kmorley971

On 7/21/2019 at 9:59 AM, SSScout said:

IMHO, this is an issue that deserves a wider audience.   As I suggested, take it directly to the SE,  and to your COR. The COR is officially your rep to the Council.  Talk to your RoundTable, to your District Leadership.   Compare notes with other Units.   Conflict with popcorn sales is not a valid reason to NOT fundraise somehow for your Unit.  

The only "discipline"  the Council can do is pull your Unit Charter.  That, and rescind everyone's membership in BSA.   Those are the only things the Council thru the SE can do.  I seriously doubt they would go that route, but ya never can tell.   Thus the need for lots of back up, make the issue not just yours, but the rest of Scout Worlds.... 

We are in the process of doing so, but thus far no transparency in decision criteria. Will be certain to share outcome, especially since it involves a new National level partnership that was clearly designed for fundraising at the unit level as one option.

@David CO

so scouts would simple wear class b when conducting sales led by CO to support thier scout programs

Council offered no specific reason other than claiming conflict with popcorn which is not sold until late august.

Primary question here is veto power of the Council to quash any fundraising activity that they do not sponsor and therefore monetarily benefit. Seems unnecessarily authoritarian when we have full support of our chartering org and the activity, selling food item, does not violate any of the "rules". Intent is to supplement popcorn activity later in year.

What if we proceed and simply do not wear Class A? 

any experience or recommendations when Council denies unit fundraiser for no clear reason? appears there is no appeals process and thus unit is denied opportunity to independently support program. 

so any experience/recommendations trying to explain the CO role without freaking them out in terms of the perspective they have on liability? What is unsettling in that this coming from State level PTA.

Well our CO has denied use of their EIN based on the following points. Our CO is a PTA and they solicited input from: 1) the County Council of PTAs Treasurer, 2) the State PTA Treasurer, and 3) an outside, independent Accountant. Unanimously, they all told the CO that they could not/should not allow the Boy Scout pack to use the PTAs EIN. Therefore, we cannot allow you to use the PTAs EIN. Bottom line from the State PTA is that they cannot pass through monies for any other group, period. The County PTA Treasurer was more concerned with risk and liability, and the Accountant said it was just bad business practice, along with a serious liability to the PTA.

This seems like a very serious issue that will impede operations of other Scout groups and should be investigated futher by National BSA. Also any guidance on proper categories for setting up EIN (like do we need to be incorporated to get one?) would be very helpful.

Also by haveing our own EIN for checking account does that put a firewall between the CO and Pack funds.(This message has been edited by kmorley971)

All of the comments are very helpful.

So in response to CalicoPenn, if we get our own EIN for checking account does that eliminate obligation to report $ on the CO tax return? This what i would infer from the comment posted by ScoutNut?

I think that is what were PTA President is headed, even thoight they are willing to allow the Pack to use the EIN for purchases...seems like double standard.

Well that is perhaps part of the issue since before I took over this year as CM they were using a personnel checking account. There is no institutional knowledge and I am trying to rebuild relationship and met with the PTA Board this morning to discuss. However, the inability to get a straight answer from BSA HQ site or local council is honestly very frustrating and does not build confidence with the CO. Lacking a clear statement on financial relationship between units and COs from BSA or local council could potentially put more distance between CO and the unit since the president is extremely sensitive to any possibility of liability for the PTA, rightfully so, but the more I explained how the unit is subordinate to the CO the more concerned she became...I pick an exit ramp by offering to get comment from a nearby pack with PTA sponsor. However, I was kinda hoping to gather a little more intel myself so I can be educated on the matter as much as possible. All these comments have been useful.

Okay but even if we have our tax id do the funds we raise have any tax reporting requirements for the PTA that sponsor our Pack.

Setting up new checking account for our Pack led to request to our Chartered Org (PTA) for use of the tax id #. This flagged them for liability concerns about having responsibility for the Scout funds absent direct oversight and implications for IRS reporting (might bump them into next bracket so more paperwork).

I cannot find any specific guidance from BSA on the tax implications for the CO as the pack is subordinate to them with or without using their tax id. Can someone provide a clear answer so we can move forward...perhaps this why previous account was a personnal account vs commercial.