BluejacketScouter

There is a parent in our Pack who supposedly has expressed interest in becoming a den leader.

However he's also admitted to a felony conviction for fighting or assaulting someone, whatever the legal term for that is. This was verified by one of our committee members who has those sort of resources.

Leaving the personal and CO concerns aside for the moment, will this application be nixed by the Council or Regional Office?

We're going to need to have a sit-down with the COR and IH before it gets that far, but I wanted to know what our options are beforehand - if they determine that he's reticent and all that, and want to proceed with submitting the application.

I tried ordering one of the non-official Jac-shirts from Bemidji Mills last fall and after several months with no order, I finally harassed them enough that they admitted they no longer have any red material and aren't sure if they can get it again

Has anyone ever found a source for a rain cover for the official campaign hat?

I tried emailing Stetson but they ignored me.

I got a couple of "universal" covers from US Cavalry but they didn't fit and tore.

I was looking for a fitted cover, not one that looks like a bread sack on my noggin.

Thanks to all...these are great ideas and suggestions.

I was stuck in my mindset and needed to think outside the box a little!

Have been working on our den graduations. Tiger, Wolf, Bear transition is pretty apparent - new neckers and new dens. Looking for suggestions for Webelos:

First-years moving to second-year.

Second-years leaving the pack and NOT transitioning to Boy Scouting.

The second-years dropping out of the program get a small token, a smile and a handshake. What can we do with the first-years? We're recognizing the other dens with the new neckers and the little ceremony that goes along with it.

Re the Webelos shoulder colors...I know there's a history (whether actual or imagined) of the green, gold and red colors.

My question is, do the different activity pins get applied each to a specific color or not?

Thanks

I did two rounds as Tiger leader and felt I should have earned two knots. The TDL could be the biggest parent recruiter in the pack.

The first den that I "inherited" had been meeting for about 3 months and the CM had allowed it to be a baby-sitting drop off...by the time we hit the end of the school year I had 3 parents on PC and 1 as ADL for the next Tiger/Wolf transition. Felt pretty good about that. There were still a few who sat sullenly in the back, participated only when their son didn't have the dexterity for whatever craft they were working on, and generally looked like they couldn't believe they had to be there.

Might only be 1 hour per week per boy, more like 2 hours for the parents.

Next year, before the race: announce a "Turtle" award for the slowest car. Make and display a really cool, BIG, goofy trophy. Make a big deal over the "winning" car. Guess which award will be the most coveted?

The quality of material, button retention and overall value is just fine. The sizing and fit is really weird and you definitely need to try before you buy.

I am 5'9", 175 and average build. I tried one for fit wearing a polo shirt in the scout shop and bought a L size. However, after I got home and tried it with my uniform shirt I found that the epaulettes, loops and shoulder insignia made it too restrictive across the shoulders. I exchanged for the XL size which has good fit across the shoulders but the sleeves and length are now long and baggy. I'm not a body-builder with a barrel chest and shoulders.

Considering that it will be cool-weather and camp wear, I'm satisfied. But it's not fitted too well. Guess I need to find a tailor?

True stories:

Had a gung-ho fifth grader and his mom join the Webelos den. Second meeting, proudly showed his brand-new book. Sat down with mom and son to show the Bobcat requirements, here's what you need to work on first and the spots for Akela (parent) to sign.

Son (without mom) comes in the following week and crows "I got my Bobcat signed!" Correctly shows the salute, handshake, can shakily recite the promise and oath with a little prompting...I flip open his book. EVERY PAGE, EVERY REQUIREMENT, EVERY ACTIVITY PIN, EVERY BLANK IS SIGNED and dated by mom.

I sort of felt sorry for her. It must have taken all weekend to do. He did earn his Bobcat within a few weeks. Never earned his Webelos badge. Crossed over into Boy Scouts but I've lost track of him at the moment. He is a happy, friendly kid, but...an underachiever. More to that story than what is stated, but I still beat myself up about it.

Second story: Tiger requirement "Go-See-It" 4G to visit a TV or radio studio. I scheduled and took the den to a local high school that runs a cable-access school channel as part of their A-V program. Since we were at the mercy of the administrator, the visit was not our normal den meeting time and day. One Tiger and mom didn't make it. Sat down and explained to them, and offered to schedule a catch-up session later in the year, on my own time, after completion of the regular scheduled den meetings. A month later, Tiger and mom came in with a big vinyl banner printed with the Scout Fleur-de-lis. They visited a local sign shop, got a tour of the facility, and were shown how graphics are captured, laid out, and printed. "Find out how people communicate with others". Meet the requirement? I would have signed it twice, if I could!!

