Methods of Scouting - Why Bother?

[Kudu 186]

The scout Methods are a theory? Only a theory? Where is that taught?

 

More importantly, where is the "Eight Methods" theory not taught? The answer is that no other Scouting association in the world teaches the so-called "Eight Methods," and for 75% of its history, the "Eight Methods" theory was not taught in the BSA either. The Methods of Scouting are merely a theoretical model of how Scouting works. In other words, a way of organizing the program elements. Or as Hunt writes, it is an overall approach, shaped by certain rules. I would add that both Methods and the specific rules change over time.

 

Neither Baden-Powell nor William Hillcourt used the current "Eight Methods" model as such, so it is just the current working theory of BSA Scouting.

 

Theories such as the "Methods of Scouting" merely help put things in perspective. B-P was very fond of detailed diagrams and such, but Hillcourt was the visionary who introduced the "Methods of Scouting" approach.

 

A perfect example of the fact that the "Methods of Scouting" is only a theory, is the Uniform Method. After Hillcourt retired, the Uniform Method was eliminated in 1972 for nine years. During this time there were "Seven (7) Methods". If Methods can be dropped and added, then the Methods of Scouting is a theory which changes as the BSA's emphasis changes over time.

 

The Scout Methods, as a refresher, are the transition between the Aims of Scouting and the Mission of scouting.

 

You answered your own question. When exactly was the so-called "Mission of Scouting" written? When did somebody first decide that "Scout Methods are the transition between the Aims of Scouting and the Mission of scouting"? Come on! Get real! Are you saying that before there was a "Mission of Scouting" there were no "Methods of Scouting"?

 

How do you take "how we do it" and make it merely a theory? The Methods are specific actions...personal growth method.

 

Well, that is a perfect example. If, as you say, "The Methods are specific actions," then what specific actions are unique to the so-called "Personal Growth" Method? Hillcourt did not believe that "Personal Growth" (or "Leadership Development") constituted a separate Method. Name one "specific action," Bob White, that you do to encourage personal growth that could not be more easily included under another Method (Advancement, for instance).

 

PL training isn't something you need to stop and do. It is a constant use of leadership styles that allow you to counsel and mentor rather than tell and yell.

 

Wrong. Hillcourt's Patrol Leader Training ("Intensive Training in the Green Bar Patrol") was a specific six month course in which the SM would "stop and do" a monthly meeting in which he taught Patrol Leaders how to conduct Patrol Meetings, how to conduct Patrol Hikes, how to conduct Patrol Campouts, etc. It was Patrol Leader specific training, not the current managerial leadership theories that teach the same abstract "leadership skills" to everyone from Troop Buglers to adult Cub Scouters.

 

If you feel that the only way to develop good young men is only through male association you need to go work that out with your mother. I am sure she probably feels that she had some relevant and valuable input in your growth.

 

My point exactly, most boys' lives are already dominated by female role models. Writers such as Michael Gurian maintain that the "victim" feminists were wrong, boys and girls are different, and boys need male mentors. Now, this may not be practical in Scouting because not enough males donate their time to public service, and without female leaders some units would fold. But no matter how loudly politically-correct people scream, Hillcourt's "male association" Method is still valid.

 

Which proves my point: if 100% of all BSA Scouters now agree that "Adult Association" is morally right and Hillcourt's "Men in Scouting" Method is just plain wrong then it should be obvious to everyone that the "Eight Methods" model is a theory, and like all theories is subject to change.

 

The uniform method and the outdoor method aren't even related other than they are both methods.

 

Hillcourt certainly found them to be related. It is only because BSA Supply produces an inferior product that zealots pretend that the Uniform Method is only an indoor Method.

 

If you are wearing a scout uniform on a winter camp-out, then someone did a poor job of teaching you how to dress for cold weather.

 

My Council paid to send me to the week-long national Okpik training course in Ely Minnesota. Breathable nylon makes a good, comfortable layer, and it dries out very quickly.

 

So kudu, you don't wear a scout uniform and you don't use the methods of scouting.

 

You write things that are not true and your understanding of Hillcourt is equally flawed at times.

 

Why would you go through the expense of sewing a patch on top of another one? Why not just design a shirt? The design simply needs to include a fleur-d'lies, the words "Boy Scouts of America" or the initials "BSA".

 

You don't understand the Uniform Method. Boys take pride in their accomplishments, which are represented by the badges on their uniforms. This in turn inspires younger Scouts. The best place for this process is the outdoors.

 

The scouting that Eamonn, Fscouter, OGE, CNY, myself and a few others talk about is much closer to the scouting of Baden-Powell and Hillcourt then what you have recommended.

 

You don't read very well, Bob, but if Eamonn, Fscouter, OGE, and CNY believe that what I actually write is not close to the spirit of the Scouting of Baden-Powell or Hillcourt, then I am always happy to discuss it with them.

 

Kudu

 

[Hunt 11]

I continue to think that we are often at odds over terminology and semantics. For example, take the discussion of "virtual patrols." That term was a red flag to a number of people--but what if the question had been phrased as, "What do you guys do when only one or two members of a patrol are able to go along on a particular campout?" That topic can be discussed without anybody denigrating the patrol method, or being accused of denigrating it. You can talk about whether it is a better delivery of the patrol method for the two boys to cook alone, or whether it is reasonable for them to join forces temporarily with another patrol. As I suggested, neither approach violates any BSA rules that I'm aware of, so the discussion really should be about the best way to deliver program elements. This can be done without all the angst.

