girlscouting29

Thanks for info on starting a new Troop if that is the route we decide to go.

We still haven't made a decision yet as to what direction we are going and perhaps many feel it is a lost cause but we are still pressing forward with Council. My mom works with one of the board members and she has pretty much said that if we feel we need to meet with the board she could arrange that. After looking into the Councils and the GSUSA's policies and procedures and seeing that there were several staff members involved and skipped steps at the least but rushed through the entire process of dismissal which is specifically outlines not to. Well my son and daughter asked us why council get to violate their own policies in terminating my wifes for supposedly violating policies and procedures and they still get to keep their jobs. If we do get a chance to meet with the board I think we may have to bring that point up and let people know that they are not setting a very positive role model by not practicing what they preach. I will be calling for at least those who signed the document but all very likely all those in Council who have had involvement with this situation to be terminated as well due to their violation of policies and procedures. It may sound vindictive (which some of it may be) but I trully believe they should live the standard they hold others too and at least for my childrens sake push for what is right.

Just a quick question if anyone is still reading.

If we choose to set up a seperate Troop can we do that at the same Charter Organization? I saw some one say they had multiple Troops at a school but I didn't know if this was different and I realize there may seem to be a little strife if we are both operating out of the same building (even though we won't cause any problems, it might come across that we might).

Second question is can we use our home as a CO? I realize that most churches, schools, etc. have insurance that we don't have but I know the GS as a whole have insurance so I am just not sure if it would be covered. Since we perceive the Troop may begin rather small and just first year Cadettes doing things from home might be easier.

Please let me know any thoughts or if you have an answer to either question.

Well I heard a little something back from Council, the Director of Membership Services said that she would forward my request to meet with the Troop Leader and the other members of council since they seem to have issues with me.

Thanks to the advice from those in the forum my wife and I have talked and I believe that we will probably be working to start our own Troop in the fall. We have some information that we need, because we are not sure if we can just meet at the same location and be seperate or if the Council will allow us to hold meetings at our house. Either way I think that several will follow and we are going to try and keep things to just Cadettes at the moment and those that don't wish to follow won't bother us in the least because we are going to focus on the girls and strive to give the best program we can.

Even though we will may be moving forward without the Troop I will still attempt to try to reconcile with the former Troop Leader. I want to set the example to my daughter that you always try to work things out and despite what some one may do to you, you are responsible for your actions and reactions. I want her to know that we can choose to forgive others and move forward without any harse feelings.

Well the last part of what my wife and I have decided to do may go against the advice of those here, we are going to seek to sit down with the Board of Directors of the Council and attempt to try and have some of the policies ammended. I realize that the policies are there for a reason but I also know that when they were devised it wasn't designed to be used in the manner we received it. Perhaps it will make no difference but I think it is important to try to set things right for the future and point out some flaws in the system so a situation like this doesn't occur again in the future. Besides, some of the members of council are not following their own policies and procedures, the very thing they justified removing my wife for, I believe they need to know that what is fair for one is fair for all.

I will look into AHG, another mom that is in our Boy Scout Troop that has a younger daughter had mentioned it before because our area doesn't have one. Perhaps I will have my wife speak to her and some of the others that have expressed interested in supporting us if we move. We have enjoyed GS as a whole and I know they have a lot of options are far as camps and activities in our area but if they fail to meet our needs then it may be time to change venues.

Eoleson, since the emails were anonymous they can't actually use that as proof of anything, there isn't anyway for them to trace it back to me. Although they are saying it was me and despite the fact the comments point to me there is no actual proof which according to the Councils Policies, Standards, and Procedures for Volunteers they need in order to force a resignation. Since this is my daughter I will not simply bow out unless absolutely necessary.

After doing a lot of research I realize that I have enough evidence to support my case and am reaching out to meet with the Council and the Troop Leader to try to work things out. However, if that doesn't work out if they refuse I have some pretty major grounds for an appeal.

I realize it may sound dumb that my wife wants back in, but we do have a lot of friends in that Troop and it would be a lot of work to organize a new Troop. She really just enjoys working with the girls and wants to focus on that rather than all the other stuff this obviously involves. Plus our Troop being so large has a lot of options and resources that we wouldn't have available if we started from scratch.

