We use traditional patrol boxes for 'car' camping and haul them along in our troop trailer. They work for us in that respect as they provide a nice organized work area for the boys and with the flip down door as a work surface, they don't have to carry an extra table as many of the places we camp do not have tables. For backpacking trips, the Patrol boxes stay at home. That being said, we are trying to address the issue of bulk and weight with a new lighter design. We're piloting replacing the traditional 2-burner coleman stove with a single burner that screws directly onto the propane bottle. Our Patrol boxes used to carry a full set of dishes and 'silverware' for the patrol but now they bring their own mess kits. The new design is essentially a 2'x2' cube, though we may shorten it a bit. It has worksurfaces on both sides. It needs a few tweaks but if you would like pics and plans, message me.