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3 hours ago, skeptic said:

 But they threw the first rocks.

The first rocks were thrown by the pedophiles.

The second by scout leaders at every level that failed these scouts.

That they are seeking legal recourse it not "throwing rocks".

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4 hours ago, skeptic said:

So, I find myself wondering how the lawyers at the core of this suit, the ones that most of us see for what they are, would respond to a concerted effort by interested legal parties to dig back into their families and drag out fifty year old family related bad acts or poor responses to them.  Just conjecture, and it is really not a Scout-like idea.  Still, I really detest their distortions and attitudes.  But they threw the first rocks.

You should be mad at the scout executives, not the lawyers.  They're the ones who killed scouting.

 

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54 minutes ago, CynicalScouter said:

The second by scout leaders at every level that failed these scouts.

I admit I got some mixed emotions on this. Grant you the research on this topic I did was over 20 years ago, and more information is now available than when I did it. But here is what I found.

Yes some professionals really did screw up and not follow National policy of the day. They did allow folks to continue in the movement when they should have been removed. That is inexcusable. THEY are the ones who failed our Scouts.

And yes the BSA did not report a large number of abusers to authorities. However this was a time before mandatory reporting laws were on the books. If the child's parents decided they were not going to press charges, and in the cases I studied it was the majority of cases, then there was nothing the BSA could do legally. If I remember correctly, one concern about pressing charges without the abused's testimony, was the BSA being sued for libel. What BSA could, and did, do was create an Ineligible Volunteer File to cross-reference new volunteer applications against in an attempt to keep out those suspected of abusing Scouts.

Even when mandatory reporting laws went into effect, there were limits as tho who were mandatory reporters. Initially it was  physicians and other medical personnel, and over decades has expanded. Also each state enacted their own laws. So in some states BSA employees were mandatory reporters before  BSA employees in other states.

Do not think I am callous towards the victims. I have had friends and neighbors who were victims. And knowing what I know now, I was being groomed by my Cubmaster/Scoutsmaster.  I lucked out. When something set off my senses, I switched troops. But I know folks who were abused by him. This was before BSA implemented YP and 2 Deep.

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7 minutes ago, Eagle94-A1 said:

I admit I got some mixed emotions on this. Grant you the research on this topic I did was over 20 years ago, and more information is now available than when I did it. But here is what I found.

Yes some professionals really did screw up and not follow National policy of the day. They did allow folks to continue in the movement when they should have been removed. That is inexcusable. THEY are the ones who failed our Scouts.

And yes the BSA did not report a large number of abusers to authorities. However this was a time before mandatory reporting laws were on the books. If the child's parents decided they were not going to press charges, and in the cases I studied it was the majority of cases, then there was nothing the BSA could do legally. If I remember correctly, one concern about pressing charges without the abused's testimony, was the BSA being sued for libel. What BSA could, and did, do was create an Ineligible Volunteer File to cross-reference new volunteer applications against in an attempt to keep out those suspected of abusing Scouts.

Even when mandatory reporting laws went into effect, there were limits as tho who were mandatory reporters. Initially it was  physicians and other medical personnel, and over decades has expanded. Also each state enacted their own laws. So in some states BSA employees were mandatory reporters before  BSA employees in other states.

Do not think I am callous towards the victims. I have had friends and neighbors who were victims. And knowing what I know now, I was being groomed by my Cubmaster/Scoutsmaster.  I lucked out. When something set off my senses, I switched troops. But I know folks who were abused by him. This was before BSA implemented YP and 2 Deep.

Agree

1 hour ago, CynicalScouter said:

The second by scout leaders at every level that failed these scouts.

Not making any excuses, but to judge peoples actions by today's standards or reporting is not really a great comparison.  A lot of moving parts, many scouters were booted from their troops, but there was not a good avenue of recourse.  Parents did not want to involved the police.  

Yes there were some failures, but not to the degree portrayed and in many cases actions were (for the time) appropriate.  Not saying right or wrong, just appropriate for the time.

