Self-run camps?

[ozemu]

Gold Winger I made that comment without thinking too much about it.

 

What I disagree with is that the Patrol system takes a pretty big hit when a Patrol does not need to work together and feeding is a self motivating teamwork project that gets done at least three times per day. Not so with dining halls.

 

I understand from Beavah's post that the Patrol system was not a feature of summer camp. I really can't fathom that. I suppose it is efficiency with numbers over effectiveness with small groups.

[Gold Winger]

I'm not sure if the Patrol system is really much of a part of Scouting. Elsewhere I've babbled on about the lack of team spirit and I see that with too many troops. The patrols don't view themselves as teams. So I'm a raven, so what?

 

Too many troops have policies like "rotating Patrol leaders so everyone gets to advance" instead of allowing the boys to chose their leaders and allow them to remain in place. I've talked to Scoutmasters who think that it is proper for them to appoint the SPL and PLs.

 

If the Patrol method was used at Summer camp, wouldn't entire patrols have to work on the same merit badges? However, that leaves us with the discussion of whether summer camp should be for merit badges.

 

 

[ozemu]

Yes - I was wondering about the MB's bit. Not having any summer camps to observe I really can't comment there at all.

 

I am a staunch Patrol System type. Rabid really.

 

But returning to the topic. Would self run camps not facilitate greater emphasis on the Patrol system? Even a few small Troops I would think would be able to maintain the Patrols as unit. Personally I can't see more than about 40-50 Scouts doing a week summer camp here. Being small means - no dining halls! You know what I mean. Small groups would not require the same facilities. Quality over quantity.

 

I think from a previous discussion that there is a difference bewteen self run summer camps and week long Troop camps. If that is a true statement then I am referring to Troop camps.

[Gold Winger]

I know of a couple troops that do their own summer camps. I don't really know if they use the patrol method any more than regular camps. From talking to the adults, they seem to focus on merit badges just like the council camps.

 

Summer camp strikes me as too much like school. To me the ideal summer camp would be more like Philmont. If you happen to earn a merit badge along the way, that's good but the experience is the important thing.

 

Go live in the woods for a week. Go hiking. Go fishing. Go canoeing. Learn about trees. Make a basket. Don't judge success or failure by the number of blue cards.

[mlg0171]

As I previously posted, my troop ran its own camp twice. Yes, the daily schedule was similar to a BSA-run camp. If a scout wants to earn Rifle Shooting MB, Lifesaving MB, etc., you can't just "happen to earn a merit badge along the way" from a practical standpoint. Splashing around in the lake doesn't get you Swimming or Lifesaving MB. Plinking cans does not get you Rifle Shooting MB.

 

Even if we take a canoe trip and the scout learns how to steer a canoe along the way, there are still knowledge requirements to deal with.

 

When I think of my scouting experience as a youth, I have fond memories of the challenge of Lifesaving MB and of swamping/recovering canoes for Canoeing MB. I can't imagine comparing it to "school".

 

The goal at our self-run camp was not to get as many blue cards as possible. In fact we left a BSA-run camp to get away from that. We had four daily MB sessions and blocked off most of the afternoon for open swimming/fishing/boating/shooting. One day we had no MB sessions and took a fifteen-mile bike ride along a river.

 

As for patrols, I'll discuss that in a separate post.

[Gold Winger]

That sounds like it worked well and would be more memorable than spending the day running from class to class and panicing because you might not finish your work.

[mlg0171]

As for patrols, we WERE able to use the patrols more than you typically see at a BSA-run camp.

 

Did patrols go to MB sessions together? Of course not, but so what? How is that harming the Patrol Method? Compare it to a typical campout. At a recent campout, about half the scouts wanted to go fishing Saturday morning. The lake was a 20 minute hike from the campsite. From each patrol, some scouts went and others did not. Did we abandon the Patrol Method by not forcing all scouts to go fishing together? Doubt it.

 

What patrols did do at our self-run summer camp:

- Tented together.

- Assembled at flags together.

- Made sure their patrol members were on time for flag raising or suffer a dire fate. (OK not really dire. It was all in fun.)

- Daily duty roster chore (including helping meal prep, meal cleanup, showerhouse cleanup, flag ceremony)

- Assemble for meals together.

- Ate at patrol tables.

- Made sure each patrol member had proper table manners. (We recognized an "honor table" and a "bone table" at each meal. When the honor table was dismissed they could leave without cleaning off their table. The bone table stayed behind and cleaned up the honor table and a couple other minor tasks. The scouts really got into the drama, drum rolling on the tables as the judge ran up and down the aisles until he placed the honor table emblem and then the bone table emblem on two tables.)

- And during free time, most patrols hung out together anyway.

 

Awesome time, lots of work, and it didn't damage our patrols even if it was different from a typical campout. Different is not always bad.

 

[mlg0171]

Yeah, Gold Winger, that brings up another point. If a scout couldn't finish a MB during that week, it is easy for him to continue at home because the MB Counselor is in the troop, not some random person he'll never see again. In fact you met with your counselor a month BEFORE camp at a troop meeting to get things kicked off.