Campaholic

Dan, your post reminded me of a song...well...most things remind me of songs actually...but I am trying very hard to refrain from posting them all here...but this one is strictly to make you feel better.

It goes like this:

All God's creatures got a place in the choir

Some sing low some sing higher

some sing loud on the telephone wire

and some just clap their hands, or paws, or anything they got now

There's other verses, but the point is...all gods creatures got a place in the choir...even you and OGE...

OT!! You're going down! How dare you start them up again! *grumbles* Just you wait...

I'm still waiting for the response on what would happen if you took your girls away OGE...and I don't remember anyone in the CREW ever asking you to sing...maybe the troop...but we love you anyway...

I don't know about you OT, but I tried really really really hard to control myself from not commenting on that one...but it's like this OGE...in your head...take out all the girls from the crew...now what do you have? Still want us to go? We will...

And OT, you know I love ya...and maybe you also know I'm a sucker for songs myself.

Some of this particular summer's favorite's were

The Baby Duck Song

A-O-Bo-Diddly-Bop

Desperado

Green Grow the Rushes

Oh You'll Never Get to Heaven

As for slow songs...

I do enjoy Moon on the Meadow greatly and it reminds me particularly of my biking unit

Red Balloon

Both One Tin Soldier and Rainbow Love (or some people call it rainbow children) both which I still blame Billy Jack for slaughtering...

It goes on and on

Speak for yourself OT...i'm not sure where you have been...maybe cutting outtings, but I've had to listen to them numerous times! And i have witnessed...who wasn't at the last Biff...YOU! Who was...me! And I learned more about boy scoutting and their songs than I ever thought possible(not that this is a bad thing boy scouts, I am willing to learn, you just have to know the cirumstances)

YOU HAD TO GET THEM STARTED! Didn't you Outdoor Thinker! You couldn't let a good thing go! You had to to think about your campsickness! Call a camp friend, sing songs to youself, visit your camp, but get them started! How COULD YOU! *Cries*

Nope, not sure who you're talking about...maybe OutdoorThinkers Crew has similar issues...

Being a girl crew member, I would have to agree it's the only way to go, thank you buffalo2. I'm not sure what your advisors reasons for not wanting girls is, but I am kind of interested, so if you find out, post it. One of the hardest things that we run across is finding a female chaperone. Some co-ed crews have female advisors, however, ours does not, so we kind of struggle. We've recently starting doing activities with another crew that has a female advisor, so it solves our problems a bit.

Some positive things to tell your advisor is, it allows some of the guys to feel like they're older and more trustworthy. I mean, I don't know how old you are, but sometimes leaders want to shelter their boys (and girl scouts leaders do the same) but it's a really good life experience to have boys and girls work together on challenges.

It allows both girls and boys to better understand each other...and that may sound odd, but our crew was originally composed of members of a boy scout troop and members of a girl scout troop and although I have a better understanding of the Boy Scouts and the guys in our crew are trying very hard to understand, it let's us see into the other organizations.

It's possible that all the people in your Venture Crew would be coming from your troop that you already have set up...a good point would be that you have already done so much with those people. Adding some girls in the mix would allow you to do some different team building things.

I'm sure there's several more I could think of that just aren't coming to me right now.

I have to say that I've had nothing but positive experiences in my co-ed crew. If that's what you think you want,remind your leader Venture Crew's are supposed to be "Youth Run" organizations and he needs to keep that in mind. I hope I was helpful.

Goodness Outdoor Thinker, lay off Old Gray Eagle. You have the poor man sentencing himself to cutting activities and I'm sure his kids need him. Have you never refered to a group of girls as "guys"?...

Very well said Outdoor Thinker! Very well said.

Well, please don't take this as shooting the messanger, because that is not my intention at all. It may be true in your wife and daughters troop that they do tend to do "girly-girl" things. However, each Girl Scout troop is completely different. The troop I was in as a senior was one of the most diverse troops I've seen around. We really did learn to knit...not because we were in to "girly-girl" things, but because we thought it would be neat. How many Boy Scouts do you know who think it's cool to knit a scarf? But we also did more high adventure things, such as weekend camping trips, staying in tents, cooking our own food, canoeing,kayaking,challenge courses, and rock climbing. It all depends on the interest of the girls.

As for one not thinking it is fair for someone to join Girl Scouting when they are senior to earn the Gold Award. I have never heard of this happening. Could they theoretically? Of course. But it seems that is a huge decline in Girl Scouting when they hit Cadette and Senior age level, so for one just to join to get them an award seems silly. There are also a lot of requirements to earning the Gold Award, so it is very hard to earn in such a short amount of time. One of the requirements is the Career Exploration Pin, which I wanted to touch on to rebut the comment on what they are trying to teach about the work place. If anything, I feel that Girl Scouts are pushed to pursue careers other than being in the home, not that I don't think being a stay at home mother (or father, for that matter) isn't a hard job.

