KISMIF_Works

Thanks everyone for your thoughts. Just to be specific, I was talking about our Pack's kick-off at our September pack meeting.

I think that popcorn is a good fundraiser here, where our pack gets 30% of the sales. It has typically been our only fundraiser. Our sales have grown each of the past two years, and we are just looking for ideas to continue that trend this year.

The Trail's End prizes are decent (not fantastic, IMO), but I'm not sure how motivating they are for the boys when they can't see/touch them (unfortunately our district doesn't like to loan out any prizes for the kick-off).

We are considering the idea of offering two or three special pack prizes this year (a first for us). The thought is a Nintendo DSi, an inexpensive iPod, some kind of cool camping gear (?) as raffle prizes. Boys can earn a raffle ticket by reaching some kind of take-order goal (each 1/2 sheet filled or every $100), and by working one hour at a Show & Sell. The goal for offering the prizes is to give that extra motivation to each individual boy to get those take-order sales or to volunteer to wokr at one or more Show & Sells. Has anybody done something like this in the past, and has it proven worth the extra money spent by the pack?

Sorry if this has already been discussed, but I did a quick search of topic titles and didn't find anything.

What are some things you have done in the past for your popcorn kick-off that have really worked to excite and motivate the boys to participate? This includes pack meeting ideas as well as prizes to reward top sales.

We usually do the "pie a Leader" thing as a reward to the top sellers, and the boys really enjoy it.

However, I would like to generate more "buzz" at the kick-off pack meeting...

LisaNJ:

The CubTrax spreadsheets really help out with this!

Last year as a Wolf leader I managed everyone's advancement in my own spreadsheet, which was a lot of work.

Before the Bears got started I read about the CubTrax stuff somewhere on this forum, and decided to give it a try. It is really starting to pay off now as we approach our B&G because I'm able to generate a one-page summary detailing for each boy what is complete and what is still to be done.

Seeing a summary sheet showing that the boy currently has only 2/4 of the progress beads because he is missing parent's signatures for work to complete at home helps to demonstrate the importance of keeping the books updated.

Just like raisinemright, I opted for den dues this year of $1 per scout per meeting. I also considered the "bring-your-own-supplies" alternative but decided against it because I wanted each boy to have the same supplies and because it is usually cheaper to buy for a group than for each boy to buy everything he needs on his own.

You are already volunteering plenty of time, so let the parents help out with the supplies!

Novice_Cubmaster,

Thanks for the advice. That is definitely my plan. I have been reviewing my Scout Leader Book with regards to the recommended pack committee structure and how to best select/recruit new helpers. We definitely have some holes in our committee. I looked back through some older Pack newsletters and to the best of my knowledge we currently have no CC!

At our upcoming pack leader meeting I am going to propose we make a plan to address these needs. I am going to present my proposal as if I'm just thinking towards next year, laying out the openings as I see them and then I am hoping we will have a nice discussion about how to select candidates for the positions and then meet with them 1-on-1 to recruit them.

I'm hoping that when the others see the recommended structure and our lack of coverage for those positions, that they will begin to realize that they are expecting too much from the CM.

I have a parent in my den who will have a Tiger cub joining next year. I am going to nominate him for the Tiger DL for next year. I am also going to discuss some names for an ADL for my den for next year. Once I get this ball rolling the CM might suggest on his own that he needs an ACM, or perhaps someone else will. What I'm thinking is that by listing out the other needs it won't seem only like I'm saying that the CM needs help.

ryetye - I feel for you, as I'm going through some drama right now in my own pack. It's unfortunate when people forget that the purpose of Scouting is to have FUN and that it is for the boys!

Is the effort behind trying to have you and your wife removed somehow tied to your stand on the badge not being awarded?

What is the Tiger DL's husband's role in the pack, and why does she feel he should lead the B&G ceremony you mentioned?

I definitely encourage you to stay on as Bear DL at least until the school year is over, if possible. Your Bear scouts need you, and continuing to do your best in that role is how you can best serve them (regardless of what happens with a B&G ceremony).

Once again, thanks for the thoughtful replies and opinions. Your replies prompted me to look into what exactly is the recommended committee structure. I was surprised to see the holes that we have in our structure. I have spent so much time this past year focusing on my duties as a new DL that I hadn't given any thought to pack administration.

My honest opinion of our CM is that he cares about scouting and cares about his position. I'm going to continue to back him.

We are having our B&G this weekend so once the dust settles from that I am going to start pushing us to think towards next year and to focus on getting the pack more help (committee members and ACMs). If I can sell the others on recruiting more help then maybe I can divert their attention from the CM.

Its Me - that seems to be the consensus from the others in our committee, but what is your reasoning for it?

I see some disadvantages to ousting him:

1. We lose an adult volunteer who is willing/able to help the pack. We don't have a large number of them today.

2. The bad feelings this would create for him and his son, who won't be crossing over to BS for a few years.

3. Who will replace him? Obviously it could be me but then who will replace me as DL for the Bears next year?

4. Does it address the real problem in the pack? Maybe his replacement won't do any better without adding some help. There is always the possibility that the existing committee members would chip-in more help if they liked the replacement CM better, but that's not a certainty.