Yes, the Troop is quite large and very multi-leveled. We have groups and leaders at every age level and overall almost 100 girls.

As far as the backpacks are concerned in my eyes it is border line stealing from the Troop. He was only invited as an advisor and he knew the back packs were supposed to be for the girls not his family. He deliberately bought them for himself rather than wait for the other leader who initiated the dealings in the first place.

I appreciate all the comments and direction but I can't fully agree with everyone here. The original letter mentions me by name and the email was directed to my address not my wifes and directs a lot of things toward me not her. So yes I do take it personal and despite the fact that I am not a registered member I am very much involved at this point and will continue to pursue things on behalf of my wife. Honestly I believe that if it weren't for my emails she might still be a leader and I intend to offer myself as a sacrifice to have her re-instated.

Wow, quite a few responses I will try to answer everyone's questions.

Some of the questions and concerns that were raised included the fact that the Troop had no real committee, the Troop Leader told everyone what was going to be done and how it was going to be done. No one really discussed anything and if some one wanted to do something he didn't approve of he told them they couldn't do it and he dictated who and what events would receive funding without any input from the other leaders. We questioned if that was the right practice or if there should be a formal committee to discuss such items and assist with regulating power.

Second question was regarding the fact the Troops Treasurer is the wife of the Troop Leader. We just questioned whether this was proper or if there was supposed to be a seperation of the money spender and the money counter.

Third concern was an ethics issue. The Cadette Leader was looking to have her group start backpacking and had found some packs online, she had approval to spend some money to get the packs. Rather than meet with the individual alone she asked the Troop Leader to come as well to inspect and make sure everything was okay and for safety reasons. Well, the Troop Leader arrived early as did the seller and the Leader proceeded to buy the majority of the packs for his personal use. When the Cadette Leader got there he told her that he too was looking for some new packs for his family and that these were such a great deal he just couldn't pass them up.

My wife didn't ask a whole lot of questions just about how often they were supposed to have leader meetings and if there was rules about how often they could meet, at the time the Troop only met every other week and as a Junior Leader at the time and moving toward Cadette she felt it being more necessary to meet every week. The rest of the concerns I expressed via an anonymous email account to council and asked to remain anonyomous despite the fact that in the letter they said they knew it had to be me.

I guess were my problem and anger stems from is that the Leader never said anything to either one of us. No one formally answered or addressed any of concerns although in the letter they did say the did some investigation into the Troop and found nothing wrong and that my concerns were unwarranted. As far as they had previously communicated to either of us, since we didn't want to be named nor name the Troop or Leaders involved that they couldn't do any real investigation only give us vague and general advice.

So we both feel that the problem doesn't trully lie with us and had the council been more forth coming with information we don't really have any problems. The problem that seems to be here is form the Leader, he seems to be uspet that we questioned things. My wife wasn't attempting to do anything rather than get some clarity, honestly I think it is my comments and concerns that set the whole snowball in motion.

At this point I don't know what we are going to do for sure. I am working on a response to the Council after reading their by-laws and some other leader policies and procedures I found on the Councils website. I am going to seek a sit down to work things out and have my wife re-instated and I will no longer email, express concerns and will minimize any contact I have since I seem to be the aggressor in the situation. If that doesn't work I will seek to meet with the Board and have them examine everything and make a decision. All I really want at this point is to have my wife back as a leader and that seems to be what a lot of the other parents and leaders want.

I don't agree with the fact that a Leader can just become the Leader and that there is no way around him/her and that if they don't want to step down they don't have too but I guess I will have to get over that. It seems weird to me that their is this dictatorship in GS but I realize that I may have to live with it or work to start own Troop rather than seek to change things. I am in shock that no matter what the Troop members want that it really doesn't matter as long as you know the right people and hopefully this will shed some light on the matter because I have a feeling this is not at all what those who designed the structure had in mind when they designed it.

Okay, I finally have some news from the Council!

The membership manager emailed me today (the boss of the 2 council people that signed the paper). Her response was that she spoke with the Scout Executive for the Council and that there wasn't really any major problems, that my wife did nothing wrong, and that no one was actually questioning her or our conduct or anything of the sort. She said that the problem was that my wife and myself questioned what the Troop leadership had decided on some items and we questioned the some of the Troop practices and procedures. She informed us that the Troop Leader was Leader 01 and that he had sole discretion on whom he wished to appoint or dismiss as leaders of his Troop. She said that he felt we challenged him and that he felt it best that we not be a part of the Troop.

