AHG

[hendrickms24 20]

I came across this article and was surprised that I have not heard about this group.

I think BSA has dropped the ball and should let Scouters know about them.

What do you think?

 

http://www.ahgonline.org/uploads/AHG_at_Jamboree.pdf(This message has been edited by hendrickms24)

[emb021 16]

How as BSA dropped the ball??

 

I've know about them for years, knew about the MOU and chatted with them at Jambo.

 

 

[The Blancmange 67]

There are numerous threads discussing this group and the memorandum. Use the search function and "AHG."

[hendrickms24 20]

I have never heard of this group and just stumbled on it when I was surfing the Internet. I have not heard anything at District level and would thought since they have partnership with them they would have pamphlets to hand out. I also did a search on this forum but did not find any thing but did use the full name. Silly me should have used the acronym since this is America.

[ScoutNut 147]

Does your council hand out pamphlets on every group BSA has some sort of agreement with?

 

If so, they must have a very large store room.

[JoeBob 606]

ScoutNut: Be nice!

 

Hendricks: I can think of a BSA groups who would not want to liase with a girls group, and a few girls groups (GSA ?) who would resent the attention to another paramour.

 

Women, you can't win.

 

Wasn't it on this forum that I read the following question:

"If a married man speaks while he is alone in the woods, is he still wrong?"

[skeptic 992]

"American Heritage Girls" has been discussed here, mostly in the Political threads, and also in the Girl Scout thread. Yes, it was one of the peripheral groups prominent at the Jambo this summer. Was pleased to see them there. Was surprised to see nearby the Unitarian church; they were very positive and claimed the controversies noted here the past year or two were overblown and the result of a small group within the larger organization.

 

Our scout store is currently selling the AHG uniforms and materials; apparently the only place they are available in our area. They have had people come from long distances to buy stuff, as they are not staffed well enough to handle shipping.

[sherminator505 10]

"Does your council hand out pamphlets on every group BSA has some sort of agreement with?"

 

On its face, I don't disagree with this sentiment. However, I think it points to a deeper problem. How does the BSA benefit from entering partnerships? How does the other group benefit? Are resources being shared, or is the extent of the partnership to lend each other moral support and encouragement?

 

Truly, if these partnerships are meant to being mutually beneficial, then why haven't I heard about AHG anywhere outside this forum, and why is there no evidence that this partnership has had any effect on the BSA whatsoever even within this forum? In short, what's the point?

[clemlaw 55]

Well, I don't know what is contained in the "memorandum of mutual support", so I'm not sure how the BSA is failing in its obligation to let people know about them.

 

But according to the document linked above, they have "over 10,000 members". I don't know for sure whether that's adult or youth, but I suspect that's the combined number. The last I checked, the BSA membership was over 4 million, or about 400 times larger.

 

I'm sure AHG is a fine organization, but I'm not sure exactly how BSA dropped the ball in failing to promote this tiny organization.

[skeptic 992]

Seems to me that they are simply encouraging them as an organization with some similar central ideals. If I understand the AHG correctly, they were formed as a counter to the radical direction skew, as seen by many, of the Girl Scouts. It is far too early to really give opinions, but they seem to be growing.

[ScoutNut 147]

I got the feeling that BSA was hoping to get AHG Charter Organizations (churches, private schools, NFP groups) to charter some BSA units.

 

Membership is everything.

 

I wonder if BSA has gotten any member/units out of this so far?

[NJCubScouter 1389]

As has been discussed in previous threads on this group, it is a little more complicated than the AHG simply being a group for those who think the Girl Scouts is too "radical." It also does not seem quite correct to say -- as AHG does in the press release that the original poster linked to -- that the BSA and AHG are "perfect bookend programs to one another." Here is what the AHG says in their "Statement of Faith" on their web site:

 

American Heritage Girls is a Christ-centered leadership and

character development ministry.

The following Statement of Faith applies to all American Heritage Girls'

Charter Organizations, Adult Members and Adult Leaders.