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On 8/9/2020 at 1:39 PM, RememberSchiff said:

8/7/2020:  Motion of Official Committee of Tort Claimants Enforcing Automatic Stay ...Against Middle Tennessee Council Arising From Transfers of Estate Property

5. On July 1, 2020, the Middle Tennessee Council transferred substantially all of its real and personal property to an irrevocable asset protection trust (the “Transfer”) for no consideration. At the time of the Transfer, the BSA had reversionary property interests in the assets pursuant to the BSA’s and Middle Tennessee Council’s organizational charters and bylaws. The Transfer, made with the knowledge of BSA’s bankruptcy, violated the automatic stay and is void ab initio. Despite having a self-admitted interest in the transferred properties, BSA has not taken any action to enforce the automatic stay and restore the estate’s property rights notwithstanding the Tort Claimants’ Committee demands. Therefore, The Tort Claimants’ Committee seeks an order of the Court voiding the Transfer as a violation of the automatic stay.

...

 

47. There can be no dispute that the Middle Tennessee Council knew of the BSA’s bankruptcy case; indeed, it accepted the protection of this Court prior to effectuating the Transfer. The Middle Tennessee Council’s internal communications expressly state that the Transfer was planned in anticipation of BSA’s bankruptcy case. Moreover, the Middle Tennessee Council was one among hundreds of other Local Councils that enjoyed the benefits of the Preliminary Injunction in BSA’s bankruptcy case. Finally, and as noted above, a member of the Middle Tennessee Council’s executive board published an opinion in a local newspaper on March 3, 2020, concerning the effects of BSA’s chapter 11 case on the Middle Tennessee Council.

48. The Court should void the Transfer of the Assets as a violation of the automatic stay. The BSA is in a precarious position with respect to its ability to successful reorganize. Without access to the Middle Tennessee Council’s assets, which are property of BSA’s bankruptcy estate, it will only make it more difficult for BSA to propose a plan that fairly compensates the victims of childhood sexual abuse claims.

More details (179 pages) at source: 

https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/838822_1084.pdf

 

...

The BSA national organization said the victims committee was focusing on “a single transaction by a single local council,” and that all local councils have agreed to share information with the committee regarding past and future transactions involving their assets. ( ugh...walked right into that trap)

...

As part of the bankruptcy, the Boy Scouts obtained a consent order for a preliminary injunction halting lawsuits against the organization’s 261 local councils as “related parties.” The local councils, which run day-to-day operations for local troops, are not listed as debtors in the bankruptcy and are considered by the Boy Scouts to be legally separate entities. Attorneys for abuse victims have nevertheless made clear that they will try to go after campsites and other properties owned by the local councils to contribute to the victims fund.

In return for protection against litigation under the injunction, participating local councils must adhere to certain conditions of the consent order. Those conditions include providing 30 days notice to BSA of any action regarding the marketing, sale or transfer or real estate, and of any sale or transfer of personal property valued at more than $25,000 outside the ordinary course of business.

Attorneys for the victims committee say that on June 12, three days after the injunction was extended to Nov. 16, Brown and Middle Tennessee Council president John Bright Cage executed an agreement establishing the trust. On June 30, Brown signed quitclaim deeds for each of the five properties, which the council is now leasing from the trust. The council did not disclose the transfers until July 6, the deadline for opting into the consent order. Under the consent order, the council was required to disclose any sales, transfers or encumbrances of real property since July 2014.

A hearing on the motion is scheduled for Sept. 9.

More at source:

https://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2020/08/11/us/ap-us-boy-scouts-bankruptcy.html

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Posted (edited)

  

On 7/30/2020 at 4:52 PM, walk in the woods said:

10000 now and another 3+ months of advertising to go.

 

On 8/10/2020 at 9:27 PM, prof said:

There is an hour long infomercial playing in my area about this. Lawyers are really trolling for clients. 

https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/842040_1145.pdf   148 pages

To address the inaccuracies of those infomercials, the Debtor (BSA) now has  presented a motion to supplement  "the Bar Date Order to prevent potential Sexual Abuse Survivors from being misled or confused regarding the Bar Date and claims process and (ii) granting related relief" ...page 1 of above link

page 3 of above link

2. The Bar Date Order that was entered by this Court on May 26, 2020, remains in full force and effect, and this Supplemental Order serves to supplement and work in conjunction with the existing Bar Date Order.