The point of both stories: some boys will excel. Some boys will never earn their rank. All will advance to the next den regardless. The fact that you care and are stressed about it shows your qualities as a den leader and as a caring adult, that they may be missing in their lives. Use that as positive reinforcement and don't slap yourself around about it.

I like the previous posters' ideas about separating "advancement" from crossover or graduation up to the next den. Nicely played. That one is going into the tool box.

Thanks for all the comments. Soap carving with shaved-down popsicle sticks is planned. I'm reverse-engineering the session from the requirements in the Bear handbook, the credo stated on the card, and life experiences. No plans for Tigers and Wolves!!

Thanks.

I have a copy (several, in fact) of the "Fun For the Family" program handbooks, but does anyone know of an online resource or electronic version (pdf) of this material? I would love to be able to email directly to parents rather than say "I'll make a copy of that and get it to you next week".

Thanks,

I was asked by a Webelos Leader to help her den earn their Whittling Chip. These boys did not complete this as Bears last year (and the current Bears, either). I'm sitting here looking at the requirements in the Bear handbook but...does anyone have any instructor references for this?

Thanks

Thanks for all the replies and I'll fill in some background.

Two packs arrived earlier than the third, and those boys laid claim to their "space" while the adults worked at setting up the great room as a dining hall for all three units and began preparing and laying out dinner.

Third Pack, the parents and Cubmaster who left, basically walked in, turned up their noses at the chaos, and hit the parking lot running. I caught the Cubmaster as he was leaving and asked what was going on. He stated that there was no room, and one of the BOYS from the other pack had gleefully told them "THERE ARE NO MORE BUNKS, YOU HAVE TO SLEEP ON THE FLOOR!!" Then it was screw this, screw them, screw you, we paid money to attend, yadda yadda.

I calmly explained that no, this was not the case, that the great room would be changed over for sleeping accomodations and everyone would be re-arranged after the meal, but could not pursuade him to stay. Those parents who were still present in the parking lot and nearby to hear the conversation, DID stay and had a great time. I believe 11 of his unit left, 16 stayed.

No one was asked to leave; no one was told to leave. No one slept on the floor. None of the parents who left came to the group organizer(s) before taking off, except the CM and he was just as mad as could be.

The issue of giving a refund came up two days later. I understand the "goodwill" angle, but am loathe to issue refunds to folks who did not hang around to understand the situation and the re-arrangements. The G2SS threat came up AFTER the CM was informed that refunds would not be issued, and based upon his OBSERVATION of the sleeping arrangements prior to him leaving. We would have made further movements to suit him, but honestly, I don't think that ANYTHING would have been satisfactory.

My olive branch to the parents who left is to deduct the money they paid from their Cub Bash fees this summer. This keeps the money in the camp where it has been paid, and where it belongs. Giving a flat refund doesn't truly resolve the situation; it's just 11 bodies who will never set foot into camp again.

The reason I posted from the G2SS angle is because I am told the CM is going to storm the next district R/T (which he has never previously attended) and make it known how wrong we are for violating G2SS, and how his pack is ALWAYS getting screwed over.

My general understanding is that there may be situations where the G2SS is only a GUIDE, and as long as council standards are met, under the eye of the camp Ranger, we're okay.

CM is ex-USAF who has refused leader training because "I have fought for my country and don't need it". This was their Pack's first participation in ANY district or council event, at my urging. Flew his flag upside-down when President Obama was elected. Generally a PITA.

COR and CC are aware and understand what occured with the parking lot incident, and in the process of notifying the DC and DE now. There is no UC attached to this Pack. In retrospect, yes, we should have been better prepared to hold everyone from unloading gear and firmed up the sleeping assignments ahead of time. It goes on the "what didn't work" list for next time. This issue aside, we're actually pretty pleased at how everything turned out and we may try it again.

I don't have a good feel for the mood of the parents who left - if they were told or encouraged to leave by the CM, or if they were just fagged out from all the other outdoor events of the day, and used this as a trigger to go home and hit the shower. I need to do some more asking around prior to R/T. The parents who did stay, pretty much are calling the ones who left stupid.

It is the view of the COR and CC that the CM is entitled to his opinion; but if he takes the issue to R/T, it is his personal opinion, not the opinion of the Pack.

I know all of this changes the responses somewhat, which was why I narrowed down to the G2SS side to begin with.

Had issues with a group tour last weekend. Organized 3 Cub Packs to attend a council event at camp, then stayed over at a group lodge at camp prior to a tour the next day.

