not it all.

-CubsRgr8...I never NOT took any of the responsibility for my end of it. My son has had pocket knives for over a year now, and I would never let him bring them to any scouting function knowing he did not earn the Whittl'n Chip. He has never before needing the stiches, taken out or used the pocket knife w/o either my or his dad's knowledge. He had it out earlier and put it away. With any kids you can't have an eye on them 24/7, and as was the case here, I was in the bathroom and his father downstairs when he pulled it out again w/o us knowing about it. Not all accidents can be blamed on the parents, and some accidents are valuable learning experiences to the kids, such as was the case with this!

ScoutNut, I did some research after your reply to my post. You are right BSA requires 2 deep for only trips and outings. During my training it was stressed so much about 2 deep leadership I thought it applied to everything. Also during my training it was stated that married couples were not considered 2 deep. I can't find anything that says one way or another at the moment...but there are really good reasons for it. Anyways, regardless, this is something our pack believes in, even at den meetings...it doesn't necessarily have to be another leader, but another parent attending the den meeting at minimal. BSA does it's best to set guidelines/requirements for us all, but sometimes it is a good idea to go above and beyond just that.

Laurie, Our pack also is concerned about the patch and the cost, however, our boys did a little better than last year selling popcorn, so the pack is still going to pay for the pack patch. I am not going to be a stickler if EACH boy didn't complete all the requirements either...it was pack earned (I am trying to treat this like the Quality Unit Award...as long as the majority of the pack participates in each of the requirements the pack earned it.) The boys will receive the patch at our B & G banquet. As for all the requirements, it is not like there are forms to be filled out to prove to BSA that the pack has earned the requirements...I think they are just looking for the $ to pay for the patches they have already had made up personally. Best of Luck in your scouting year! jens3sons

Eamonn, Rest assured you are not the only one shocked by the prices of the patches. Like Cardinal, I too couldn't get information in what I thought was a timely manner. I started asking the scout shop and my district for info on the requirements for the 75th anniv. award long before I got info on it. (At the end of the previous scouting year to be exact.) I don't know about anyone else, but that was part of the excitement I used to draw on my parents and boys while I was doing our fall recruitment. I didn't receive any requirements until Nov on it! The program helps made such a big issue about earning it, and yet nothing was said about what the requirements were. (To me it would've made sense to have the requirements w/in the Program Helps instead of wasting so much more $ on additional materials to be sent out...and late into the scouting year if I might add.) I too was also surprised of all the different patches that could be earned (funny about not having one for the pet!)

I think it would be wise for BSA to remember that most Packs run on a VERY tight and next to nothing budget! I am tired of having to ask my parents to continuously chip in for this and that, esp. when this could've been something a lot more reasonably priced if by only reducing the size of the patches!

I see a problem here that no one has addressed...Why is there not 2 deep leadership? I know you mentioned the assistant leader dropped out. It is so important to get someone to replace this position. Without 2 deep leadership, there shouldn't be a den! A reminder about the 2 deep leadership as well....married couples who are both leaders in the same den is NOT considered 2 deep.

Although having 12 boys in one den is a large #, I would consider combining the dens. We have 12 boys alone in one Tiger cub den this year as well. Our split would've also have been 8 and 4 because of location, but because I couldn't get a 5th leader (2 leaders are a married couple, thus not being 2 deep) I used BSA regulations to be my "blame" and forced it to be one den. The benefit...I have 4 very dedicated leaders, and never have to worry about 2 deep leadership, since there is always a back-up person.

(The other factor in our decision was if one or more of the boys dropped out of the smaller den, it would REALLY be a small den, and would probably require combining the two into one next year. However if more boys join as wolves next year, it still gives me the opportunity to split the den into 2.)

Talk to the Cub Master and committee about this and then I would suggest combining the 2 dens and using BSA regulations (even make it that council/district is getting on your case about this if necessary) as the "bad guy" here. No need for you to take the heat for forcing the proper decision here. Good Luck!

I'm sorry, but some if not all of this seems so silly to me. While most questions posted is for knowledge gained, I think it is important to look at the bigger picture. Most posts are for some serious questions on helping to make a pack "go". There are so many issues, one main one is getting volunteers, or serious issues that packs face. Sorry, but requiring the boys to wear the "official" pants or even $10 dress pants from Wal-mart is the least of my concerns. Yes, the official pants and even dress pants really complete the uniform, however, providing a quality program will take the cake anytime over the proper pants to wear.

