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19 hours ago, yknot said:

Seems like this could be solved by having the SM and ASMs invite DLs on an annual adult one night camp out for Intro to Troop fun. You don't need WB for that or First Class either. Rather than a whole weekend of training, a late Sat afternoon, dinner, and early Sunday a.m. scoot in time for church would work for a lot of schedules especially if local. 

I would have benefited from not have such a low self worth and anxiety that I could have stayed.  Only thing that would have helped me unfortunately.  

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There can be no doubt that BSA refusal to include homosexuals or girls until forced to do so due to social and financial pressure has had an impact on membership. It might not have affected it in term

Wow. I don't think the problem is girls or girl parents at all. The problem is that not enough kids are interested in the program to begin with and that not enough people of any kind are growing up wi

I don't mind that you keep saying that you're better than us.  The thing I do mind is that you describe yourself as humble while you are saying that you're better than us.  

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2 hours ago, qwazse said:

I get the impression that calling WB an "advanced scoutmaster" course comes off as niche and exclusionary. Not in my mind. Growing up, my Webelos DL could have used some advanced scoutmaster training. He was a good guy, but we were a lot to handle. Same for a lot of moms. They need a lot of resourcefulness training (i.e. 1st Class Skills), and they'll hopefully get that one way or another. Then they need to face down a world of doctors, teachers, and (sometimes) law enforcement -- in addition to their children and spouse.

But I know that moms in my area (and that includes quite a few progressive thinkers) shrink away from any thought of being scoutmaster-ish. So, we play this little game of "Sure, we'll miss you on the camping with us, but while we're out enduring the elements for your boys, can you line up a fundraiser or two?" So, we call WB "advanced leadership" so DLs, CMs, MCs, and CCs feel inclined to take it. But, honestly, the course does not have a lot of specifics on how to run committees or dens. It teaches everyone how to be better scoutmasters. Even if you aren't in that particular position, knowing the thoughts and disciplines of your local SM/ASM makes you excel at your position.

Along those lines, I'm not thinking that a "1st Class Skills" per-requisite isn't the barrier one would think it to be -- even for the disabled scouter who would have to go through the hoops of getting a medical waiver like some of our scouts do. It's a way of giving adults the feeling that, as far as the troop in their neighborhood is concerned, they've arrived. Such scouters would walk into WB with the confidence and experience that they passed muster with the people they care about. I think it would narrow your pool of "eligible" scouters only slightly, but those scouters might be more enthusiastic about the course.

 My primary concern with the "advanced scoutmaster" label is that is too niche.  The Scoutmaster role is one of many in Scouting.  It is important - sure.  But so too are Cubmasters, Crew Advisors, Den Leaders, Committee Chairs, Committee Members, District volunteers, OA advisors, etc... 

When I view the Wood Badge curriculum I see an attempt to impart skills that help a volunteer in how they approach their volunteer role.  Wood Badge really isn't trying to teach anyone what their job is, it's trying to impart skills that help in how you approach the role you have.  How to try to raise the level of your ambitions for your role and think bigger.  How to set larger goals and strive to hit them.  Why would we want to replace that with a training for Scoutmasters and then try to shoehorn every other position into that class?  This is where I think we're having the wrong conversation.  The point isn't to replace the current Wood Badge with a advanced Scoutmastering version - the point is to create a new advanced course for Scoutmasters.  

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4 hours ago, 5thGenTexan said:

I would have benefited from not have such a low self worth and anxiety that I could have stayed.  Only thing that would have helped me unfortunately.  

The BSA does have adult leader training on Youth Mental Health First Aid derived from Mental Health First Aid (USA) (see links below)...however I am unaware of BSA leadership training and support services to specifically aid adult leaders with self-esteem and anxiety issues , such as Thoughtful Leader.

the BSA needs training...IMHO no, we scouters have different training and support services needs which the BSA should provide. Here in this post a scouter and a few others are attempting to express those needs. Maybe we can design a new course or two  or a weekly virtual district roundtable to address the OP's experience and let the Woodbadge discussion migrate to another topic.

Example of said BSA in Georgia



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