3. The Bar Date Order is hereby supplemented to provide as follows: For the avoidance of doubt, the General Bar Date Notice, the Abuse Claims Bar Date Notice, the Abuse Claims Publication Notice, the Abuse Claims Email Notice, and the Abuse Claims TV Spot, attached to this Order as Exhibits 1, 2, 3, 4, and 5 respectively, and the statements contained therein, are the only notices and statements approved and authorized by the Court to be published, disseminated, or otherwise directed to potential Claimants, including potential Sexual Abuse Survivors, to provide notice of the Bar Dates and the other matters described therein. No other notice or solicitation to submit a Sexual Abuse Survivor Proof of Claim Form shall be provided without prior authorization of the Debtors or the Court.  (bolded by RS)

4. The Debtors are authorized to take any and all actions necessary or desirable to implement the terms of this Supplemental Order.

Note the attached Exhibits contained  numerous quoted advertising examples and content analysis.

https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/842042_1146.pdf   10 pages

This is DEBTORS’ MOTION FOR ENTRY OF AN ORDER SHORTENING THE NOTICE PERIOD...BSA is hoping to get this order signed ASAP - Aug 28, 2020 hearing?

8. The Debtors submit that ample cause exists to justify shortening the notice period required by Local Rule 9006-1(c)(i), and that a prompt hearing is in the best interests of the Debtors, their estates and creditors. On May 26, 2020, this Court entered the Bar Date Order, approving, among other things, an extensive noticing process pursuant to which the Debtors have instituted a multimillion-dollar notification process for Sexual Abuse Survivors. However, in parallel, it seems that certain law firms following the Debtors’ chapter 11 proceedings, including at least some that represent members of the Tort Claimants’ Committee and the Coalition, have engaged in their own advertising campaigns to try to solicit Sexual Abuse Survivors. To date, approximately 10,999 television spots related to Sexual Abuse Claims against the BSA in these chapter 11 cases have aired. Unfortunately, as set forth in the Motion for a Supplemental Order, many of these advertisements contain false and misleading statements and are not consistent with the content approved by the Court in the Bar Date Order.  page 4 of above link 

9. This is especially concerning because these advertisements will be airing at the same time as the Debtors’ media-based noticing campaign, mandated by the Bar Date Order, is set to begin. In fact, the Debtors have pre-purchased advertising time slots for their Court-approved print, television, and radio advertisements, set to start running on August 31, 2020. As described in the Roberts Declaration that was filed as Exhibit B to the Motion for a Supplemental Order, the Debtors do not have the ability to modify those dates, as all became fixed at the time of purchase. Therefore, it is imperative that the Motion for a Supplemental Order be heard prior to August 31 in order to prevent potential confusion resulting from the inconsistent information between the Debtors’ Court-approved advertisements and the law firm advertisements. As set forth more fully in the Motion for a Supplemental Order, failure to curb the on-going advertising campaigns could have disastrous consequences for these chapter 11 proceedings, including the need for corrective notices to be sent and a new Bar Date being set. This would be a devastating waste of the $6.8 million in estate assets being spent by the Debtors to comply with the Bar Date Order and potentially derail and jeopardize the parties’ efforts to reach a mediated resolution of these proceedings.    (bolded by RS)  page 5 of above link 

Edited by RememberSchiff
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8 hours ago, RememberSchiff said:

  This is DEBTORS’ MOTION FOR ENTRY OF AN ORDER SHORTENING THE NOTICE PERIOD...BSA is hoping to get this order signed ASAP - Aug 28, 2020 hearing?