SMT376Richmond KY: to my knowledge there is no rule against being in both organizations. In fact, if she thinks she'll be uncomfortable, tell her to ask some of her Girl Scouting friends to join the crew with her. That's what I did and not only did I become better friends with the girls I came in with, but I made a whole lot of other friends in the crew as well!(This message has been edited by Campaholic)

If they are anything like the girls in my crew, I'm sure they would probably laugh if they knew you said you were "totally down with them and repect in a "far out" way" and that they were "far out"...I know I would laugh at my leader... But then again, my crew knows how to take jokes very well.

I feel as if Outdoor Thinker summed up the different age levels of Girl Scouting for you quite nicely. I hope that your question on which levels of Girl Scouts you are looking for (which is the seniors) was answered. Althought I thought it would be fun to touch on Girl Scout Camping Vs. Boy Scout Camping, since I have worked at a Girl Scout Camp and seen Boy Scout camp run, I will go along with her I guess...

I must admit that once I got involved with Ventures I was often telling my crew advisors that it was "more fun" than Girl Scouts. I mean, I have never ever heard of another type of co-ed "Scout" group! And how could my parents tell me I couldn't be in Scouts... But my honest advice to you is, don't try to understand Girl Scouting. I don't know how many times the other girls and I have tried to explain Girl Scouting to our Venture Leaders and to this day they still think that the Gold Award is a rank of some sort.

When seeking out Girl Scouts and speaking to their troop, explain what the goals of your Crew are and the girls who are interested, whether it be because their GS troop doesn't do what you do and they think it'd be fun, or because they do have similar activities in their troop and just want a greater chance to do these activities, will join.

On a personal level, I joined Ventures because the I heard the Crew was going on a trip to Assateague that I thought sounded interesting, so I went and have never turned back since then.

Good luck on your recruiting. If you have another other suggestions for recruitment, please share them, we are beginning to lose members to college

Well, the girls in my crew have been in many of the leadership positions, which has always kind of been okay with the boys. Not necessarily a battle for possitions, but I feel that in general there really have not been any awkward times between the teenage girls and teenage guys even though none of us really knew each other before we joined. I know that I expected that there would be some bits of awkwardness before everyone started to get to know each other, but everyone is pretty much there for a common reason, and in our crew that is high adventure.

As for council wide leadership. Run with what works and if the ladies seem to be making it work in the crew, it seems as if the other crew members will more eagerly vote them in to positions on a higher level.

In a quote unquote "male-dominant" world, forgive me if I do see womans accomplishments as something big. No, I do not see womans accomplishments as being necessarily "better" than any thing that boys do, but it's definitely harder for woman to be treated equally.

There are enough people in the world, and I am in no way saying this includes you, that seem to think woman should be bare-foot and pregnant, and I am, indeed, proud of the girls at my camp, and the girls in my crew, and myself, for stepping up to do outdoors activities, which for many years, were not "able to be accomplished" by woman.

It just wasn't done...for how many years were woman forced to wear skirts to school and other places in public because they were meant to be a weaker, more gentle gender and should be displayed this way. So, no, I do not necessarily think you are sexist, but I do think that woman can do, and will strive to do, anything that a man can do.

I know that Girl Scout Camps and Boy Scout Camps are fairly different in the fact that many Girl Scouts begin to go to camp when they are five, where as Boy Scouts start around 11 or 12, but I was so excited when I started at camp as staff.

I am also not a parent and I feel my parents were a little worried about sending me away when I was 15 to start working for 5 weeks at camp, but my second summer I begged them to let me stay the 8 weeks that I was offered and now it's more like 10 that I stay because they extended our camp season due to such high camper enrollment.

As for care packages. Stay away from the random things. Boys, especially, will ignore them...I know I've gotten things like tablets and pens...I am perfectly fine with my weathered loose leaf and bic pen. As for a phone card, that's a wonderful idea. You may find you send one and get minimal phone calls, but it's a great way to keep in touch with friends as well, which will, in fact, make him feel more comfortable at camp.

Finally, I do not think he would chose to go to camp if he didn't think it was something he really wanted to do. A new staff member may find they do not like camp as much as they thought, but usually they can make it through their time period they are there.

I know that you were not meaning to be sexist in your comment about backpacking, or I highly hope that you weren't, but girls are capable of doing anything you ask your guys to do. In fact, I feel that the woman in my crew try harder to be equal with the boys. I work at an all girls summer camp and this summer we had a unit of girls ages 12-16 hike 57 miles on the Appalacian Trail. A pretty big accomplishment for girls. So my suggestion is don't underestimate your girls. If they are not sure of themselves, they might chose not to go, but most likely they just need encouragement to try something new.