How to use Den Numbers ???

[WestCoastScouter 10]

This might seem silly... but here is the question...

 

When using Den Number designation...

 

Is it Den 1, 2, 3, 4, 5... for all the dens regardless of age group? i.e. Den 1 might be Bears, Den 2 could be Wolves, Den 3 Wolves, Den 4 Tigers, Den 4 Bears...

 

OR

 

is it Wolf Den 1; Wolf Den 2. Tiger Den 1, Tiger Den 2. Bear Den 1, Bear Den 2, Bear Den 3.... ect ect....

 

or is it just up to us to choose. I could see confusion set in if you say, Den 1 is doing a song... and we dont know if Wolf Den 1, or Tiger Den 1 is being called up.

 

 

[mds3d 90]

I am actually not sure of a guideline, and I know I have heard it both ways. However, in my opinion, the first method is definitely the best. We were always taught to have pride in the den. It was really easy to do that when we were Den 7 and no one else was (yes, I remember my den number). However, I can see that would be considerably harder when there were as many as 3 other dens with the same number.

 

If you are trying to make a decision, I would go with the first. If your pack already runs with the second, you might bring the change up, but it is probably not worth pushing.

[bbender 21]

I believe that the program (and the patches in the Scout Shops across our land, and databases like Packmaster) are set up so that each Den has a unique number. If you have 5 Dens, you have Dens 1, 2, 3, 4 and 5. Now, the first year, there can be numeric sense to it: you can have Den 1 be Tigers, 2 = Wolves, etc. (or go in the other order, with Web IIs paramount as Den 1, Web I = Den 2).

 

Then it gets all bollixed up when the Web IIs cross and a new crop of Tigers come in and either take over that number or become Den 6, as, if you are keeping Dens together (as in this example).

 

Since we've either had 1 or two dens at each level during our recent existence, we use "pairs" of numbers, so that this years Tigers were Den 3, and if they had a second Den, they'd be Den 4, because a year ago former Web II Dens 3 and 4 crossed over to Troops.

 

However . . . while the number may be unique, we find nothing really unique or interesting about being identified as "Den 9 . . . yea!". Instead, we ask each Den, as part of their self-organization (guided by leaders with appropriate discretion) to come up with their own Den Name (so we get Tiger Sharks, and Saber-toothed Tigers, Weird Wolves, and, one year, "Billy Bob Bears"). We find that the Scouts and Parents identify with that better (and it makes more interesting Den Flags) and so it satisfies the KISMIF requirement. Plus there's not the intense disappointment when the Cub Scout comes home disheartened because his den isn't a "prime number". ;^)

 

We also don't encourage getting the Den Numbers on the uniform, because we're not gonna refer to them by number but by name, and it's just one more unnecessary cost, and the number may well change if they have (or expand to) two Dens (Tiger Den 3 may be Wolf Dens 3 and 4 next year). And where there are multiple dens, our policy is that while we'd "like" to keep Dens together if all else is equal, if it isn't, like when Den Leaders step back/retire, we're going to try to secure consensus from the families at that "rank level" to share the current active leadership across both dens, so that no remaining den is suffering from a significant lack of leadership.

 

Of course, YMMV.

 

Bert Bender

Pack and District Trainer

South Fulton District, Atlanta Area Council

[AlFansome 10]

See also ... http://www.scouter.com/forums/viewThread.asp?threadID=271335