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bilgerat

Female leadership in Boy Scouting

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Ok, I will jump in with what is an against the grain opinion. This is the "Boy Scouts of America" correct? If we allow women leaders, do we allow women members? I always thought that was a bit odd, why one but not the other?

 

I am from the "older crowd" when there were no women in scouting. It was odd for me to see women as leaders, and even stranger women in OA. I'm not suggesting I am right, but those are my honest feelings. I see Boy Scouts as training boys to be men, and that should come from men leaders IMO.

 

 

I agree with jsummerlin.

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. . I should point out that I once read a really wonderful editorial item by a woman who was admissions director for a prestigious girls school, and her reasoning for the gender discrimination at that age really was very sound. I think we too quickly generalize away from gender, when at times it's inappropriate to do so.

 

And yes, while I know there are substantial and excellent female leaders; there are also pretty tepid and timid moms out there. I remember running into one troop that was a clique run by four women; the result was a pretty sanitized version of scouting.

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Mr Boyce, I have seen some "tepid and timid" male Assistant Scoutmasters, and I have seen all-male troop leadership drive their troops into the ground. I don't think either gender has a monopoly on success or failure in this business.

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Mr. Boyce, incompetence and ineptitude know no gender. You are looking for evidence to support your antiquated point of view with your "sanitized scouting" comment.

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The above criticisms miss the point. One chief value of scouting is providing a context in which a boy can stand on his own two feet and relate to adult men. . . which is rather less easy for a boy to do that relate with adult women. There is a difference between the genders that even the most well-meaning should rightly acknowledge. There is a value to role modeling as well. This has been long established.

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Your inability to acknowledge ineptitude in male leadership while only extolling the virtues of men in those roles speaks to a very narrow point of view. I readily see the need, importance and value of male role models, but I fail to see how this diminishes what female leaders have to offer. Quality leadership is quality leadership... BSA is in no position these days to turn away someone who is willing to step up based on gender. I fully agree with your statement that a chief value of scouting is to provide "a context in which a boy can stand on his own two feet." It is the second half of your statement that is a bit shortsighted. Boys need to learn how to relate to an adult world... not just "adult men."

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"One chief value of scouting is providing a context in which a boy can stand on his own two feet and relate to adult men."

 

I'd agree with that statement only after editing it to read "adults." Why should Scouting only teach boys how to interact with men?? Are there no women at the workplaces, colleges, schools and military institutions where these boys will be growing into men?

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"I am from the "older crowd" when there were no women in scouting."

 

Oh? You must be extremely old. Women have been in scouting almost from the begining. When I was a kid, we had den mothers and other cub scout leaders. Later on, it was common to see women as commissioners, district/council leaders, committee members, etc.

 

 

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Kindly explain to me how women can be good role models for male behavior. Not generic "good behavior," but MALE behavior.

 

I suppose I should offer myself as a good role model for young girls! :)

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Mr Boyce,

 

are you:

 

Trustworthy

Loyal

Helpful

Friendly

Courteous

Kind

Obedient

Cheerful

Thrifty

Brave

Clean

Reverent?

 

What parent of a girl would balk at that ?

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OGE,

While I am not involved in GSUSA, a good friend of mine has been until his daughter joined Venturing. He's an Eagle, served his country, yadda, yadda, yadda. The rules and regs he had to follow since he's male could be called severe compared to how the BSA treats its female leaders.

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My understanding is the GSUSA does treat its male leaders shamefully, but if the questin is does a male make a good role model for females, or for that matter, does a female make a good role model for males, as long as the role model in question is

 

Trustworthy

Loyal

Helpful

Friendly

Courteous

Kind

Obedient

Cheerful

Thrifty

Brave

Clean

Reverent

 

Who woudl complain? I have heard of anti male in Girl Scout functions, but I am not tlaking about the politics of Girl Scouts, only those traits that would be proper of a role model

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OGE,

Regarding your question about female's being good rolemodels for boys. I have the same stance as the GSA. I believe women can be good rolemodels for boys but that male role models are especially important to young boys during their developing years.

 

From: the GSUSA book "What We Stand For".

What is GSUSA's position on men in Girl Scouting?

The Girl Scout organization does not discriminate. Every volunteer and staff position in Girl Scouting is open to men as well as women. Because we believe that female role models are especially important to young girls during their developing years, men working directly with girls are asked to serve as part of a leadership team that includes women.

 

 

 

 

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OGE,

Regarding your question about female's being good rolemodels for boys. I have the same stance as the GSA. I believe women can be good rolemodels for boys but that male role models are especially important to young boys during their developing years.

 

From: the GSUSA book "What We Stand For".

What is GSUSA's position on men in Girl Scouting?

The Girl Scout organization does not discriminate. Every volunteer and staff position in Girl Scouting is open to men as well as women. Because we believe that female role models are especially important to young girls during their developing years, men working directly with girls are asked to serve as part of a leadership team that includes women.

 

 

 

 

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We have no female ASMs in the troop and no moms who ever camp with us. I would have no problem welcoming them if a mom wished to participate on that level. I imagine if we wanted to encourage the ladies to camp and serve as ASMs there are things we could do better to encourage them along, but that's not really our mission. My bigger problem is too many adults of either gender on campouts.

 

For whatever reason the tradition here of Scouting as a "dad thing" seems to begins in the Cub Scout pack. Lord knows in Cub Scouts we try to recruit any capable leader. But in 15 years I can remember only two female den leaders. It begs the point why we do Lad/Dad cakebake -- we probably should do a Mom & Me campout. Day camp is another story. By far the majority of leaders are female.

 

Interesting observation: I have four boys in the troop from single-mom homes. At one point or another all four of the mothers have commented to me a big reason their son is in Scouting is because they feel the association with adult males is important. Hmmmmm....

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