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Chapter 11 Announced - Part 4 Revised Plan


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(deleted) I’ll just keep waiting on the TCC’s summation and pass the time eating my popcorn as we learn which camps are selling so we can get closer to....how much and when?

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@CynicalScouter Thanks from me and frankly, surely everyone, for tracking on the status of National's bankruptcy pleadings, and the procedural steps, past and pending, in the Bankruptcy case. And your

Okay. Enough. If you aren't talking about court proceedings then drop it.  It would be a shame to lock this thread now.

A few random observations from watching this bankruptcy unfold over the past several months: The focus has clearly been on protecting the national organization first and then the local councils.

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3 minutes ago, RobertCalifornia said:

I’m a money grubbing victim who at this point really sees no need to give any ambulance chasing scavengers a piece of my rotting meat! I’ll just keep waiting on the TCC’s summation and pass the time eating my popcorn as we learn which camps are selling so we can get closer to....how much and when?

How does that work, though, for the insurance portion? That is where the real money will be. 

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Don’t know. I’m still learning. However, I believe the TCC and the appointed trustee do have a fiduciary duty to get as much settlement as possible for each legitimate claim. 

I could possibly think hard and add more details to my claim, but all the proof is already there. I could go back and write a couple of pages of speculation on why certain things may not have gone exactly the way I had planned for my life. I never really blamed anything in my life that happened to me on the incident. Perhaps I should if it will help the bottom line. 

I am very reluctant to hire a lawyer at this point just because a TCC lawyer said that might be a good idea.  Now, that could change as I learn more. I would also think that their % could be negotiated if I am the party bringing them into a party where they were not invited yet. 

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I am not sure it was a TCC lawyer who said that but rather a member of the TCC. I just reread the FAQ that the TCC put together and it isn’t exactly clear why one would need a lawyer though I do have one.  My understanding is that once the settlement trust is established that would be when a lawyer would be most helpful. I would like to hear some real expertise on this. 

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Now that I think about it, it sure would be nice if there was a platform where the claimants could speak to and amongst themselves.  This forum has been the single best place to learn anything about the case, but it only serves as a place to be cordial and meet on the battlefield. 

 I carried the torch for Scouting for many years. I do hope BSA survives and becomes more relevant for today’s families. America needs the values expressed in the movement. However, I’m a bit disappointed that national BSA is not losing a HA base. It is the policies of the national BSA that is leading to camp losses for local councils. It is local councils and their community volunteers that will carry the burden of rebuilding. 

Once the final bankruptcy format is adopted and BSA/LCs carry on with their business, I’m guessing that most current scouters will basically not think very much about the trust and insurance battles to come.. I certainly can’t blame them. The BSA bankruptcy is a business deal for their survival and rebirth.

Myself and others were dragged into the mess, so I’m now looking for due compensation. Greedy insurance companies are something that I look forward to fighting. Those guys have made billions and I’d love to see 1/2 of that 103b go to victims.  

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23 minutes ago, RobertCalifornia said:

Now that I think about it, it sure would be nice if there was a platform where the claimants could speak to and amongst themselves

Create a Facebook group or just do a search on simple forum websites. It's fairly easy to set one up.

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36 minutes ago, RobertCalifornia said:

However, I’m a bit disappointed that national BSA is not losing a HA base.

Well, taking out a $500M loan seems to be the way they avoid Les the loss of the bases. LCs could do the same assuming someone would grant such loan and payments could be made. Taking on the loan for the HA bases to stay may or may not be a good gamble. 

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10 minutes ago, MattR said:

Create a Facebook group or just do a search on simple forum websites. It's fairly easy to set one up.

This is just too personal for me to take to FB.  Even in a private group.  If that would help others, that's good.  For me, at this age and having lived this life, there is nothing that can make any difference, including discussion with other victims.  I like people and wouldn't run away from a discussion-but just really don't see that as my ticket to moving past this.  If it is a group that is more interested in talking about this case, I would bite.  Especially since I am (still) on my own and have limited legal background.

As I have mentioned, I would like to see a memorial site or park for survivor/victims.  Maybe I could go there and cry, drink a beer and feel better.  I don't even know.

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FYI...Town Hall:

NOTICE OF VIRTUAL TOWN HALL MEETINGS HOSTED BY THE OFFICIAL COMMITTEE OF BOY SCOUT ABUSE SURVIVORS

The next TCC Town Hall will be held on Thursday, June 30, 2021, at 5pm PDT/8pm EDT. 

Zoom link: https://pszjlaw.zoom.us/j/88993247600 (no registration required)

or

Join by phone: 888-788-0099, meeting id 889 9324 7600

To be discussed:

  • Status of Boy Scouts disclosure statement
  • Status of negotiations with the Boy Scouts, local councils, chartered organizations, and insurers
  • Other motions pending before the bankruptcy court
  • The plan confirmation process
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2 hours ago, johnsch322 said:

I am not sure it was a TCC lawyer who said that but rather a member of the TCC. I just reread the FAQ that the TCC put together and it isn’t exactly clear why one would need a lawyer though I do have one.  My understanding is that once the settlement trust is established that would be when a lawyer would be most helpful. I would like to hear some real expertise on this. 

