firstpusk

Rooster professes to respect only one faith and one book - and he uses the Bible as a weapon against those who disagree with him. He need not listen to them merely slap them with a snippet of verse while looking down on them. Those unworthy of a snippet are simply insulted.

My Cub is now an 18 year old Eagle, so it has been a few years since I have been involved in a pinewood. My first year in the pack we ran double elimination. Half of my den was from single-parent households. The involvement of the father in these families was spotty at best. These boys got little help from home. They were out after two races and cried. One tried to destroy his car. After that, our pack never ran double elimination.

We used a method much like the Perfect n. The boys all got to race. Everybody seemed very happy. The time to run the derby was less than the double eliminations always took so the leaders and parents were happy, too!

We also gave out a lot of crazy awards for the cars appearance and some for mishaps. For example, we gave an award for the car most likely made by a Cub and the Stuntman award for the most interesting wipeout.

Most packs in my district have converted to this superior method. Many have added parent, sibling and leader races because these methods are so efficient. There is less waiting, fewer tears and more fun.

Let me put it this way Rooster. For me 'Left Behind' is where you pain me.

Rooster,

You can call it belly-aching if it makes you feel better. You can also dismiss me as bitter. However, that will not make it so. I am disgusted by the immaturity of this particular teaching. The rapture is a teaching that was unheard of before the early 19th century - one cut from whole cloth. It is a proof text lifted from a few phrases snipped completely out of their original context that is being used to avoid acting as responsible adults.

Interesting how turn the whole issue on its head. A lover of Scripture should have more respect for the text. It is the apocalypse lovers that want their God to free them from the mess that they have made on this earth. It is the Bushies that destroy and despoil without the least care because they are certain that God will remove them from the responsibility for sins they have committed against the earth He made for us. They are so sure that His coming is nigh, even though Jesus said no one would know the hour. They embrace war and slaughter instead of Christ's message of love and forgiveness. What if the hour is a thousand, no a million years from now? What will our children have? And what of their childrens' children?

It is interesting that you, a Scouter, embrace destroying the environment selfishly and thoughtlessly.

If I believed the world were to end tomorrow, I would still plant a tree today.

-- Martin Luther

Pack, thanks for the link. Religion can be a force for good. It can also be a weapon of hatred and destruction. The hope and yearning for the end of the world is a perversity that is only surpassed by the effort to spur on Armageddon. To think that so many Christians would embrace this monstrosity on the threadbare theology of the "rapture". That so many would selfishly despoil the world that they claim God created for them to care for as stewards is a mockery of faith, hope and charity. Perhaps they should hope that no judgement ever comes for their actions.

"Just thinking..." This was refuted by the rest of your sentence.

I've worked with scouters of all political stripes. For me the important thing is the delivery of the program. Setting the example is the key leadership skill I seek when I am recruiting. You don't seem to be ready to set the example on the first point of the Scout Law. For the good of the youth you are working with please resign. We can do better than you.

The ACLU is not responsible for the predicament of the Boyd County Schools. The World-Nut-Daily is not exactly a reliable source, but even they did not claim the district was "teaching sodomy".

There are more than a few ommissions in the article you linked.

>The students themselves sought to start the Gay Straight Alliance (GSA) after classmates unanimously passed a resolution favoring an open hunt on gay students during a mock legislature session. In another incident, a student in an english class said that they should, "...take all the (an extreme profanity describing homosexual students) out in the back woods and kill them."

>The students were repeatedly turned down by the school when they sought the aid of the ACLU.

>The school repeatedly tried to evade the requirements of federal law that many Christain students have used to allow religious association in the public schools such as Bible Clubs.

>The school's site based decision council allowed the GSA to form.

>The school board overturned this decision because they did not agree with the point of view of the club members.

>When it was pointed out that the district had to allow the GSA to form if it allowed other non-academic clubs, the superintendent banned all the clubs. He still allowed the others to meet but continued to ban the GSA.

>When faced with a lawsuit, the district finally accepted the consent decree that required the senitivity training that you described so inaccurately.

Trail Pounder, what is the first point of the Scout Law?

