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First Class First Year

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Bob,

Correct. My mistake.

 

You said attendance has nothing to do with Scout spirit. I disagree. How does a Scout show Scout spirit by doing the minimum requirements?

 

Ed Mori

Scoutmaster

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

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If a scout does the minimum requirements, he still did the required requirements, and since you cant add to or take away requirements, then he met the requirements.

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Thank you OGE.

The Boy Scout Handbook says that scout spirit is the boy's use of the values of the Oath and Law in his everyday life. It has NOTHING to do with attendance.

 

Bob White

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But poor attendance can be the result of poor Scout Spirit!

 

Ed Mori

Scoutmaster

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

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If a scout completes all the activities for a rank, he has to have attended activties, and he has to have attended some meetings, just to get the items signed off.

 

If a scout completes all activities required for advancement, how can you say he has poor scout spirit?

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I agree with OGE and Bob about this. The requirements are objective where specific activities must be completed. They are subjective (subject to personal judgement) where such things as spirit are concerned. Boys are not all the same and CAN'T be expected to adhere to the same standard of 'spirit' although they CAN all be expected to know how to tie a square knot. To state this a little differently, a boy who begins scouting at a high level of spirit can progress nicely with little or no increase in spirit. Another boy who begins with little or no spirit can greatly improve without matching the level of the first boy. I ask, which boy has made the greater achievement of spirit? The two boys should be judged as individuals for their personal achievements and as long as they showed progress within their programs (and met the objective requirements), I would pass both of them...on spirit. Know the boy. Packsaddle

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I would also agree that attendance is NOT a sign of scout spirit -

 

My son has LOTS of "scout spirit", but often misses and event because I am divorced and it falls on his Dad's weekend - Dad doesn't "do" scouts or anything inmportant to Jon. Jon has no control over it and neither do I. Until he is 18.

 

WE have another boy in our troop who bad allergies, asthma, and has a heart condition. Most of the time you wouldn't notice it at all - others, well, his parents keep him home sometimes because his immune system is low and it doesn't take much to push him over the edge. He's been with the troop almost 2 years and did his first ever campout this summer. But he'll probably not have the stamina to do a 50 mile bike trip, ever!

 

We have another who loves scouts, but HATES bugs! he ONLY does winter camping!

 

With confimation starting for many of our 7th & 8th graders, sometimes they have to make a choice. in our case, confirmation is wednesday - which had been my son's night with his Dad. Luckily Dad chose Tues to to replace it - but now Jon has scouts mon, Dad tues, Confirmation WEd, and a gifted class on thurs. That makes for an awfully full week! sometimes, with homework,and everything else, scouts has to take a turn!

 

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While there is no requirement for attendance, I still feel it is important. I encourage all my Scouts to attend al meetings & events. I also realize they are involved in many other things. I tell them that Scouts comes after family & school. I also think they Scouts need to make a choice between Scouts & other activities. They must be willing to make the commitment to Scouts to be successful.

 

Ed Mori

Scoutmaster

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

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Be careful not to confuse what you "feel" the scout program is with what the scout handbook says the scout program is. If what a leader "felt" determined the program we would have a thousand different programs going on, which seems to be a major part of the problem discussed on this board. There is one scouting program and it is determined by the contents of the Boy's handbooks, not the opinion of the adult volunteers.

 

We need to stick with what scouting is and not with what we think it should be. The BSA does not require scouts to commit to troop activities at the expense of other programs. In fact scouting encorages boys to do other things. We even give them advancement awards for doing other things. Scouting is about the person you become not about perfect attendance.

 

Also, patrol and troop meetings are year round, most other activities last a couple of months. We will still be here for the scout when wrestling season ends or little league is over. Kids need to follow their curiosity about the world around them. If they find other positive, healthy activities to experience then let them. Our job is to keep scouting so much fun that they keep coming back.

 

If we are not offering the best show in town that's our problem as leaders, not the scout's problem.

 

Let's put aside personal feelings and stick to the BSA program and methods.

 

Bob White(This message has been edited by Bob White)

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I understand that attendance at events and meetings is important. I also know of a few tyrannical band directors who demand so much time from the kids that it almost borders on abuse (ok, maybe that was hyperbole). Some athletic coaches are the same. They demand attendance and dont have any consideration for any other activity. In our troop we know at certain times some scouts will be gone for awhile, sports and band has its seasons, but scouting is year round.

 

BUT, and a big but it is,

 

If a scout is in a position of responsibility for rank advancement, he is expected/required to discharge that repsonsibiltiy according to the requirements of the job and advance expectation of the SM. A bando cant be SPL in the fall, a baseball player cant be QM in the spring etc. If the scout has to wait to take a POR to advance because of other activity committments, thats his choice, we will be here when he is available

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Bob,

Sorry. I have my own feeling about things like this. I can't be a mindless drone. There is nothing that says attendance is not part of a Scouts responsibility for advancement. Just because it isn't written in a BSA manual doesn't mean it isn't important. To me, attendance is one part of Scout Spirit.

 

Ed Mori

Scoutmaster

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

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But Ed, what is of great importance is what IS written in the scout handbook. The handbook says that scout spirit is how the scout lives the Law and Oath in his every day life. Knowing and following the program is not the part that is mindless.

 

Bob White(This message has been edited by Bob White)

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How fast is to fast to get First Class - if it is possible to earn First Class to quickly? I was looking at my copy of the Boy Scout Requirements 2002 tonight and read the First Class Requirements. This was when I realized that the Boy Scout Handbook (1998 Copyright) First Class Requirement 9C (Water survival skills) was no longer a requirement. I was anticipating that this requirement would take at least 4 or 5 visits to the local YMCA before all the boys could fullfill the requirement, we have a YMCA session scheduled once a month for the next five months. This would give the boys a good chance to earn First Class within their first year. However without this requirement four of our six first year Scouts, we are a start up Troop, will earn their First Class during October after being a Boy Scout for 6 months. Am I wrong in being concerned. Many of the First Class requirements were signed off on during our Councils Summercamp first year scouter program.

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Bob,

Correct me if I'm wrong but one of the points of the Scout Law is a Scout is loyal. Does poor attendance at Troop meetings indicate the Scouts loyality to the Troop?

 

Also, I recently went back & checked the records of our last 7 Eagles and none of them were 1st Class in their 1st year.

 

Ed Mori

Scoutmaster

Troop 1

1 Peter 4:10

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