[Eagle74 10]

In agreement that much of the (sometimes heated)discussion here and in some other threads is focused on semantics and terminology. Also, I think we often forget to read what comes after the single word identifying each method.

 

Sometimes I think we make this much harder than it really is, but equally so on both sides of the fence. The "hardliner" right toe the line and become intolerant of any wavering from the narrowest path. The "laissez faire" left operate from a position of anything goes - if it feels good, do it. Somewhere in between are those of us who understand the Vision, Mission, Aims and Methods, do our best to stay within the playing field boundaries, but also realize that at times there will be situations where we must adapt, improvise, and overcome. We do our best to follow the program, live up to the intent of the program, and don't intentionally circumvent the program.

 

BSA does not cover each and every situation encountered; and the world is not black and white like the printed word. In these situations interpretations and intentions become a factor. That is where my problem is - to whom does one turn or where does one find the "case law" or guiding light. In these situations I don't need a rote recitation of "what it says"; I already know what it says, I need interpretations.

 

"Life is like a box of chocolates" and Scouting is the one I like best.

[Kudu 186]

I agree with Hunt and Eagle74, and would suggest that most people just want to know what to do at next week's meeting :-)

 

However, theoretical discussions about "semantics and terminology" can be useful as well. For instance it was suggested that the methods don't reinforce each other, and aren't even related other than they are both methods. But indeed "the world is not black and white like the printed word."

 

For instance:

 

"What do you guys do when only one or two members of a patrol are able to go along on a particular campout?"

 

To me, from the Patrol Method point of view the answer is obvious: If two Scouts cook for themselves on one campout, they may be more likely to miss the teamwork of their whole Patrol and this may be a factor in convincing the rest of their Patrol to go along on the next campout.

 

However, "Adult Association" becomes a factor when the ratio of adult drivers to Scouts is too low to bring a Patrol's worth Patrol equipment for two Scouts.

 

This in turn is related to the Outdoor Method, in that some Troops use backpacking equipment even for car-camping, and can thus pack a Patrol's equipment in a smaller space.

 

Leadership Development is also a factor here, because only two Scouts from this Patrol showed up. How was the event planned?

 

Kudu

 

[Eamonn 61]

I agree that we are never going to have a program that is laid out in black and white -I don't think we want one.

I do believe that we can use the methods of Scouting to help and guide us along our way.

If we take all the methods as being of equal importance and do what we can to make them work, we surely must be on the path to providing what the BSA has in mind and will end up providing the youth we serve with a program that is in keeping with the vision and mission statements.

I visited the UK ScoutBase web site today.

I found the following:

For the little guys Beaver Scouts young people usually aged between six and eight years old. They belong to the first and youngest Section in the UK Scouting family. Young people can join Beaver Scouts in the three months leading up to their sixth birthday. They can move to the next Section, Cub Scouts, between eight and eight years six months.

With the new program that came out in the late 1990's there seems to be a lot more empathize on what they are calling "A Balanced Programme" For Beavers the Programme Zones split the whole programme into manageable areas. Each Zone represents a different development area in a young person's life. There are five Programme Zones in Beaver Scouting. They are:

Getting to Know Other People

Learning About Yourself

Exploring the World Around Us

Discovering Creativity and Practical Skills

Discovering Beliefs and Attitudes.

These Zones are delivered using 12 methods, which give the programme variety and range. Sometimes one method will be more suitable than another. On occasions you may use a number of methods within the same activity. So you should give your Beaver Scouts opportunities to:

Help others

Play games

Explore their world

Undertake prayer and worship

Listen to stories

Follow themes

Go on visits

Make things

Meet new people

Act, sing and make music

Chat

Go outdoors.

This changes slightly when they move up to Cub Scouts.

Programme Zones in Cub Scouting. They are:

Outdoor Scouting

Fitness

Discovering the World Around You

Creative

Beliefs and Attitudes

Caring and Community

Global.

Cub Scouts in the UK have 11 methods.

Games

Make things

Singing, stories, drama

Visits and visitors

Outdoors

Activities with others

Help other people

Themes

Prayer, worship and reflection

Team challenges

Try new things.

The Scout Section is for young people, usually aged between 10 and 14 years. A young person can come in to the Troop at 10 and may stay until they are 15 years old.

There are six Programme Zones in the Scout Section. They are:

Scoutcraft and Adventure

Global

Community

Fit for Life

Exploring Beliefs and Attitudes

Creative Expression.

These Zones are delivered using 10 methods, which give the programme variety and range. Sometimes one method will be more suitable than another. On occasions you may use a number of methods within the same activity. So you should give your Scouts opportunities to take part in:

Activities outdoors

Games

Design and creativity

Visits and visitors

Service

Technology and new skills

Team-building activities

Activities with others

Themes

Prayer, worship and reflection

Explorer Scouts are young people, usually aged between 14 and 18 years old.

There are eight Programme Zones, each with its own aims for the Explorer Scouts taking part in activities in that Zone. The Programme Zones for Explorer Scouts are:

Outdoors

Skills

Physical Recreation

Community Service

Environment

International

Relationships

Values

Unit programmes should always show the following underlying values and ways of working:

fun

getting on with others

activity

keeping the Promise

personal development

working together

responsibility.

Last time I was in England I picked up some of the new books that they have. It took me a little while to get the hang of how to use them, but once mastered they do go a long way to help plan meetings and answer the "Whats Next" question.

I can't try and speak for what they had in mind when they made all the changes. While of course UK Scout Leaders do have the same choice that we have, they can do their best to follow this new program or do their own thing.

Eamonn.