 

Motion for Supplemental Order will be considered at a hearing scheduled for Aug 31, 2020 11am.

https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/842228_1148.pdf

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14 hours ago, RememberSchiff said:

Motion for Supplemental Order will be considered at a hearing scheduled for Aug 31, 2020 11am.

https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/842228_1148.pdf

"Attorneys say Boy Scouts is trying to limit abuse survivors from coming forward by curbing ads"

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/investigations/2020/08/25/boy-scouts-bankruptcy-attorneys-say-bsa-trying-curb-survivors-coming-forward/3439251001/

 

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Posted (edited)

The Coalition of Abused Scouts for Justice (the “Coalition”), by its undersigned counsel, hereby submits this motion requesting permission to appear and be included as a Mediation Party in the Court-ordered mediation.

2. The Coalition presently comprises more than 12,000 Members, each of which is a sexual abuse victim holding claims against Debtor Boy Scouts of America, among other parties…

3.The Coalition’s 12,000 Members – and growing – constitute a large majority of known tort claimants against the Debtors.4 The Coalition was formed to ensure that its Members’ interests are adequately and vigorously represented in these Chapter 11 Cases. No Member of the Coalition is a member of the Official Committee of Tort Claimants (“TCC”).

4.The Coalition has been made aware that the mediation is now progressing under the supervision of the Court-appointed Mediators, and the Mediation Parties (as defined in the Mediation Order) have submitted confidential mediation position statements and other documents to the Mediators. The Coalition’s foremost priority, after its formation, was to become a Mediation Party and play an active and constructive role toward a mediated resolution of their claims in these cases.

5.Accordingly, shortly after the Coalition’s formation, on July 24, 2020 Coalition Counsel wrote to the Honorable Kevin Carey (Ret.), Paul Finn and Timothy Gallagher (collectively, the “Mediators”) requesting that the Coalition be permitted to participate as a Mediation Party. …

6.Last week, the Coalition contacted representatives of each Mediation Party seeking their consent to the Coalition joining the Mediation as a Mediation Party, and if necessary, consenting to shortened notice for the relief sought herein. Each of the Mediation Parties, except the TCC, again either consented or did not communicate to us any objection to the Coalition’s request.


 

Argument

10. Given the Coalition’s substantial and growing membership, it is a crucial party to any effort to reach a global resolution in these bankruptcy cases. Simply put, the Coalition Members likely have, and will continue to have, the voting power to cause any class of sexual abuse claimants to accept or reject a chapter 11 plan, which may also contain non-debtor releases as a condition to a non-debtor’s significant contribution to the estates.

11.Mediation in general prevents the undue delay and excessive costs in connection with litigation and adversary proceedings related to claim validity. The Coalition seeks to participate in the Mediation to work towards a satisfactory resolution in a constructive manner that recognizes the voice of a multitude of sexual abuse claimants as part of the mediation/negotiation process.

(a) No Mediation could be fair and equitable without the full participation of the Coalition.

12.A settlement plan may only be confirmed when the Court holds that the plan is a fair and equitable distribution of the Debtors’ assets. …

13. If a critical party, such as this Coalition comprised of over 12,000 individual tort creditors, is excluded from meaningful participation in the settlement process, the plan may be fatally crippled from the get-go and not be considered fair and equitable…

14. A mediation involving all of the key parties will also allow the parties to engage more freely in “creative thinking about the allocation of the Debtors’ assets.” ...While the TCC certainly has a fiduciary duty to all sexual abuse victims (whether with filed civil actions or not, and whether from states presently with statute of limitations open windows or not), the sexual abuse victims are entitled to seek their own representative counsel. They have done so here with the formation of the Coalition by and through their Representatives.

...
full motion:

https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/842768_1161.pdf

Edited by RememberSchiff

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, RememberSchiff said:

2. The Coalition presently comprises more than 12,000 Members, each of which is a sexual abuse victim holding claims against Debtor Boy Scouts of America, among other parties…

They had in a previous court filing in July when they entered the case said more than 10,000. Now 12,000. And that doesn't even include however many thousands are being represented by Abused in Scouting and other firms/groups.

The numbers are not boding well for National. I am still in the "National survives but crippled" camp, but 12,000 claims * even just $50,000 payout per claim is $600 million.

Net assets at end of 2019 was $745,818,000 and that number will go down due to a decline in contributions in 2020.

And the number that the attorneys for the victims are tossing around is $1.5 billion.

The Councils are going to have to be on the hook for big, mega bucks.

