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ScottishNaomi

Taking my daughter on camp

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In terms of clothing alternatives: consider a polar fleece pull-over of thermal underwear. Then maybe a windbreaker for when she goes outside. That strategy comes with its own set of problems ... not the least of them being the need to keep track of more stuff. But, she may tolerate her zipper (never mind the zip-tie jokes), buttons, etc ... if she has an extra layer.

P.S. - When I lived with British roommates, I was always impressed with how they put up with the cold.

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I have no advice to offer, but I will say that I am bewildered when I see children dressed inappropriately. I am not just talking about temperature. I would include overly casual dress. I don't understand why these kids are making such a fuss about their clothes.

I was wearing a coat and tie to church by the time I was in 1st grade. We wore rain coats and galoshes to school on rainy days.  No complaints.

Back then, we were always expected to wear hats outdoors. I had a cute little newsboy cap in grade school. Later on, I wore a baseball cap. Not the one-size-fits-all kind. It was one of those fitted caps with a short peak. Again, no complaints.

I don't understand any of this talk about letting kids go out into the cold, half naked, in order to help them develop a sense of personal autonomy. It sounds like a bunch of self-help psycho-babble to me.

 

 

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Human nature drives us to learn by the consequences of our decisions. The time for concern is when we don't. 

Barry

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17 minutes ago, David CO said:

I don't understand any of this talk about letting kids go out into the cold, half naked, in order to help them develop a sense of personal autonomy. It sounds like a bunch of self-help psycho-babble to me.

Isn't that sort of what we do in the BSA?  Let youth make decisions and bear the consequences of those decisions?

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My son (age 13 at the time) wanted to go off on a January camping trip without a coat. He only had a hoodie.  "It's warm!" he told me.  No, you're taking a coat.  A scouter told me I should have let him learned. However I'd rather that lesson not be life threatening. 

He did appreciate having a coat when the sun went down. 

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16 minutes ago, Buggie said:

My son (age 13 at the time) wanted to go off on a January camping trip without a coat. He only had a hoodie.  "It's warm!" he told me.  No, you're taking a coat.  A scouter told me I should have let him learned. However I'd rather that lesson not be life threatening. 

He did appreciate having a coat when the sun went down. 

I've allowed scouts to make dumb decisions that left them uncomfortable and used it as a learning experience.  I have also intervened frequently and told scouts I'm uninterested in their preferences when it comes to clothing and safety. Clothing is part of your equipment, a tool, and like all tools needs to be used properly.  Uncomfortable scouts are their problem, scouts on their way to hypothermia (or sunburn) become my problem, and I like to solve my problems before they really become problems.  It's a fine line, and you have to take into account a myriad of situational facts to decide which approach to take to further the scout's learning. 

I will say that we have a packing list that's provided for each type of outing, and the scout is expected to have everything on it; we ask that parents help their scouts to Be Prepared in this way.  If you're supposed to have a wind/waterproof shell for an outing (in our troop you are, for every trip) than you need to have that with you.  If you don't want to bring iy you don't have to go.  What you do with it once you're on the trip gets handled as I mentioned above.  

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43 minutes ago, Jameson76 said:

Isn't that sort of what we do in the BSA?  Let youth make decisions and bear the consequences of those decisions?

I wouldn't let a football player go out onto the field without a helmet. Why would I let a scout go out into the cold or rain without proper clothing?

 

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I was frequently entertained as it were, by the things my son tried to pack or not pack in his early days.

"Why are you packing a jacket?"
"I might get cold."
"It's summer camp. The lows at worse next week is going to be around 80 with the highs in the 100s. And you should take rain gear just in case."
"So no jacket then?"

It took him YEARS to finally start remembering to pack sunscreen.  Especially when other scouts got tired of sharing. 

These days, he's got it. At worse I'll ask if he has a hat. And if I know he's going to be in direct sunlight a lot, I'll ask him about sunscreen. Just to humor myself. 

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18 minutes ago, David CO said:

I wouldn't let a football player go out onto the field without a helmet. Why would I let a scout go out into the cold or rain without proper clothing?

 

Not exactly the same.  Based on the laws in my state I am not allowed to have a choice on seat belts.  I doubt the referees would allow play without the required gear.  In some cases a helmet may be recommended (rock climbing for example) but it is your choice.

I however can choose to wear plaids and stripes together, I can choose to not wear a jacket and be cold.  I can also choose to carry a backpack that is too heavy on a hike, not bring a rainfly, and forget a sleeping bag.  

Through errors and omissions those life lessons are taught.  If you do not turn things in on time, likely you will not get credit for the work done, next time you may be on time

 

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18 minutes ago, Jameson76 said:

I can choose to not wear a jacket and be cold.  I can also choose to carry a backpack that is too heavy on a hike, not bring a rainfly, and forget a sleeping bag.  

You probably couldn't do that for very long in our unit before we would stop inviting you on campouts.  We expect our adult scout leaders to have good sense. 

 

Edited by David CO

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1 hour ago, David CO said:

I don't understand any of this talk about letting kids go out into the cold, half naked, in order to help them develop a sense of personal autonomy. It sounds like a bunch of self-help psycho-babble to me.

    I don't let mine go half naked as a learning experiance. She goes half naked (no coat and when she can get away with it no shoes) because she is hot natured. I know in the orginal post she said her daughter would go without a coat and then complain because she was cold. My post was next and I said mine did the same but I made her take her coat with (even we are just going from car to in the store) because of all the judgemental people and their stares and comments about her not having a coat on and I had one on.... I didn't clarify that she doesn't then complain because she is cold. She is VERY hot nature and will walk around in the house with bare minimum clothes, and me not much more and her dad will have all his clothes on including a pullover. Me and her prefer the heat set on 63 - he prefers 68 we compromise at 65 and we wear as little as possible and he covers up. 

   I would NOT make her put on a coat just because everyone else does, unless it's a rain coar for rain, because I am just as hot natured as she is and don't even own a "Winter" coat. It doesn't snow here but a few days a year and doesn't stick around. I have a light jacket I wear in the winter - I layer long sleeve shirts under it if it gets real cold or we are out with the animals for an extended time. She does the same, she has a winter coat for when they play for an extended time at school that she leaves at school, but it's not always about bad choices.

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1 hour ago, Buggie said:

My son (age 13 at the time) wanted to go off on a January camping trip without a coat. He only had a hoodie.  "It's warm!" he told me.  No, you're taking a coat.  A scouter told me I should have let him learned. However I'd rather that lesson not be life threatening. 

He did appreciate having a coat when the sun went down. 

I have never met a scouter who knowingly put scouts at risk of harm. They have a plan B C and D for bad decisions. I kept several extra, sleeping bags, socks, gloves, stocking hats, and so on for those bad decisions. My pack always weighed 15 more just in case. 

A boy will not understand the cost of independence if he is given the opportunity of independence.

Barry

 

 

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On 3/26/2018 at 2:43 PM, ScottishNaomi said:

Hi all, I have an issue I'd like resolved regarding my daughter Charlotte .

She goes on numerous guides camping trips mainly to get to know the other guides from other areas and, due to the fact it can get cold, especially at night when they are around the camp fire singing songs and generally interacting, I always try to ensure she is wearing her warm jacket and has it done up but she refuses point blank to wear it so I leave her to her own choice but she then complains to me whilst I'm tucking her in bed, that she is frozen.

Any tips?

Make her bring the warm jacket, but leave her to make her own decisions. When she complains, tell her that was her choice.  How old are guides?    

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