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There is no way we can know if the people who post here in the forum are who or what they say they are.

I really don't exactly know what a troll is. Which might be a good thing as I'd hate to call someone a name that I'm unsure of.

Some little time back someone who said she was the mother of a Scout asked about the positioning of a patch. I can't remember what patch or where it was supposed to be sewn.

As ever the discussion meandered and covered why she was doing the asking, why her son wasn't going to his P/L or SPL to gain a deeper insight into correct patch positioning.

All the poor Lady wanted to know was where to sew a patch on a uniform.

In the thread that this one came from, someone claiming to be a youth member asked about if there was a rule or not about BOR's.

As I said we don't know if this was a youth member or just someone stirring the pot?

My question is should we tailor the way we reply to the person who is doing the asking?

Or is it OK for us to use the question asked as a topic for discussion, ignoring the person who asked the question in the first place.

Would we if faced with a real live breathing, warm blooded Lad answer the same way as we do here in the forum?

Just asking.



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"What if we were faced with a real warm blooded lad"


Ok Eamonn that is irrelevant since that was not the case here. In all your years in scouting and in this forum have you ever heard of any youth coming onto this forum to complain about his BOR because a patch fell off? How many 14-15 year old boys do you know that would want to re-expose themselves to such an embarrassing scouting moment to a bunch of strange adults for their scrutiny, well I will tell you NONE. If calvin had been posting here for a while on a variety of topics then I would agree with you.


Look the way the post was written, the ludicrous nature of the problem which was not even realistic by any stretch of the imagination points to a troll post. It would not surprise me that this is indeed one of the old forum trolls, an anti scouting person wanting to start an argument among the forum members, or a student doing some kind of research project. In any case calvin did his job and probably will never be heard from again. It really is too bad that some people can be so easily taken in and manipulated by an anonymous post.

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Well I for one am sorry about where the post strayed.. Personally, although "the patch fell off" was a little hard to believe, I did not take the youth as a troll. The question was innocent enough, without much meat to it.. We are the ones who gave it meat.


"The patch fell off" to me is a new twist to the excuse of "The dog ate my homework". The lack of giving more detail is a boy who doesn't want to give all the detail, because we might see where the fault is his.. Or a boy who does not like to write much..


The level of arguement was sad given it was a youth, but I do not think raises the cackles of this board as someone posting he is gay or a athiest and living a lie in his troop (or whatever)..


If this was a troll he got no more raise then 10 other threads currently being discussed..


example :


1) "No CC Knot?" (another newbie asks a question that caused people to question his dedication to the scouting program.)

2) What is the purpose & function of a troop committee.. (Some fur flew in that one)

3) "What is Active in Troop vs. Crew for Eagle Requirement.. (Another newbie.. guy hasn't posted since the 16th, still it is being discussed & posted to daily.)


The topic on the badge falling off would have been dead, with the youth not responding after the 2nd post, had people not come in to tell the scout to tell the adults in his program to stick it where the sun don't shine.

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I think a lot could be done better here with how 'we' reply. Too many people read into a question instead of asking for clarification from the OP. They assume they are dealing with...a newbie who has no training, someone who thumbs their nose to BSA policy, a helicopter parent, etc or whatever they want to think about the poor poster who innocently asked a question they wanted assistance on.


It would help also if the forums were set up better. There is no way to tell who someone is replying to or to quote comments you are replying to not to mention a way to edit your post later if need be to clarify something.

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dlearyous - You can edit your post for up to one hour, after you post it. It is a small icon that looks like a sheet of paper near the top, near the thumbs up. It disappears after the hour is up. I guess they figure it has been up long enough and people have read it and wont re-read it, so after that you need to create a new post..


Also below you editing window is all the other posts from the current thread. I went down and copied your username as I could not remember how it was spelled. If I want to quote from a different thread altogether I open a second window, bring up the forum in that window, go to the other thread, copy and paste it into the first window..


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In my experience, the protocol of posting in an established community generally calls for a newbie to lurk for a while, getting a sense of the board, then post an introduction, then start commenting, in that order.


It's no different than in real-life situations. No one would barge in the door of the Moose Lodge or the high school chess club shouting questions and demanding answers.


But what we've seen a lot of recently, IMO, has been from people who start in with loaded-question posts wanting information that supports their point of view. They don't provide enough information for other posters to actually shed some light on the subject. They want a yes-or-no answer on some question of "national BSA policy" that doesn't really exist. Or they're so hopelessly confused about Scouting's structure, positions, program, etc., that we have no idea what they're really asking.


So in the absence of other information, in order to help them, all we really can do is assume certain things not in evidence.


They're not really being trolls or provocateurs - unless they're posting in Issues & Politics. ;)(This message has been edited by shortridge)

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I don't know how you play this "game" without taking posts at face value. If we only respond to posts where all sides of an issue are fairly aired, it's going to get really quiet. It's exceedingly rare that we ever have two sides to the same story. Seems like back in the fall someone wrote in complaining about something with their district or council and someone else involved in the story recognized to story and wrote in. As I recall, that got fairly hairy.


This ain't The Peoples' Court. We don't get to question both sides. If someone wants to spin or fudge the story in their own interest, we have no idea. Of course if you are sincerely interested in getting good advice, twisting the story won't help.