Edited by CynicalScouter

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And now services are being cut at National and pushed down to councils...with no resources to support.   I spoke with our Registrar today, and she ain't happy...

btw, I think Registrars are the most under-rated, under-paid, and under-appreciated positions in council service centers... 

https://scoutingwire.org/transitioning-member-care-to-serve-and-support-bsa-council-staff/

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Posted (edited)

 

10 hours ago, CynicalScouter said:

They had in a previous court filing in July when they entered the case said more than 10,000. Now 12,000. And that doesn't even include however many thousands are being represented by Abused in Scouting and other firms/groups.

The numbers are not boding well for National. I am still in the "National survives but crippled" camp, but 12,000 claims * even just $50,000 payout per claim is $600 million.

Net assets at end of 2019 was $745,818,000 and that number will go down due to a decline in contributions in 2020.

And the number that the attorneys for the victims are tossing around is $1.5 billion.

The Councils are going to have to be on the hook for big, mega bucks.

Not to forget those who were first to step in line...

On 2/19/2020 at 8:14 AM, DavidLeeLambert said:

I find it interesting that the top three unsecured creditors listed in the bankruptcy filing are three former CSEs (Roy Williams 2000-2007 for $2.4MM, Bob Mazzuca 2007-2012 for $1.6MM, and Wayne Brock 2012-2015 for $1.14MM), and that Mike Surbaugh is #8 on that list (for about $700 thousand). Presumably that's expected liability under a pension or executive deferred-compensation plan. 

I am concerned that National will do something similar with camps - an essential camp list  presented to court sorted by 2020 attendance figures and capacity...look at all these local  council camps with low attendance and capacity, sell them first!  What about member feedback, program, cost, and convenience? Oh,  "Due to the rapidly changing impact of the COVID-19 pandemic on councils and their camps across the country, the BSA is accelerating the annual timeline for councils to submit their “Intent to Operate” for the 2021 long-term camp season. The 2021 Intent to Operate for long-term camps and council properties due date is now September 30, 2020. Per each council’s Authorization to Operate, and as required by NCAP standard AO-802, each council must file an annual “Intent to Operate”. An Intent to Operate must be submitted for the following properties and programs: " Be sure to list your camp's past attendance figures. https://www.scouting.org/outdoor-programs/camp-accreditation/ 

...the GSUSA trademark attorneys who are now looking for $6M,  and ... non-sexual injury lawsuits, ... :(

Another $0.02,  $0.01

Edited by RememberSchiff
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13 hours ago, RememberSchiff said:

The Coalition of Abused Scouts for Justice (the “Coalition”), by its undersigned counsel, hereby submits this motion requesting permission to appear and be included as a Mediation Party in the Court-ordered mediation.

Insurers respond...

CENTURY AND HARTFORD’S MOTION TO COMPEL THE ATTORNEYS REPRESENTING THE ENTITY CALLING ITSELF THE “COALITION” TO SUBMIT THE DISCLOSURES REQUIRED BY FEDERAL RULE OF BANKRUPTCY PROCEDURE 2019

https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/842905_1164.pdf   42 pages

Century and Hartford Argument Points:

RULE 2019 REQUIRES ANY ATTORNEY WHO REPRESENTS MORE THAN ONE CLIENT TO SUPPLY, AMONG OTHER THINGS,THE IDENTITY OF EVERY CLIENT HE OR SHE REPRESENTS

THE COALITION’S 2019 DISCLOSURES ARE DEFICIENT

THIS COURT SHOULD ORDER CLAIMANTS’ COUNSEL TO COMPLY WITH RULE 2019 OR, IN THE ALTERNATIVE,BAR THEM FROM PARTICIPATING IN THE BANKRUPTCY
 

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Posted (edited)

Debtor (BSA National) seeks Order to assume unexpired leases of nonresidential properties and fix the “Cure Amounts”.

https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/842937_1168.pdf

Some Excerpts:

8. The BSA is a party to numerous agreements that may constitute leases of nonresidential real property (collectively, the “Unexpired Leases”). The Unexpired Leases pertain to various properties, including forty-nine (49) Scout Shops located across the United States (The leases for many of the Scout Shop locations have expired under their terms, and the BSA and local council counterparties are continuing to operate on the same terms provided for under the expired lease ); the Summit Bechtel Family National Scout Reserve located in the New River Gorge area of West Virginia (the “Summit”); and a warehouse located in Charlotte, North Carolina:

  • Scout Shops: A significant portion of the BSA’s annual revenue comes from retail merchandise and product sales at approximately Scout Shops located across the United States. As of the Petition Date, these sales generated approximately $120 million in total annual revenue. Numerous local councils support these national sales efforts by designating a portion of their office space as a Scout Shop pursuant to lease agreements with the BSA. The Scout Shops are locations where the BSA sells uniforms, apparel, camping equipment, and other merchandise directly to BSA members. In return for the lease of local councils’ office space, the BSA remits monthly rent payments to such local councils based on a percentage of sales. This payment is calculated as eight percent (8%) of net sales at the Scout Shop location, plus an additional five percent (5%) escalator on annual sales that exceed $750,000 at such location.
  • Summit Bechtel Family National Scout Reserve: The Summit is a 14,000-acre high adventure facility located in the New River Gorge area of West Virginia. The real property and improvements of the Summit are owned by one of the BSA’s wholly owned subsidiaries, Arrow WV, Inc., and leased to the BSA under that certain Shared Services Agreement and Lease of Premises, dated as of February 13, 2017. Under that agreement, the BSA also provides the necessary services required to operate the Summit.
  • Overflow Warehouse: The BSA subleases nearly 50,000 square feet of warehouse space in Charlotte, North Carolina from MXD Group, Inc. under the terms of a sublease dated May 8, 2017. The BSA uses these premises as an overflow warehouse for the BSA-owned National Distribution Center, which is also located in Charlotte. MXD Group, Inc. is the lessee under a master lease agreement with CK Ridge Creek West III, LLC, dated August 1, 2016.

9. The Debtors have strategically reviewed the Unexpired Leases in connection with their efforts to maximize the value of their estates in these chapter 11 cases. As a result, the Debtors have identified the Assumed Leases, which will continue to provide meaningful value to their estates and ongoing operations. (The BSA is in the process of seeking a further extension of the period within which it may assume or reject certain Assumed Leases beyond the September 15, 2020 deadline set forth in the Extension Order. If one or more Assumed Lease counterparties agrees to grant such an extension, the BSA will file a certification of counsel with the Court for entry of an order approving the extension in accordance with section 365(d)(4)(B)(ii) of the Bankruptcy Code and remove the relevant Assumed Lease from Schedule 1 to the Proposed Order.)

Schedule 1 on page 17 of above link lists 51 Unexpired Leases of Nonresidential Real property and Cure Amounts.

Will the Debtors BSA assume subsidiary Arrow WV's lease of Summit Bechtel to the BSA? :confused:  Maybe   @Jameson76 can explain.

Update 9/11/20: Orders in this matter

ORDER (I) AUTHORIZING THE DEBTORS TO ASSUME CERTAIN UNEXPIRED LEASES OF NONRESIDENTIAL REAL PROPERTY PURSUANT TO SECTION 365 OF THE BANKRUPTCY CODE AND (II) FIXING CURE AMOUNTS WITH RESPECT THERETO

https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/848090_1310.pdf

ORDER APPROVING STIPULATIONS EXTENDING DEADLINE TO ASSUME OR REJECT CERTAIN UNEXPIRED LEASES...

https://casedocs.omniagentsolutions.com/cmsvol2/pub_47373/848097_1311.pdf

Edited by RememberSchiff

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Posted (edited)
17 minutes ago, RememberSchiff said:

Will the Debtors BSA assume subsidiary Arrow WV's lease of Summit Bechtel to the BSA? :confused:  Maybe   @Jameson76 can explain.

I seem to recall there was an appraisal/study of the amount Bechtel could be sold for. This move seems to indicate they are cleaning up any claims in order to offer it up for sale to settle claims.

One down, three to go?

Edited by CynicalScouter
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