I think no matter what happens with the CM there will need to be a concerted effort to recruit some additional adult help for next year. I'm thinking along the lines of one-on-one visits with the involved parents, and I think that's something I am going to try to spearhead.

Thanks for the replies and advice. I will address your questions to the best of my knowledge.

Regarding training, I'm not sure if he attended CM training this year or not. I know he was talking about going but I attended a different session than the one he was talking about (I went to DL training this year). So looking back I can't recall if he ended up going or not. Our DLs are trained except for the Tiger DL, who may be but probably isn't.

As a newcomer last year I wasn't really privy to the selection process (or possible lack thereof) for the new CM. I do get the feeling, however, that he landed the position by default. I know that one of those people turned down the role due to lack of time - that is the DL that contacted me. Now if he was asking me to support installing him as the CM I would understand this is a simple power-grab, but he is adamant that he doesn't have the time for the position.

Lisabob, Novice_Cubmaster and DenZero - I think you've hit on to something with regards to our small committee and his possibly being overwhelmed. To be honest I'm not sure how our committee is structured (if we have a formal CC and who it is), but I am going to look into it. I do know that it's only a small handful of the same people (mostly the DLs and the CM) at the meetings each month.

You've all made good points that I think can be summed up as:

1. There is some misconception about how much work the CM should be doing by himself. It may be that the previous CM just did all of this on his own, but that it's too much for most others to do on their own. The CM needs an ACM.

2. Our committee is mostly DLs who don't have time to take on much outside of their DL responsibilities. We could really use a couple members who don't have any DL/CM duties to take on administrative tasks like coordinating events.

The question I have now is how do I proceed to help?

ScoutNut - you suggested having the COR, CC and (possibly) UC meet with the CM. I agree this may be a good idea, but it depends on if we have a formal CC and who that person is. If it's the DL who contacted me in confidence then we may have a problem, because between him and the COR (who is supposedly upset with the CM) the meeting could put the CM on the defensive. Also, I have yet to see the UC at any of our pack functions, so if she were to all of a sudden meet with him it might make him curious and create some bad feelings (e.g., "who ratted me out?").

I think at this point in time I need to meet with the others in order to try to sell them on this course of action, but am leery of doing it behind the CM's back.

I also think it could be useful to have a heart-to-heart with the CM only to see if he wants some help and to offer my help as an ACM, but am worried about how that may be perceived by the others. There is also the outside chance that he mistakes it as a power-grab attempt.

What I'm trying to say is that I want to avoid creating more drama.

OK, to be clear - I am not the CM! :-)

I am looking for advice from all of you regarding how to prevent a split among the leaders and the CM...

First a quick bit of background: last year my oldest son joined Cub Scouts as a Tiger cub. Our pack is around 40 boys in size, and our committee consists of the CM, DLs, a treasurer and a secretary. This year I am my son's Wolf DL and am enjoying it. I have a younger son who won't be a Tiger for another couple years, so I feel like I am going to be in this for a while. Last year the pack's CM (who was very well-liked) resigned and a new CM was installed. Nearly from his installment I detected that the other DLs were not 100% behind him. However he talked about trying to improve our pack functions and den programs (stuff like using the Program Helps and getting training), so I was willing to give him a chance.

However, if I were to give the CM a grade for his performance so far this year, it would be a C-. Our first couple pack meetings went well, but have since gone downhill. This past month's meeting was a disgrace - no agenda, just him going over announcements for 30 minutes. It is to the point now where parents in my den are calling me to ask if there is an agenda for the pack meeting (basically if they need to attend). He has also failed to follow-up in regards to setting up locations/times for events on a few occasions, where we've then had to change the date or location at the last minute. This makes the pack look very unorganized. I have been told by another DL that our COR is unhappy with the CM because of communication issues, but I have not confirmed this myself.

Well this week I was approached by a member of the committee (one of the other DLs) "in confidence" who informed me that he and most of the other members are considering asking for the CM's resignation this spring. He then also asked if I would be willing to take on the CM role once the current CM is ousted!

Needless to say I was flattered by his offer, but I need to emphasize here that I am not after the CM's job. I enjoy being a DL and am not foolish enough to take on the CM role as well - it would have to be one or the other. Lining up a new Bear DL for next year does not seem like an easy task.

I am of the opinion that while the CM is doing a subpar job, he has been in his role for less than a year and should be given more time to prove himself. I told the other DL this during our conversation, and suggested that we find some way to *diplomatically* meet with the CM to make our issues known. The other DL said he thought that trying to do that would only make the CM defensive and would be pointless. He then said that he and some of the others are to the point where they are considering leaving the pack if the CM stays on.

As I started to think about it later, I got to wondering if the CM is even *happy* with his role so far this year? He seems visibly unnerved at times during our pack functions, and probably senses some of the same disrespect from the other DLs that I do. We have talked several times during this year in order to plan events and such, and I feel we have a good acquaintance-type relationship. I think he's a likable guy who just hasn't been getting the job done so far. I'm not ready to say that he isn't capable, but I think the others are to that point.

Sorry for the long post, but I felt I should get all of the details in. Have any of you been in a similar situation before, and if so how was it handled? I do not want to be part of a coup, and I do not want to see a volunteer removed when maybe he could improve with a little more time or constructive criticism.