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Chapter 11 Announced - Part 10 - Post Confirmation Hearing/Judges Ruling


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On 5/13/2022 at 6:39 PM, fred8033 said:

Quick?  Quick in bankruptcy proceedings is three months or more.  

My guess - it would have to be weeks.  Lock all groups in a room and work through language ... understanding that the alt path is likely CH 7.

I haven't seen any update from the court.  The BSA finalized voting ~March 11 and it has been over a month since the hearing ended.

Purdue Pharma (which was a big bankruptcy) took from Aug 2 (voting end) to Sept 13 to get a judge's official ruling but the judge indicated he would approve Aug 27th.  (So they knew approval would occur <1 month after the vote).

We are over 2 months since the final vote and a month since hearing closed and no clear sign if this will be approved.  Is this 1+ time since the hearing closed typical?  For those closer to this case, is the mood/discussions that the judge is likely to approve?

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A friend contacted me privately, concerned I've not been posting. He knows I am on all the hearings and was checking in on me. Honestly, Eagle1993 does such an excellent job I had little to add. My at

Thanks for mentioning that.  Probably a good time for me to pop back up.  I just want to say thanks to everyone who participates on this and other forums (Fora?).  I take my role on the TCC seriously

I hope you find some peace.  For me, the start of the bankruptcy and having to address the abuse again was difficult. But, I went back to therapy and found some other people with similar experien

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Has the plan furthered specified the responsibilities, composition, and transparency of  the Youth Protection Committee? How many female abuse victims (Venture Crews, Explorer Posts...) will be on the YPC?

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Posted (edited)
17 minutes ago, RememberSchiff said:

Has the plan furthered specified the responsibilities, composition, and transparency of  the Youth Protection Committee? How many female abuse victims (Venture Crews, Explorer Posts...) will be on the YPC?

The only description and directives are as noted below. BSA CSA survivor members are apparently TBD. Per the SWG member's testimony, one of their members is a woman. 

2)    On or as soon as practicable following the Effective Date, form a Youth Protection Committee (“YPC”): The BSA shall form a committee including members from the BSA, Local Councils, Chartered Organizations, and nominees of the Tort Claimants’ Committee, and nominees of the Survivors Working Group. Assuming there are a sufficient numbers willing to serve on the YPC, members nominated by the Tort Claimants’ Committee and the Survivors Working Group shall be in equal numbers, respectively, and shall, in combination, be at least half the total membership of the YPC. The YPE will present to the YPC no less than twice per year. 

a)     The BSA will present to the YPC on the BSA’s current Youth Protection Program (the “Youth Protection Program”), including regarding the implementation of the actions set forth below, as soon as practical, but no later than six months from the Effective Date. 

b)    The BSA will report annually to the YPC on changes to BSA’s Youth Protection Program, compliance in the field, and trends of abuse identified and addressed during the period between meetings. This report shall also be shared with the Organization (defined below) and each Local Council’s Executive Commitee. 

c)     To the extent reasonably practicable, it is intended that the YPC be involved in all aspects of youth protection at the BSA, through discussion, consulatation and review with the YPE.

Edited by ThenNow
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2 minutes ago, RememberSchiff said:

 Hopefully Judge Laura Silverstein will require more clarity and empowerment.

Looking down the menu of the many potential issues she's wrangling, I don't see this one listed as so much as a footnote. I went back and scoured the fine print between the warnings about "undercooked fish," nut allergies, GF and VE items, and wine during pregnancy. Nary a word. Not on her radar. 

What is your proposal (or hope) for "clarity and empowerment,"  as to survivor members of the YPC? I don't want to presume. 

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32 minutes ago, ThenNow said:

Looking down the menu of the many potential issues she's wrangling, I don't see this one listed as so much as a footnote. I went back and scoured the fine print between the warnings about "undercooked fish," nut allergies, GF and VE items, and wine during pregnancy. Nary a word. Not on her radar. 

What is your proposal (or hope) for "clarity and empowerment,"  as to survivor members of the YPC? I don't want to presume. 

Previously stated over the years on this forum as were other good proposals by other members.