The TCC has stated that this is a highly personal decision based upon many factors.  In States where victims may pursue cases against their abuser because the Statute allows it it's critical to have a case filed before any deadline AND an attorney specializing in abuse cases.  As well, if this goes to a trust to be sorted out for some the complexity may necessitate having legal expertise.  Again, it depends on the individual AND trust distribution plan.  I'll reserve comment on what is an "appropriate" fee or percentage to pay and only say that ALL financial agreements between clients and attorneys are negotiable.  What's "standard" is only so as long as it's accepted.  The most important point to all of this is that the TCC's attorneys/professionals and Coalition's counterparts represent those entities and NOT individual claimants.  Individual claimants MUST retain an attorney if they so choose for their individual situations.

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21 hours ago, MYCVAStory said:

Vegas odds say the next one will be Wednesday 6/30.  Stand by.

Pretty impressive powers of prediction - almost to the day. Any thoughts on this week's Powerball?

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5 minutes ago, gpurlee said:

Pretty impressive powers of prediction - almost to the day. Any thoughts on this week's Powerball?

I'm the wrong guy to ask for predictions.  I'm still waiting for my stock in Betamax, Enron, and Delorean Auto to come back.

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On 6/25/2021 at 5:40 PM, johnsch322 said:

What really isn't appropriate is how much the BSA has spent on lawyers fighting to keep from paying money to survivors.   

BSA is trying to stay in business.  I'm disgusted at the costs, but I really can't blame BSA.  It's the cost of our legal system. ... The only way to stop BSA's legal expenses is to reach an agreement.   

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On 6/27/2021 at 1:27 PM, Muttsy said:

The dioceses have Catholic Mutual which is backstopped by the Vatican  The LDS church has insurance with huge reinsurers like XL Bermuda. 

I've tried and deleted my writing multiple times.

I'm trying to ask how the insurance portion will go.  I just don't think it will be simple at all.  The BSA bankruptcy may be the easy part compared to the insurance case.  

Seriously, is there a projected insurance path?  Settlement (if even possible to settle) ... or will it be a gut-wrenching case-by-case battle over years. 

For 84,000 cases.  Prove the right council / CO.   Apply the right state laws based on the time.  Finding / proving the insurance company.  Finding / applying the COI details.   Is there even a way to get 30 year old COIs?  Or even just tracking down who insured who 30 years ago?  And then, who re-insured who?  ...   Was the incident already paid?  Blocked by liability limits?  Liability coverage not provided?  ... State XX had / has different insurnace laws.   

So ... 

  • Settlement?  Insurance funding a trust.  Claims from the trust blocking future claims?  Even that is a logistical nightmare to apply who's insurance company company pays who.  And, can insurance companies even settle without first getting some type of class-action  protection to cover all future claims?
  • Case-by-case?   Prove we insured them.  Prove that scout was in that council / charter org.  Prove the dates.  Prove the injury.  ... etc, etc, etc.  

Insurance companies have deep pockets to pay claims ... but the same deep pockets might be best used to pay lawyers. 

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8 hours ago, fred8033 said:

Seriously, is there a projected insurance path?  Settlement (if even possible to settle) ... or will it be a gut-wrenching case-by-case battle over years. 

For what it is worth and I have put quite a bit of thought/worry/anxiety into this.  My thoughts are there will be settlements from the insurance company's.  Most likely they have all or most all of them have run case scenarios from best to worse on their exposures.  Just like Hartford did they have come up with an amount they want to settle for, what there top amount they would agree or what they would say hell no come at us on a case by case basis.  I am sure Hartford knew they were getting off lightly at 650Mil. and that is why they are upset. On the other side of the coin I am sure that the TCC has come up with how much they will be asking each insurance company for (with some refinements with more data) just like the did with the LC's contribution amounts.  They have retained insurance specialists already.

The total amount of cases will be whittled down (duplicates, outright fraud, etc. Remaining survivors will get assigned a dollar value according to the 2 matrix we have seen or something similar. I believe this is were either lawyers or individuals representing themselves may have to make a case in some situations for their claim.  There may even be quick low dollar offer to shrink the pool of claimants further.  

Once the values are assigned and I believe that the money will be divided based on the assigned values.  If the total value amount of the claims is XXX,XXX and only XXX is collected than a survivor will get 50% of his assigned value (less fees) This will most likely be in several payouts over time.  

8 hours ago, fred8033 said:
  •  
  • Case-by-case?   Prove we insured them.  Prove that scout was in that council / charter org.  Prove the dates.  Prove the injury.  ... etc, etc, etc.  

It is hard for me to imagine a case by case situation or what insurer or even council charter org.  since all of the fight against the insurers  will be funded from the same pool of money.  If the insurance company that is liable for my case settled for myself (and all others they covered) and legal cost for that recovery was XX but another insurance carrier settled for the same amount but cost of recovery was 4 times XX or more it would turn into a logistical nightmare.

Of course this is just how I see the future but then I also have no magical ball.

Edited by johnsch322
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