Beavah is usually pretty good about reminding us we should give the Scouters on the other side of the story the benefit of the doubt that they are also trying to do what is best for the Scouts. That's valuable. Of course everyone plays hypotheticals all over the place. While it may not be The Peoples' Court, it is sorta like Dr. Phil. It's not so much about solving individual problems, as it is the educational value of exploring and discussing a particular issue. Keep in mind that while there are only a few dozen regular posters here, there are usually +/- a thousand active users reading along.


In the parent thread, if Calvin is a troll I really don't care. Honestly, I can't imagine how anyone would get a kick out of making up Board of Review problems and waiting for a reply. Maybe in the politics fourm.... Still, I don't care. I would rather take his post at face value and spend the time trying to help a Scout than not.


If you don't think something is legit, ignore it.


(By the way, I'm really a 26-year-old hair stylist. Single, no kids, Cub Scouts or otherwise. I've been maintaining the ruse of being a Scout leader with two sons for 10 years now. Boy are you guys chumps.)


(No, no wait. Actually my real name is Bob Mazucca and boy are some of you in trouble. You should be looking for a certified letter regarding your membership status any day now.)

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moosetracker - yes i know you can edit you post right afterward, but I said you can't edit it later. Not everyone reads every post to a thread and respond after reading only the initial post. If I can't edit it because I made a mistake or want to clarify something, I can't, and they probably won't see it later in the thread unless they read everything. Then I'm getting useless responses because they didn't understand and the thread is abandoned, except for all those arguing for arguments sake off on another tangent.


Okay, yes, I can copy and paste someone else's post into mine...I was talking about the more advanced forums that do that automatically for you.


There still isn't a way to tell what post a person is responding to during a discussion.


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dlearyous - Don't understand your last line. still isn't a way to tell what post a person is responding to during a discussion


You knew I was responding to you, because a started with dlearyous .. I knew you were responding to me because you started with moosetracker What do other forums do??


I guess I understand the 1 hour limit. Or one of my other forums lets me edit or even delete before a post is made to it. After someone posts a response, it is untouchable.. Take for instance in a different thread about a week back OGE, responded to me.. I responded back to him.. Being a forum auditor he has a few more priviledges then the rest of us.. He totally deleted his message, and left mine dangling in the wind, responding to nobody and not making much sense.. If people start responding to you in one way, then you return to edit yours to say something totally different, anyone coming in after the fact will read your first post, and not understand why the other posters commented the way they did.. Also I know I never re-read a thread from it's start after everytime I enter it. I start on page 2 or 4 or where ever I last left off, quickly find the last post I read and continue from there.. Changing posts I read 2 days back, is not something I would notice..


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I've been hanging around this forum since 2002, and had amassed >4000 posts before I dropped out for awhile and had to re-register under this name. I have seen trolls come and go (remember Fat Old Guy?), seen a "pedantic book-thumper" who was ALWAYS right and made sure everyone knew it, seen judges, physicians, soldiers, sailors, and some who were obviously uneducated and couldn't write the King's English to save their lives. We've had homosexuals, liberals, conservatives, Lutherans, Catholics, Mormons, Jews, Buddhists, Wiccans, Pastors and atheists. We've had parents, Scouters, Scouts, Venturers, and Professionals (who had to post incognito). Merlyn is a thorn in our sides, but he makes me think...and I like that.


But that's what I love about this group...we are a representative microcosm of the Scouting family, and we are all here for one noble purpose...to develop young people to be the Leaders of tomorrow and to make ethical decisions over their lifetime.


Upon returning to this forum, I had made a few resolutions...to only post to those threads where I thought I could contribute something that hadn't already been said...to avoid political discussions with Lisabob ;)...and to take all questions at face value...and to be frank and truthful, hopefully without being rude. There are no dumb questions...and as someone said, there are probably hundreds more reading who have the same question.


I've been through a lot since 2002...and have learned that life's too short...try to chill and enjoy the rest of the journey.


Happy Scouting!

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I find it interesting.....


How members rip the poor kid with a missing patch an new one calling him a troll.


Then welcome with wide open arms another person who I believe it a troll in the Maplescout person.....I am not sure of his age, but as moose pointed out he is very well spoken for a 16 year old.



why is this??? Maple is well spoken????? His "infraction" is more significant than a mere patch.


Not hatin just sayin

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calvin was also a troll he struck had a good laugh and was gone forever, that's what trolls do. You guillible types can think otherwise if you like but it was so plainly obvious if you couldn't see it then your head was buried in the sand. I think even the ones who thought he was legit are beginning to realize the truth and are too embarrassed to admit it.


There are a lot of individuals and organizations out there who hate scouting and trolling scout sites is something they love to do, small minds entertained by small things.

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Basement - Having been on both threads.. Don't know if any of it applys to me. But just so that you know where I stand..


1) I don't think either are trolls. I don't think either post was done to incite.. They were both questions of the normal sort.

2) I didn't rip the first scout a new one.. I first posted very friendly. Then asked for a response before I answered again.. Then ripped Kudu on new one, because he got in telling the lad to rebel against injustice.. Don't mind telling youth to respectfully work towards change, but not encourage them to rebel or be disrespectful..

3) IamCalvin, didn't give us much to go on, so it caused us to guess.. MapleScout gave us a whole lot to digest..

4) We did sort of come down on Maple scout, his next post he is back sincerly appologizing, and correcting where himself where we read into it, some genius bureaucrate with few social skills.. And his second post was sincere and not trying to stir the pot or incite..



BP - I will remain gullable.. I will be swayed that a newbie trying to cause civil war amoungst us.. Neither did, just a normal every day squabble in one.

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