Needless to say I was shocked that apparently Girl Scouts is a dictatorship, that Leader 01 can do whatever he/she wants and simply ask people who don't agree with them to leave. Considering this is a position that everyone votes on I find it hard to believe that this could possibly be true. Neverless the fact that all involved admitted it was easier and better for the Troop that instead of him working to ease our concerns or having us try to work together for us simply not to be a part of the Troop.

What kind of example is that? Are they really teaching the girls that you don't try to work things out, you simply ensure that your stature is greater than others so that you can bully them into agreeing with you or push them out if they don't.

I found out that my mom is really good friends with one of the Council's board members and she is pretty upset that this is the example of Girl Scouts that is being conveyed. She is working with us to some solid answers and find a resolution, but no matter what I am not stopping until something real is done to rectify the matter.

Oh, by the way, they did give us 3 options to pursue. A) live with things as they are and have limited interaction and priveledges (which I don't think they can do anyway), B) join a new Troop, or C) start a new Troop. I think we are contemplating option D, which is a twist between starting a new Troop and having the parents and leaders vote on whether they really want the this type of leader as an example to their girls, or whether they wish to pursue a new leader.

The problem with the volunteer agreement is that we have no idea what they are saying my wife did wrong. They are simply stating that she wasn't working within the Troop's policies and procedures nor with the Troop's leadership.

The letter is addressed to my wife directly and they mentioned that she was no longer a leader, however when they mentioned me by name as well when it came to us only being allowed to drop-off/pick-up my daughter. With the letter addressing me by name I am now a part of this but because this effects my wife and daughter I probably would have been a part of it either way.

Yes, I do believe "firing" would be a better term.

I will continue to reach out to the parents and leaders in our Troop to try and get some support. I will have them address letters to the the Chief Scout Executive of our council but I am going to attempt to make copies in case I need to send them higher. I want the council and Troop to know that people are behind us and that we are not simply going to accept this decision. Who knows perhaps it will even force some very necessary changes within the Troop if more people know what is going on and that people aren't going to simply except the status quo.

I am already working on going up the chain of command. We received the certified letter Thursday and didn't get home to read it until that evening. I sent an email to the council rep who signed the letter and all the other membership staff members along with the big council rep. I requested to a sit down meeting with all parties involved included the professional scouter and for them to list specifically what policies and procedures my wife is being accused of not following. Since they were closed Friday and some of them are out on Monday for a recruiting thing I don't expect to hear anything until at least Tuesday.

I have a feeling the person sending the letter didn't have everyone in the boat and acted a bit prematurely no matter what was said so I want everyone to know so that I can be assured that we aren't getting railroaded. If I don't get some direct answers I will go higher up the chain of command until I am sure that some one listens and at minimum lets me know what is trully going on.

Okay, first let me start off by saying I am not a Girl Scout Leader but my wife is, or at least was until a few days ago.

Our Council sent us a letter stating that my wife was no longer a leader and that we were only welcome to drop off/pick up our daughter. We are at a loss and completely confused on what is going on, the Council states some concerns that were expressed to them (concerns they won't tell us about) and that my wife failed to follow Troop policies and procedures.

I am working on an appeal and getting some of the parents and leaders involved to hopefully write letters or call or something to get some support. My wife has received repeated praise for all the work she does with Troop and how much she goes above and beyond what is expected as a leader. I don't know exactly what happend but I do know that we expressed some concerns with the Troop Leader and his wife and it seems that we are being pushed out because of this (his name was signed at the bottom of the letter too).

I guess I am trying to find out is why a Council would simply tell some one they are no longer a leader and tell a family they can't attend meetings or campouts with their daughter but yet fail to give any real reasonings?

Is there anything we can do?

I realize that Girl Scouts is a volunteer organization but can they really just ask some one to leave and tell a girls parents they can't particpate without even letting them know what they did or giving them a chance to set things right?

At this point I just don't know what to do, any and all responses are welcome and perhaps some direction on where to proceed with these issues.