DRussell1187Eagle

Laura-

The situation that you mention for your unit is one that we caution leaders and under-18 Lifeguards on when we train them.

This is where you and the other adult leaders should do two things: 1. Find a way to make yourself trust that this boy has been SUFFICIENTLY trained to handle this responsibility. If you need to go back to the counselor that trained him and have a talk, do so. The bottom line here is that YOU are the adult in charge for ALL unit activities and you're the one who must be sure that everyone stays safe. Is this boy mature enough to handle the lifeguarding situations that he will be up against? Even if the answer is yes, it has to be remembered that he is still not yet an adult - there will be things that he can't understand and will not be able to predict. This is the main reason that the first point in both the SSD and SA is Qualified Adult Supervision. 2. The other thing I would recommend is to have a good long talk with this young man. He now holds a very special position in your troop; and it's one that could hurt or really, really help your troop program. Ask almost any troop that lives in FL or on the coasts - a troop without a Lifeguard is in sad shape!! He needs to know that the adults trust him to do the job he's been trained to do, but he also need to know that he walks a fine line with the level of responsibility. If the adults in charge do not trust him to handle being in charge of the Aquatics activities, he will figure it out soon enough and will quickly come to resent his position. The best thing is that you all establish clear lines of communication about this issue and deal with it BEFOREHAND.

The other part is that you shouldn't be in a position where he is the only L/G anyway. I believe there is a space on the tour permits that asks for the names of the TWO people in charge of the aquatics activities. The second person should at least be current in SSD or SA; and you should have a ratio of 1 to 10 for any group larger than 10. (Supervision to Swimmer)

BobWhite-

I believe you misunderstood what Laura meant by "acted as". They way I understood it, she didn't mean that he wasn't certified, just that he was filling the position.

The other part about the rescues is only partially true. Lifeguards ARE to act in tandem, however there is nothing that I have ever seen/read/taught that says that you have to use the line and tender method. It is not taught to the lifeguards that to attempt a person to person rescue, you have to be attached to a rescue line. There are too many other variables that come into play here, and many waterfronts are so large that this is just not feasible to do. What we DO teach them is that person to person is the last method to use and that you "Go with support". I'm sure the man who had a scout drown right next to him yesterday at their scout camp (FL) would have been perfectly happy if he had been able to do anything for him, regardless if he was attached to a line or not. I guess my point here is that there are few rescues that are "textbook". You do what you have been trained to do as well as you can in an emergency situation and hope for the best.

I'm not trying to preach here, but I wanted to offer the best advice I could. I'm a Lifeguard Counselor for the BSA and Lifeguard Trainer for the Red Cross. Good Luck to both of you.

Charles

Laura -

Your file idea sounds really good. I'd include extra paper and pens/pencils. Those are some of the things that easily disappear into tents and get lost. The 5 gallon buckets are a good idea, but most of our kids have already gone to Walmart and bought the fold-up camp chairs with the carrying strap, so whatever works for your troop. Being from FL, we really watch what the boys drink (not just during the summer either!) and insist that the boys ALWAYS bring cup/bottle to camp.

Another thing we do in my troop when we get to camp is to make sure that the entire troop stops by the snack store. We do this so that the staff there gets to see our entire troop. The real reason is so that we can let everyone know that our boys are NOT allowed to purchase any soda or candy during the day. (Digesting the extra sugar just heats up the body anyway.) Most evenings after dinner we will go over to the store as a group and we let them buy something then.

One last thing, (I'm sure your already back, but you can still do this) we always have the entire group circle up at the end of every campout. We go around the circle and everyone tells 4 things: what he liked, what he disliked, what he learned, and what he could have done better. Even the adults participate, and all the normal circle-type rules apply. You'll be pleased what the boys will tell you; at the very least you can learn what they don't like doing.

Good Luck!!

Charles

SM101-

As someone who lives in FL and sees this all the time, you are doing the right thing to NOT lessen the requirements here. I also happen to be a BSA Lifeguard Counselor - the skills are what they are. No more and no less. If the child can not perform the skills, then trust what the trained staff at summer camp told you - PLEASE. The boys will get over this one; like the other members said, there are plenty of other things to do in Scouts and there's always next year. Additionally, if YOU sign that requirement in the boy's book saying that he IS capable of a certain skill and someday in the near future (God forbid) he has some kind of water accident..... Do you see where I'm going here??

Give the boys plenty of opportunities to work on their swimming skills along with the rest of the troop - it will do all of them good.

Good Luck!

Charles

Eagle74 -

You are correct to consult the G2SS. That publication is the one that sets out the guidelines for leaders to follow. Unfortunately, also, you are correct in reading that a BSA Lifeguard IS NOT required for any UNIT Aquatics activity. I say unfortunately because a few years ago when the BSA decided to change that rule, it meant that ANY adult who had sat through the one hour Safe Swim Defense or Safety Afloat class was "qualified" to lead his/her unit in ANY aquatics activity.(!!!!) The adult must also "be proficient" (my words here)for the type of activity. As for the "strong swimmers" - they do not even have to be adults!!!

To answer your questions:

1. As far as I know (which is by no means complete knowledge)a Lifeguard is the person certified and trained in ALL aspects of water safety. This means everything from cleaning the pool, pre-surveying the swim areas, and programs all the way to the actual rescue techniques. Most Lifeguard classes are AT LEAST 30 hours long. A Lifesaver is a person who has received "some" basic water safety training (as in the case of the aforementioned adult). Not much of a comparison as far as I am concerned. I would imagine that your training certainly qualifies you as at least a Lifesaver (LOL) especially if you're the one to save MY butt!! BTW, who is YOUR certifying agency??

2. The recognized agencies are the Red Cross and the BSA. I believe that BSA National used to recognize a YMCA Lifeguard, but now almost all YMCA's use Red Cross, so there are hardly any YMCA Lifeguards left. The BSA National Safety (?) Committee is the group that decides. They are in a process now of combining the Red Cross and BSA programs; all councils were sent information about this in June.

3. No - You are reading the information correctly - including the between-the-lines information.

My own opinions here: The tradition that most of us here in FL follow is that WHEN leaders and Lifeguards follow the BSA rules for Aquatics, you don't have accidents. It's only when you have a case where someone decides that they know better or just gets lazy and DOES NOT follow the rules, that we have accidents. When this change of rules came out a few years ago, most councils adopted it without even blinking. My council, THANK GOD, did not. They chose to keep a certified Lifeguard and I have yet to meet anyone who doesn't agree.

Sorry this was so long, but this is a complicated area and many, many adults do not have the correct information, nor are there many people in (most) councils who can accurately answer.

Good Luck!

Charles