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3 minutes ago, walk in the woods said:

So where are your council-owned units going to meet?  Do you really think if lawsuits start hitting your local churches, Legion Posts, Firemen's Associations, and VFW Halls, that any of them will ever let a BSA unit in their buildings again?  They'll close down their facilities to all youth serving organizations in a heartbeat.

Where we meet today.  We don't meet at our CO.  We pay for meeting space at libraries and public rental locations that are open to all groups.  

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What is legally right is not always morally right.

I would encourage everyone to not ask @ThenNow to rehash particular circumstances. They can be found by patiently browsing his posts. From what I read, they were far from legal. His claim would have b

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1 minute ago, Eagle1993 said:

Where we meet today.  We don't meet at our CO.  We pay for meeting space at libraries and public rental locations that are open to all groups.  

Do you have to provide a COI to meet in any of those places? 

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Just now, yknot said:

Do you have to provide a COI to meet in any of those places? 

Nope.  Just a check or cash.  These are meeting rooms anyone in our village can reserve online.  It costs us about $4,000 per year between the Pack and Troop.  Our CO does not have a building.

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2 minutes ago, InquisitiveScouter said:

Yikes...one reason we left our last CO because room rental was costing our Troop around $700 a year.

Saturday all day events hits us hard.  Overtime for custodian staff.  The day of the week meeting cost isn't bad ... PWD alone is $500+ for room rental. 

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21 minutes ago, Eagle1993 said:

Nope.  Just a check or cash.  These are meeting rooms anyone in our village can reserve online.  It costs us about $4,000 per year between the Pack and Troop.  Our CO does not have a building.

$4,000?   WOW !!!!!   

Our pack met in a local school and dens in family homes.  School charged us $6 per hour for the room.  I doubt we ever paid more than $300 for the whole year of reservations even when it included special events big events.  It was cheap because almost always (except weekend B&G and pinewood derby) the school was already staffed with janitors cleaning at night.  If Janitor was not there, it would have been unaffordable because we'd have to pay janitor costs.  

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6 minutes ago, Eagle1993 said:

Saturday all day events hits us hard.  Overtime for custodian staff.  The day of the week meeting cost isn't bad ... PWD alone is $500+ for room rental. 

Yep.  We moved our PWD to a weeknight when janitors were already there.   From $250 for cafeteria and janitor to about $30 for only the cafeteria.  Another option we did was adopt a local county / state park and reserve one of their shelters for big events.  But that's pricy too.

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2 hours ago, Eagle1993 said:

I've decided to stop FOS or any fundraising that helps my council.  They have over 200 claims.  I expect most of my funds will go to a bankruptcy settlement.  I will give them the funds I typically provide post bankruptcy settlement.  I'm going to recommend my Troop and Pack take a similar plan ... save your contributions and then provide post settlement.

How/where did you find the information about claims for your council?

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44 minutes ago, walk in the woods said:

Do you really think if lawsuits start hitting your local churches, Legion Posts, Firemen's Associations, and VFW Halls, that any of them will ever let a BSA unit in their buildings again?  They'll close down their facilities to all youth serving organizations in a heartbeat.

That's the hope/theory behind the new facilities agreements.

The idea is that if the COs are going to abandon their role as CO, maybe they'd at least allow for renting the facilities.

I suspect some COs are willing to rent out their multipurpose room once a week (for a $1) for a Pack meeting.

Others will simply want, as you said, to have Scouts completely out of the building.

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5 hours ago, ThenNow said:

You don't know this. In my case, our SE was aware. In fact, after I left Scouting he tried to get me to have sex with him. He was not my abuser, but if he did not abuse other boys, he was clearly interested and waiting the wings.

1. What age were you? If he "was waiting" until you were 18, as much as I dislike it/find it distasteful, it was perfectly legal

2. The legal obligations of the SE and the council and national are at least in question as it highly varies from state to state (and certainly did in the past).

3. NONE of this means I don't care you were abused. I genuinely do and I'm VERY sorry you suffered such abuse. Have the people who committed these acts been held to account? Have they been sued? To be blunt, they should be included with any such lawsuit as they are the proximate cause.

The question is if BSA and associated entities are legally liable for it and, if so, to what extent. In the situation mentioned here, it was outside of scouting. If you were underage, he'd be personally legally liable, but it was definitely outside his scope as an SE.
 

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13 hours ago, CynicalScouter said:

I am on the phone with my committee chair now. We are putting in a contingency plan we had discussed last fall at recharter.

We are going to do everything we can to get our Life Scouts to Eagle as soon as possible. There's going to be a lot of hand holding.

The CC had already drafted a letter to the troop parents indicating that we now expect BSA to be liquidated/cease operations by summer 2021. We'll be updating some language and pushing that out tomorrow.

You all know I hope Scouting survives for a number of reasons, including sentimental and the possibility our grandchildren could take part. To that end, is your "contingency plan" something others would find applicable to their effort or is it specific to your Council? Just wondering if it can be shared, whether here or via PM. Thinking out loud. 

Also, assuming Scouting remains viable, would any of you guys, who believe in full 360 degree abuse prevention training and see the current deficits, participate in advancing and improving the YPT?

Edited by ThenNow
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13 hours ago, CynicalScouter said:

I am on the phone with my committee chair now. We are putting in a contingency plan we had discussed last fall at recharter.

We are going to do everything we can to get our Life Scouts to Eagle as soon as possible. There's going to be a lot of hand holding.

The CC had already drafted a letter to the troop parents indicating that we now expect BSA to be liquidated/cease operations by summer 2021. We'll be updating some language and pushing that out tomorrow.

With the speed of the courts, don't you feel that this is premature? Having a letter ready is fine to be prepared, but sending it out? I don't know if anyone knows anything. I wonder if the judge would even have a inkling of the timing. If National fails in the summer, it by no means that the LC's fail immediately. I guess you are a cynic, but wow, this seems premature to me.

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4 hours ago, Eagle1993 said:

TCC believes YPT is weak as there are a ton of claims post YPT.  They are demanding changes.   

What SHOULD they do? What additional steps should be taken?

I'm not naive. Pedophiles (especially ones who are uncaught) target youth organizations like schools, scouts, churches, etc. If YPT is insufficient, what should be changed?

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