Some of the parents and one Cubmaster left in an angry scene, saying the lodge did not meet G2SS requirements and we were violating the coed arrangements. The lodge has two sleeping areas connected to a great room. Each sleeping area is a separate wing with their own bathroom facilities. One sleeping area is open (no door). Older boys were put in this room. The other sleeping area is partly closed (accordion dividers). Female and male leaders shared this room appropriately (room vacated and doors closed for privacy when changing, etc). The great room was overflow of parents and the younger youths on cots.

There were approximately 30 youths and 25-30 adults. Accountability was never an issue. Lodge capacity was not maxed out.

Okay or no? Grey area maybe? Fire away, I want to see all sides. Supposedly a group of angry parents led by Cubmaster are going to storm next district Roundtable. Do we cut them down with logic and reason, or take lumps and issue refunds?

Fold and roll tents; stuff sleeping bags. Store both loosely in laundry bags when put away.

x2 With Blanc.

Have an experienced Boy Scout come early and set up a display with everything he would pack along for a campout, then have him explain each item as it is packed away in order until his pack is neatly filled. Webelos will ask a thousand questions and it's a good way to pass a den meeting.

To #1...assuming two-deep leadership, and at least one leader has completed BALOO, and at least one leader has completed Outdoor Skills or OWLs, parents are not required to attend.

To #2...same as above.

To the unasked question...I would never discourage or prevent a parent from participating if they desired. I would also put that parent to work with specific tasks to do. Get the parent, keep the boy. Even though Webelos is the transition period from Cub Scouting to Boy Scouting, Cub Scouting is a FAMILY activity.

I will posit that two (trained) leaders are adequate, two leaders plus 2 parents is better.

I believe that's to be for Alumni who complete the five ribbons for the 100-Year patch, but not 100% sure on that.

Imagine my dismay when I found out there were different requirements and I had been working on the Alumni requirements, not the Adult leader requirements. Doh!

Absolutely, yes. School and individual extra-curricular activities count towards both advancement and elective requirements.

The boys are not locked in to completing the requirements as stated "den" or "home" activity. Most units and leaders will use the den activities because they are appropriate for a group setting, and there are obviously things that are very natural to do at home. But mix-and match to your heart's content.

Your profile doesn't indicate if you are a den leader, but if you are, and a boy or some boys have already completed an item solo that you planned to do as a den activity, don't exclude them. Let them do it again - they'll learn the same thing in a different way, and the lesson will be reinforced.

Also completely appropriate for your son to take his book and have the coach, music teacher, etc sign off as "Akela". Any adult in an instructive role is Akela, and it's good practice as they move towards Webelos and Boy Scouting.

You may want to warn the gym teacher ahead of time before the entire den shows up, wanting their handbooks signed

Back to the OP. Shredded cheese tossed into the bag along with the egg sounds like a good idea, but it's not.

The cheese melts and you can't tell if the eggs are cooked or still runny

I wasn't looking for loopholes, I was just asking because I didn't know.

Thanks

What I have done for the past two cycles and works for our unit is to "plan" the next week's meeting at the very end of the night and let the boys volunteer their parents. I already have the meeting requirements planned using the den meeting form and the program helps (now program guide). Just a matter of assigning names. Each parent/son team runs one part of the meeting. Don't wait for the parent to speak up...the boys are eager to do it for them.

"Let's see, who wants to teach us a new game for our gathering activity next week? Uh-huh, X and his mom..." They get the game book and mom sees her name written down on the schedule.

"Who will take attendance? OK, X and dad..."

"Opening ceremony?"

Even to the point of "we need to test a smoke alarm next week - who can bring a smoke alarm with a fresh battery?" The boys will dislocate their arms trying to get your attention.

Moms don't seem to be too frightened by having to take the songbook home and teach us all a new song next week. It's the Dads who are mortified.

All I do is pre-planning. Make a few calls and be sure the paperwork is ready for the Go-See-Its. A few times, even a parent or two have stepped up with an out-of-the-box idea for those.

Seating should always be parent-son, parent-son. Don't ever let the parents occupy the back of the room.

I am there to guide each part of the den meeting, but the only part of the meeting that is "mine" is the closing ceremony - Living Circle, etc and I even mix that up quite a bit.

Don't even use the title "Tiger Den Leader" with the new parents. Use "Tiger Den Trainer" and put that person in a teaching, rather than leading, role.

My two cents - the Tiger Leader should be the leading parent recruiter.

Can the Jac-Shirt be adorned with extra patches? Not like a patch vest - I'm talking of a patrol patch, unit numbers, and one of my old Bicentennial "Spirit of '76" flag patches that would look really good on the right shoulder.

Just asking.