 

"We believe that there is One Triune God Father, Jesus Christ His one and only Son, and the Holy Spirit Creator of the universe and eternally existent. We believe the Holy Scriptures (Old/New Testament) to be the inspired and authoritative Word of God. We believe each person is created in His image for the purpose of communing with and worshipping God. We believe in the ministry of the Holy Spirit who enables us to live a Godly life. We believe that each individual is called to love the Lord their God with all their heart, mind, soul and strength; and to love their neighbors as themselves. We believe that each individual is called to live a life of purity, service, stewardship and integrity."

 

It's not exactly the BSA's Declaration of Religious Principle, is it? The AHG has a specifically Christian focus. Now, that is fine if you want to be involved in a youth organization with that specific religious focus. But that's not what the BSA is. I am not sure what the "memorandum of mutual support" between the two organizations really involves, but any notion that these are two "mirror" organizations, one for boys and one for girls, would not be correct.

[clemlaw 55]

The actual memorandum, signed by Robert Mazuca, can be found at page 3 of this link:

 

http://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&q=cache:WoUKJJyGH38J:www.ahgonline.org/uploads/NewsletterAugust2009(1).pdf+%22memorandum+of+mutual+support%22+%22boy+scouts+of+america%22+%22american+heritage+girls%22&hl=en&gl=us&pid=bl&srcid=ADGEESg4zXvvHN1fD8A7vokqGKzz8cNSJr-bmaLPTo6G3FRRNliRxXx5NARF_fXp1IrM-ewh0FNauTo9zSnvwTYaa3F0Mv1-AoCk6d_ivMXmlIq_Gcz1NbitC4jOm9kZnKqfOo2jdxVm&sig=AHIEtbRZYY7eX8hvxKBEISfJQXv5FV8OJg

 

After various "whereas" clauses (such as AHG being "desirous of encouraging its member families to place their sons in a Christ centered chartered BSA Troop"), it is "Resolved, that [AHG and BSA] will work with each other within the rules and regulations of [AHG and BSA] to establish and nurture a positive beneficial relationship as well as to cooperate in establishing American Heritage Girl units and Boy Scout Venturing units as an expression of the organizational values of the organizations."

 

In short, it doesn't establish a "partnership", nor does it call for the BSA to promote AHG or hand out pamphlets at roundtables. As far as I can tell, in exchange for saying kind things about one another, it looks like both organizations might want to spin off some venturing crews from existing AHG units.

 

I suspect my daughter's scouting career will consist of being in GSUSA programs, and then Venturing when she is 14. While it looks like a fine organization, I don't think AHG is our family's cup of tea.

 

 

[Pack212Scouter 10]

My daughter has been involved with AHG for 7 years now. It was started because GSUSA national became such a radically liberal group, dropping the faith requirements, coworking with planned parenthood, openly accepting and even recruiting alternative lifestyles. That said, AHG is not BSA and does not pretend to be. It is a Christian based organization and will never be more. BSA has an agreement with them, because they hold to BSA tennants (much like a Christian based BSA unit does). Because of the Christian faith foundation, it would not be a good unit for another faith. With all that said, however it is an excellent program and much more closly mirrors the Scouting program than GSUSA does.

 

We have had representatives from AHG at our University of Scouting, Regional Jamboree, etc. Our Pack and their Troop conduct a joint spring campout. The memorandum of understaning allows AHG to utilize BSA training courses and BSA facilities the same that any BSA unit can.

 

Now before anyone gets in a tither, yes, there are excellent local GSUSA troops and leaders. AHG, myself, and BSA (from what I have been told) have issue with their national's values.

[ScoutOne 10]

As mentioned, AHG has been very comprehensively discussed already. This is not very unique, the BSA has memorandums of mutual support with many organizations (American Canoe Association, Knights of Columbus, etc).

 

The difference is that AHG has effectively used the agreement for public relations purposes and there is nothing wrong with that.