Fat Old Guy 11 Posted October 16, 2003 Share Posted October 16, 2003 Where is all the outdoor skill training going? When I went to Scoutmaster School, we spent a Saturday on outdoor skills and then went camping a week later on Friday night, spent Saturday on outdoor skills, camped Saturday night and then did more outdoor stuff on Sunday. Now, I've been told that the "long weekend" has been eliminated because it is "unnecessary." Our District Training Chair tells me that most outdoors stuff has been eliminated from Wood Badge as well. Is BSA planning on eliminating the outdoor program? If not, where are leaders supposed to learn outdoorsy stuff? It's not like we're all great frontiersmen. Link to post Share on other sites
SR540Beaver 116 Posted October 16, 2003 Share Posted October 16, 2003 I'd rattle a few cages at roundtable and at the council office. That might be happeneing in your neck of the woods, but not in mine. My second weekend of Wood Badge was the camping portion. Of course we camped both weekends, but we spent much more time in camp and had to do our own cooking. We were even presented with a few challenges. Each meal we would have a couple of staffers come eat with us. When we went to the quartermaster to get our food draw early one morning, they gave us a heads up that the scoutmaster would be having breakfast with us. We were given ingredients for pancakes. They told us that the scoutmaster liked a fruit topping on his pancakes. Guess what, no fruit was provided with our food draw. We had apples left over and quickly began peeling some. Someone in our patrol had brought cinammon with them. A little heat, sugar, cinammom, apples and a few minutes of time and we had his fruit topping prepared before he showed up. We had to improvise in camp. But, on to your topic. WE have Webelos Outdoor Leader Training, Introduction to Outdoor Leader Skills and a course called Outdoor Skills Training. They are all weekend long courses. The Outdoor Skills Training course is an older course that I understand was discontinued, but was so popular in our council that it was and is continued at the council level. It is actually a two weekend course. It covers maps, compass, dutch ovens, knots, woods tools, hiking, backpacking, etc. Don't know why your council isn't supporting the outdoor program, but mine is. Link to post Share on other sites
Bob White 20 Posted October 16, 2003 Share Posted October 16, 2003 The belief that outdoor training has been removed is ridiculous and fear mongering in this case. Beaver is absolutely correct in all his information on the availability of outdoor training. This is really a non-issue. Bob White Link to post Share on other sites
CubsRgr8 10 Posted October 16, 2003 Share Posted October 16, 2003 BW, my council has dropped Webelos Leader Outdoor Training completely. I'll be forced to attend a session at another council if I want it (and I do!). Unfortunately, I'll have to wait until next spring, as nobody in this neck of the woods offers it during winter. Link to post Share on other sites
SR540Beaver 116 Posted October 16, 2003 Share Posted October 16, 2003 Fog, One other thought. To be considered "trained" for SM or ASM, you must take IOLS. An SM or ASM can not attend Wood Badge without having taken IOLS. If IOLS has been dropped from your council's training schedule, you guys have some serious problems and will not be able to wear the trained patch or attend Wood Badge. Not a good thing for the scouts or scouters. Are your volunteer scouters not willing to give their time to devote to being trainers or is your council just not willing to promote training? How large is your council? I can see where a small council may have problems procuring trainers and providing training. My council covers 22 or 24 counties in Oklahoma and runs five different camp properties. Covering a good 1/4th to 1/3rd of the state gives us a large pool of people to pull from. Link to post Share on other sites
Bob White 20 Posted October 16, 2003 Share Posted October 16, 2003 They probably did not drop WLOT they inadvertently threw out the syllabus when the new Cub Training was realeased. WLOT was in the back section before. It is now a stand alone syllabus and a new program released within the last two months. The course now takes place parrallel to Intro to Outdoor Skills, with some of the classes shared by troop leaders and Webelos Leaders. Have the Training committee get the new Council Trainng Manual and look it up. Bob White(This message has been edited by Bob White) Link to post Share on other sites
buffalo2 14 Posted October 16, 2003 Share Posted October 16, 2003 In a similar vein, is anybody seeing focused skill sessions for adults? Something that goes beyond the SM Fundamentals OLSI exposure. I'm thinking of a Saturday session that would run hands-on Pioneering or Orienteering sessions for a half-day? Maybe use the Merit Badge requirements as a syllabus if no other; and open it up Council-wide to draw sufficient interest and staffing talent. If you could get it past the Not-Invented-Here club, I'd bet it would go Link to post Share on other sites