TundraHawk,

May I suggest asking the VFW or Elk's Lodge in your area to be your charter. Some PTA's and schools are still allowed to charter as well. Any businesses like restaurants may be able to as well. You mentioned you lost your charter, but was your charter also where your meetings were held? If you still have a meeting place, then it shouldn't be that hard to get a business or one of the other things I mentioned to charter you.

Also, if you have time, arichardson71 posted a question starting out "I need some advice..." and there are some replies, including my own that might be beneficial to you as well! The best of luck to you and your pack!

jens3sons

Hi all...I am the mother of 3 boys. A nine year old (now a Bear Scout) and the mom of twin boys who will be Tiger cubs in the fall. I am the Committee Chairperson to our pack and this is my 2nd yr as the CC. I enjoy scouting so much and have made some great friends. Looking Forward to the next 5 yrs as the CC!

Happy Scouting!

jens3sons

Hi All,

I was just wondering if any of you had the same concern I did. I am not an overly-protective parent...I have 3 boys and I let them be boys. My oldest son collects pocket knives, and I didn't think it would be an "issue" to let him earn one. He worked so hard to get the one with the eagle and American Flag on it. As soon as we handed out the popcorn prizes, boys started to open up their knives, and sure enough one boy got cut during the meeting. As soon as I realized what was going on, we made an announcement that they shouldn't open them up until they were home and their parents were supervising them.

No sooner had we gotten home, and my son looked at his with me around, and then went to put it away. He put it away, but then about 20 min later we heard the blood-curdling scream and sure enough he needed 3 stiches in his finger!

I would like to know why Trail's End is offering this as a prize, esp. to the cub scouts when they can't even earn the requirement for pocket knife safety until the later 1/2 of cub scouting??? I would also like to know if any other parents/packs had this same issue, so that I know if it is even worth bringing it up with Trail's End or not?

Yours in scouts!

jens3sons

Remember....Tigers ARE a part of the pack...they should be able to participate in any event the pack does.

My son is now a bear. Did he win or even come close to winning PWD as a Tiger?...NO! It wasn't winning that was important to him, it was the time his father spent with him building the car. I do however, need to give a lot of credit to my husband, he has so much patience when it comes to showing our boys how to use tools. He guided my son's hands as he cut the shape of the car, but my son did ALL of the sanding and the painting, and he had a very nice looking car to boot!

Good Luck!

Andy, I too agree about setting up goals for the pack. However, the top priority would be first making sure your CubMaster is doing all he is supposed to be doing as the CM. Find out the direction he wants to make the pack "go", and then the two of you sit down and write out the goals of the pack, and then present it at the next committee meeting.

I can tell you from experience some other things that might help out. I went from not only a "one person pack" (The CC did EVERYTHING you could possibly imagine...which wasn't necessarily good for the pack), to not only my district not up to speed but our council as well. Despite all the problems I inherited, I had a goal and direction in mind. I wore both the CC hat and CM for all of last year, but focused on recruiting the people I knew would benefit the pack. I did EVERYTHING for the most part for the first year because I was told I could. I quickly found out I couldn't! Anyways, one of the best things that helped me through this, was, regardless, I was excited about the whole scouting program and what it could be. I showed my excitement to the boys and to the parents. Get crazy about scouting! Be enthusiastic about it, and let your parents know 2 things.

1. You don't need to re-invent the wheel! There is sooooo many resources out there to help get things moving. Use the Program Helps, and make sure you know the key contact people in your district and council and plea to them for help as well. Make them come to recruitments and to meetings if need be. Attend Roundtables and have leaders attend also.

2. When recruiting parents, I also make sure I let them know that one of the often unspoken benefits, is the friendships that not only their boys will make, but the parents will make as well. I had a family who was going to move out of our area and send their sons to another school, but when they thought of NOT what the school gave their children, but what their PACK!!! and baseball team gave them (all the boys on the team are in the pack) and the friendships the parents had made in both, they knew they just didn't have the heart to move all of them out of town!!!!

Keep being excited about scouting, invest some heavy time into the pack now, and it will pay off in the future. I went from a 3 person Committee Meeting to now 10-15 people attending consistently. I went from a pack that doesn't camp at all to one who is now planning our 2nd camping outing. I went from me doing everything, to now, me making sure everyone is doing the job they are supposed to and assisting when necessary.

If getting excited isn't enough, then during the pack meeting plead to your parents, tell them how many hours you spent the last week just on scouting stuff. Tell them you have a family also, and other responsibilities and that you can't do it all alone. It is not a one-person pack, it is all of their pack and they all need to participate on some level. Give out small (managable) tasks at first, and once they see it wasn't that hard, they will be willing to do another thing and another, and so on. Good luck!

Yours In Scouts!

Jens3sons