"The key difference is however, that while the Church can say that abortion is a grave evil, and supporting it in any form is therefore also evil, the Church has a harder time on social and economic issues. For example, the Church can say that we need to care for the poor. However, the question of how to care for the poor, and what is actually in the best interests of the poor, is something the Church does not speak on with the same sort of authority as life issues. It is the difference between moral imperatives and matters on which each person must exercise prudential judgment."

I think the same argument can easily be made for abortion. How best do we deal with the issue? I think the Church speaks quite clearly on the need to help the poor. I might disagree with you on the manner in which we help or whether it is even helpful. Simply saying abortion should be illegal does not make it go away. Abortion was fairly common in the US when it was illegal in most states. It was also readily available and safe for the rich and extremely dangerous for the poor.

Do you really think that it would be different now? Under this administration? Do you think that abortion could be outlawed with the easy availability of RU 486? Who do you penalize? Only the doctors or do the women bear criminal responsibility?

Abortion has been used as a blugeon to gain political power by the Republican Party. There efforts against it have been largely grandstanding with no intent to outlaw the practice. Much like the gay marriage issue, the social conservatives are played for chumps on the abortion issue.

My alma mater, a Catholic university, hired one of the authors of the famous torture memo used by the Bush administration to justify myriad of abuses, torture and even murder of prisoners In Iraq, Afghanistan, Guantanamo and who knows where else around the world. Combine that with the sex abuse issue, I could give a skinney rats patoot who any bishop says I should vote for in any election. In fact, they seem to be a pretty effective reverse barometer for moral issues. See you at Mass.

"Whew, we really dodged a bullet there. The American people elected the guy with the higher IQ." Trail Pounder

Not quite, the guy would have to be willing to use the IQ. Thinking of any kind is not our President's long or short suit for that matter. Couple his intellectual laziness with his utter lack of scruples and I think Menken has our President nailed.

eisley, I am truly disappointed in you. The Swiftboat Liars did more to slander the dignity of all veterans by slandering a comrade in arms and establishing themselves as liars. The record of their claims being debunked as pure fabrications or half-truths twisted beyond recognition has been clearly documented. Those funding the Swiftboat Liars also funded the smears directed at Sen. John McCain.

Pretty careless with the truth eisley. What was the context of Kerry's 1971 testimony or do you only listen to the Swiftboat Liars funded by Bush?

What I learned it that it is possible to win a national election in the United States on the basis of fear-mongering, lies and bigotry. God bless our President that has taken mendacity to such extremes...and God bless America. We're going to need it.

My WFA certification is up this coming winter. I will be taking it again though my local council office. They have been offering it for a number of years at a reasonable price. If your unit is planning on a trek, I HIGHLY recommend at least one adult have this course. Talk to your council about getting the ball rolling down the road.

I'll be working an evening shift my Council's booth at the Minnesota State Fair this week - in uniform, of course!

Don't be jealous. That fool in a Lear Jet is missing so much by not taking time to share time with his child.

The youngest pusk turned 18 a week and a half ago. I always chose jobs that allowed me to share time in scouts with my two sons and daughter. As I watched them grow to responsible adults and good citizens, I knew I did not make a mistake.

For summer camp, I always bring an expresso pot and frother. Both are stove top versions. What can I say? I like my cappucino. With my Finnish upbringing I take great joy in the number of scouts asking if I would be willing to whip them up a foo-foo coffee. I am a true yuppie scouter except for the young and the urban part ;^)

I saw something similar in my younger days. Bear tore up a camp and finished off the six Canadian beer but left the White Label (cheap American brand) alone after tasting a can. Tastes great, eh!

I have worked with excellent 18-20 SAs and I have worked with poor ones. Perspective and patience seem to be the keys. Any SM asking for help from these guys needs to make sure they understand how to work collaboratively. One thing I have noted is that the young SAs that have camp staff or JLTC staff experience tend to do better. They have learned to work with adults on an equal footing and have a bit more perspective.