If after 2+ years,  more than $100 million in legal expenses, if this is an acceptable YPC/YPE in a reorganization plan approved by 86% of claimants  and if you are correct, with no concerns from the judge and maybe only one female  member in a passive, non-transparent advisory YPC ...

I'll stop there. 

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8 minutes ago, RememberSchiff said:

reorganization plan approved by 86% of claimants

I may be wrong, but I think that the majority of the 83% have been more concerned with the financial aspect of the reorganization and BSA did not enter bankruptcy to get input into Youth Protection. Any youth protection improvements are just a byproduct (though needed) to the BSA program. I am quite sure that the total expenditure out of the over $100 million only a couple percentage went towards crafting new policies. 

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1 hour ago, johnsch322 said:

I am quite sure that the total expenditure out of the over $100 million only a couple percentage went towards crafting new policies. 

My bet is on completely and totally fractional. Also, I am NOT advocating for other than a diverse group, but my understanding is the vast majority of claimants are men. Then, there is some commonality of age, as well. Simple facts, no? There MUST be diversity of experience - which includes multiple factors - but shouldn't it be in keeping with the proportions, whatever they are?

1 hour ago, RememberSchiff said:

in a passive, non-transparent advisory YPC ...

Is this a fact-based assertion or assumption, or crafted out of whole cloth? I really don't know. Not poking. Oh, I was being somewhat jocular. YP is critical, but I think she trusted the TCC and SWG on that score. "Whew. One thing off my overflowing plate!"

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55 minutes ago, ThenNow said:

My bet is on completely and totally fractional. Also, I am NOT advocating for other than a diverse group, but my understanding is the vast majority of claimants are men. Then, there is some commonality of age, as well. Simple facts, no? There MUST be diversity of experience - which includes multiple factors - but shouldn't it be in keeping with the proportions, whatever they are?

Since I seem to be one of the ones speaking up for women this week, I would say don't make the usual BSA mistake of only looking backwards. The future of scouting, if it survives, is going to include a lot more girls and women. And since females are sexually abused at a rate 5x that of males, at least according to universally available historical data so far, this is going to have to be a youth protection area of interest for BSA going forward. If the YPC is going to do any good, it has to be looking forward as well as taking instructive lessons from the past. 

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34 minutes ago, yknot said:

If the YPC is going to do any good, it has to be looking forward as well as taking instructive lessons from the past. 

Of course. From my understanding, BSA doesn't control the selection of survivors and, I think, it would be reasonable to trust the TCC and SWG. That is what I'm trying to say, for the most part. Consider the applicant pool, as well. My sense in this particular conversation is you both are assuming BSA is in control of this Committee. At least half of the members will be survivors, per the plan provisions. If the members are anywhere as close to as accessible as the TCC has been, which I believe they will be, survivors from all quarters will be heard, in the most active sense of the word. You are 100% entitled to rely on your experience with BSA and its reticence to do any manner of things you think advisable and sensible. My take from hearing the representatives of the TCC and SWG during the trial is they are VERY SERIOUS about these terms, making sure YP is fashioned to protect ALL current and future Scouts, etc. Why would they be engaged if they were merely backward looking? That doesn't compute. The case is about the past. YP is about the future. No? Are they to be equated in any way with the past behavior of BSA? I say not. Trust is called for, but I understand you have a long history of broken promises, deafness, non-responsiveness and wagon circling. If anyone thinks survivors behave in the same way and with the same motivations and interests as BSA they have not been paying attention lo these many days. Just my two cents this time. I spared you the other three. 

Edited by ThenNow
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7 hours ago, MYCVAStory said:

There very well may be winners and losers so the first spin ANY group puts on this is theirs alone.

I can't think of any direction this will go that won't lead to huge frustration for many.  If any part of this bankruptcy moves forward, this will be a long cycle of multiple appeals.  It's one reason I always thought it would end with a BSA only bankruptcy with other cases pursuing insurance, LCs and COs.  ... I never thought it would get this far.  ... Not the first time I've been wrong in my life. 

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10 hours ago, MYCVAStory said:

Some judges like this and in Purdue Pharma Judge Drain read his decision for OVER two hours! 

His reading (and expounding on his ruling) was over six hours long. Pop some corn and grab a beverage...

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