Bob White 20 Posted October 16, 2003 Share Posted October 16, 2003 Yes, It is called "Units of Scouting", it is a series of short sessions that include,Youth Protection, Unit Budget Planning, Unit Program Planning, Troop Organization and about 5 other topics. I don't have the list in front of me, but it is in the Council Training Committee Manual. Bob White Link to post Share on other sites
Fat Old Guy 11 Posted October 16, 2003 Author Share Posted October 16, 2003 First I had to find out what IOLS is since it didn't exist when I went to school and my district doesn't break it out by name. I then went web surfing and found that IOLS ranges from a 1 day course to a Saturday followed by a Friday night, Saturday, and Sunday course (what we used to have) with variations in-between. Evidently, my council wants the 1 day variety instead of the more thorough variety. Why? I don't know. Well, I have the District Training Chair's spin on it. Are the lenghty courses going beyond the official curriculum? If the official curriculum is the two weekend course, how are some councils getting by with a one day class? Last spring the council did offer an "advanced" outdoor skill course and not enough people signed up to make it a go. I think that they wanted 40 and got 15. Link to post Share on other sites
johnsned 10 Posted October 16, 2003 Share Posted October 16, 2003 With the new Wood Badge Course 21st Century Wood Badge most of the outdoor training was taking out, now the emphasis is on Leadership Skills. I think it is a good change; the Old Wood Badge didnt have that much Outdoor Skills training. The National Training Committee felt that there were more appropriate venues for outdoor skills training. Introduction to Outdoor Leader Skills is just that, and Introduction, there are many other courses that can be given. From the High Adventure Training to Roundtables to other training courses there are courses set up to teach these skills. I am Roundtable Commissioner and Assistant Training Chair we have a lot of supplemental training sessions, I poll the district as see what people want and need to learn then we put on a course. We have yearly Winter Survival and Camping courses, Pioneering, Outdoor Cooking, and Mountain Man Events training in my District. If you dont have enough training in you District talk to your Training Chair, or volunteer to be the Training Chair, or put the training events on your self. It isnt too hard to find instructors. Just my opinion, JohnSned Link to post Share on other sites
FScouter 24 Posted October 17, 2003 Share Posted October 17, 2003 BobWhite - You mentioned the "Council Training Manual" and the "Council Training Committee Manual". Are you referring to the "Leadership Training Committee Guide" #34169F, or is there another resource out there? Some of the other "units of training" include Boy Scout Advancement Training, Merit Badge Counselor Orientation, Selecting Quality Leaders, Camping, Team Building, Rock Climbing/Rappelling, Survival, Backpacking, Cooking, Aquatics, and Topping Out. Link to post Share on other sites
FScouter 24 Posted October 17, 2003 Share Posted October 17, 2003 FatOldGuy - The syllabus for Introduction to Outdoor Leader Skills has two suggested program schedules. The weekend schedule starts Friday evening and ends Sunday afternoon. An alternative schedule is two Saturdays 8 AM to 8 PM. The suggested schedules can be modified somewhat if necessary, but it takes so many hours to properly present all of the material. If your training is only one day, youre missing a good chunk of material. Link to post Share on other sites
Twocubdad 665 Posted October 17, 2003 Share Posted October 17, 2003 CubsRgr8 -- if your council doesn't offer WLOT (how can anyone earn the Webelos Den Leader knot?), I would suggest you take the BALOO course instead. It covers health and safety in more detail than WLOT and most of the camping skills. The primary thing you will miss are the units on teaching the outdoor-oriented activity pins, Outdoorsman, Naturalist, Geologists and Forester. Link to post Share on other sites
Eamonn 61 Posted October 17, 2003 Share Posted October 17, 2003 I think that the new outdoor skill training's are really good. They cover most of what you need to know to run a age appropriate program for the program that you are involved in. I have yet to see the new Weblos Scout Den Leader Training. As we are all aware Training never ends. One great thing about Scouts and Scouting is that each and everyone of us can bring something to the table. While we have the "Formal" training's one thing that I'm proud of is our new Scoutmaster summer camp meetings. At the start of the week we ask those who may have a skill if they would be willing to make a 30 minute presentation of a Scouting skill to the other leaders and invite all the adults in camp to attend. So far very few of the sessions have been done in the half hour and more often then not the presenters have a lot of follow up meetings. It could of course be due to the coffee, along with the chance to shoot the breeze with others. But so far it is working out well. Eamonn Link to post Share on other sites
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