I feel training, mentoring and defining a role for them within the troop are critical to success. One we had a young SA a few years back with experience on staff at Philmont and he was able to mentor some of our older scouts that were working on camp staff. His efforts for a couple of years definitely added a lot to our program.

I am certain that Eamonn can tell the difference between Guinness and Ranier. After all, he is smarter than the average bear. ;^)

Most of my canoeing is done with the scouts or my local paddling club. We note the condition of those with whom we share the river. We avoid those that either through lack of skill, poor prior planning or substance abuse endanger themselves and others.

We generally can move down the river faster because of better skills and lack of impairment. If we can't, we gunwale up in an eddy and wait for them to clear. It is situations like these that bring home the need for good discipline within the crew. Planning how to deal with rescue is critically important. Those that are not trained should be waiting in an eddy accounted for by designated individuals. The support boats have enough to worry about already.

This is an excellent advancement opportunity also. Camping merit badge requirement 9. b. requires that the scout help plan and conduct two of five activites. One of them is a float plan for a three hour float. We are having several scouts plan our upcoming canoeing trip on the Bois Brule River. Available to them are the G2SS, maps, guidebooks and the MB badge books for canoeing and whitewater.

They not only want to do it. They are excited about it. There is nothing wrong with the PLC "subcontracting" such work to a group of scouts. They simply have to make sure the final product is up to snuff.

I do think that teaching the boys (and adults) to "gunwale up" in an eddy below a set of rapids is absolutely critical. PFDs must also be required at all times. These are practices I have worked hard to instill on everyone canoeing with us. It was not always that way. My first trip with my son's new troop did not seem concerned about the requirements for G2SS. They did not think it was possible to fulfill the whitewater requirements. Since then, I have gotten a good deal of whitewater training including river rescue from my local American Canoe Association affiliate. We are now supervising safe, fun trips on class 2 rapids each year for the boys.

I canoed a section of the St. Croix a month ago. Just downstream a deputy sheriff drowned while tubing. The accident was avoidable. He became trapped by a cooler he had tied to his leg. The cooler caught on some branches and it cost him his life. He should have known better. Had someone been watching out for him and been properly prepared, he would likely be alive today.

A skeleton walks into a bar. He says to the bartender, "I'll have a beer and a mop."

sctldr,

Sorry if I seemed a bit testy in my response. The BOR is in place to make sure that the counselors are following the program, just like in the BSA program. The program requires a fair amount from both the youth and the counselors. Still, we wanted the requiremetns to be followed rigorously. As ScoutNut indicated, the youth need to consult and get a signature from their pastor.

One thing I would like to clarify. A number of young women in the Archdiocese have earned the Pope Pius emblem through their participation in the Venturing program. Also, we have been conducting joint ceremonies with the Girl Scouts for a number of years.

scoutldr,

Look at the requirements for the award and examine the program before you criticize. I have had the pleasure of sitting on boards of review for dozens of young men and women that have received emblems. They have worked hard on their own and participated fruitfully in their groups. All have come to a deeper understanding of their faith. Most have expressed a deeper commitment to bringing it into their everyday lives.

These emblems should not be set up as the program for regular scout meetings. I have seen classes addressed and organized during meetings but the religious emblem meetings occur at separate times. These programs should enhance the scout program not replace it. Just as the program should enhance and not replace the regular religious education in which the youth should be participating.

When I was aware that a troop was running the program incorrectly, I made sure that they understood how the program should run.

And yes, we anually had over one hundred youth recognized. I was always pleased that we had such a high level of participation.

I used to chair the Catholic Committe on Scouting for my Archdiocese. I understand your concern. I agree that it can be frustrating for folks that want to counsel emblems to be told the training is completed for the year.

The Catholic emblems require trained counselors. We found that often potential counselors decide to start a group after the training is done. We have been fortunate to have a group of dedicated scouters willing to step forward to volunteer to do this training several times a year. I would discuss your concerns with the chair in your Diocese.

It may be that you will have to wait to next year to start. If that is the case, look for several other adults to help with the emblem program in your unit or district. It is always better to have a group of counselors working together. Thanks for stepping up to help out with this important scouting ministry.