JoeC

Since atheists have first amendment rights

Of course you and other atheists have the right to speak and criticize the Boy Scouts and I will defend that right. When I say “Leave us alone†I say to you, the parents of atheist children, the ACLU, NOW, Atheists United, and other liberal legal interest groups stop suing the Boy Scouts. School Districts, cities, states, and other government organizations stop the law suits! There have been law suits against the Boy scouts since the 1970’s over the issue concerning membership. And the law suits continue. We are a private orginazation and we have the right to decide who we want in our organization. We have the right to establish membership criteria. You and other atheist have no right to be in the Boy Scouts. When I say “Leave us alone†I say stop attempting to join the Boy Scouts using force via the courts. It is anti-freedom.

and since the BSA has been less than honest when excluding atheists, no.

We have been very honest. Since the founding of the Boy Scouts of America there has been a reference to God in the Boy Scout oath. Since the 1950’s when conducting a flag ceremony God has been referenced when Boy Scouts have recited the Pledge of Allegiance. And since the 1970’s the Boy Scouts have been very clear in press releases, statements made by officers of the Boy Scouts, briefs given in the courtroom, and arguments given to the US Supreme Court that if you are an atheist you cannot be a member. How clearer than that can we be.

I wonder why a non believer would want to join an organization of believers (in this case the Boy Scouts). I do not get it. The Boy Scouts are a private orginazation and as such have the right to dictate who can be a member. The Boy Scouts have that same right as other private organizations such as the NAACP, NRA, NOW, and the Catholic Church do. The NAACP can discriminate by refusing to accept a Klansman as a member. The Catholic Church discriminates against Jews when it requires priests to be Catholic. NOW would be correct in denying membership to George Bush a person who is not pro-choice. And the NRA discriminates by denying membership to President Obama who wants to ban the private ownership and use of guns.

The Boy Scouts as a private organization can have a good reason, bad reason, irrational reason, or any other reason in establishing membership criteria. Their reason can be one that you might not approve of but as a private orginazation it is their right to discriminate. I appose everything the Nazi Party of the United States stands for but they have a right to exist and they have a right to establish membership criteria. To be clear I am not comparing the Nazi Party to that of the Boy Scouts.

What is sad and to me it is anti-freedom to have those who oppose the Boy Scouts sue the Boy Scouts time and time again attempting to force them to take them in as a member. Atheists have no right to be a member of the Boy Scouts in the same way Jews have no right to be priests of the Catholic Church. Why is it anti-freedom for Atheists though the use of the courts to become a member of the Boy Scouts is because if this were to happen some court might require another private orginazation to accept as a member someone they do not want. The NAACP might be required to have a Klansman as a member. The NAACP might be required to operate their orginazation against their wishes. This has happened. In the 1950’s legislators in the South passed laws requiring the NAACP to turn over their membership information to them. This was done so the police could harass and threaten the members and supporters of the NAACP. The US Supreme Court ruled the NAACP could not be required to give their membership information to government officials. They ruled such laws violated the 1^st amendment.

Where do we get our rights. The founders believed we get our rights from God. In the Declaration of Independence Americans declared in 1776 that "We hold these truths to be self evident that all men are created equal endowed by their creator with certain unalienable rights, that among these are life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.†Those who signed the Declaration of Independence, and the people of the states they represented believed that fundamental truth.

Through out America’s history the belief that God is our creator and the source of human rights has been acknowledged again and again. In 1781, Thomas Jefferson in his work titled, “Notes on the State of Virginia†wrote, “God who gave us life gave us liberty. And can the liberties of a nation be thought secure when we have removed their only firm basis, a conviction in the minds of the people that these liberties are of the gift of God.â€Â

Congress in September 25, 1789 approved a resolution calling on President Washington to proclaim a National Day of Thanksgiving for the people declaring, “A day of public Thanksgiving and prayer, to be observed by acknowledging . . . The many signal favors of Almighty God, especially by affording them an opportunity to establish a Constitution of Government for their safety and happiness.†This President Washington did so establishing the first Thanksgiving holiday under the US Constitution. In the proclamation given Washington thanked God for the recent victory over the British and helping establish a nation founded on the liberty of the people.

In 1863 President Lincoln in the Gettysburg Address said, “. . . that this Nation under God, shall have a new birth of freedom - and the Government of the people, by the people, for the people, shall not parish from the Earth.â€Â

In June 15, 1954 President Eisenhower signed into law that amended the Pledge of Allegiance to read, “ . . . one Nation under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all.â€Â

The Boy Scouts in the oath referencing God attest to the basic fact that our rights come from God. You might not agree that our rights come from God but that is irrelevant because the historical fact is that Americans believe that our rights come from God that no government can take away.

What should Atheists do? First they and their supporters should leave the Boy Scouts alone. Secondly they can join another organization such as the 4H Club, the Boys Club, or Atheist United that will welcome them as members. They can form their own camping orginazation and set whatever membership criteria they want. They can get together with friends and go camping.

Finally I go back to the beginning, “Why would a non-believer want to join the Boy Scouts an organization of believers in God who do not want non-believers as members?"