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2 hours ago, CalicoPenn said:

Who is the source of any of these quotes and ideas?  None if it is coming from National.  National says there will be single gender Troops - they specifically said there would be no mixed gender Troops.  24 hours later, there's "reporting" all over the place that the BSA is going to have mixed gender troops, and maybe even mixed gender patrols.  Where did that come from?  Scouters speculating like wild because they can't seem to take what National has said at face value and they say they can't take what National says at face value because they don't trust them.

Trust is a two-way street - A Scout (and a Scouter) is Trustworthy.  As you continue to repeat these rumors, as you continue to state that you don't trust National, ask yourself just how Trustworthy you are.

 

 In regards to coed troops with segregated PATROLS ( emphasis, sorry about the confusion earlier) that is from Mike Walton. I can't find the quote, but it is on Facebook. And considering how well connected he is, he tends to know more than the average Scouter. He is one of the top volunteers who attend the annual meetings.

As for not trusting national, how can we when they go back on what they say. They take polls and either don't show any or all of the data, or ignore the results. When they polled about changing the youth membership policy, they excluded results from LDS Scouters. They didn't even poll on changing adult membership policy, they just did it. Instapalms had something like 75+ % Strongly against and 10+% against, totaling 94% , doing away with 3 month tenure requirements.

Then there is changing the Cub Scout requirements on the spur of the moment, While I was not involved in June 2015 Cub Scout Program, I know folks who were. They spent a long time talking to folks in the field about improving the program. I though the new program was a major improvement. Then without any warning, or giving packs the opportunity to work out the kinks of the first year, they up and change the program. And then they did it again with the camping requirements for Second and First Class.

 

How can folks trust national?

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3 hours ago, CalicoPenn said:

Who is the source of any of these quotes and ideas?  None if it is coming from National.  National says there will be single gender Troops - they specifically said there would be no mixed gender Troops.  24 hours later, there's "reporting" all over the place that the BSA is going to have mixed gender troops, and maybe even mixed gender patrols.  Where did that come from?  Scouters speculating like wild because they can't seem to take what National has said at face value and they say they can't take what National says at face value because they don't trust them.

Trust is a two-way street - A Scout (and a Scouter) is Trustworthy.  As you continue to repeat these rumors, as you continue to state that you don't trust National, ask yourself just how Trustworthy you are.

 

This might carry weight if none of the rumors ever came true. But they continually do. So to say those who hear and pass along rumors are not trustworthy is a non sequitur.

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2 hours ago, Eagle94-A1 said:

... When they polled about changing the youth membership policy, they excluded results from LDS Scouters. They didn't even poll on changing adult membership policy, they just did it. Instapalms had something like 75+ % Strongly against and 10+% against, totaling 94% , doing away with 3 month tenure requirements ...

Wait ... what?!? But, we constitute a MASSIVE portion of the Scouting world! How can they just exclude our position like that? Where did you hear this? 

I am shocked and appalled, lol. 

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11 hours ago, Eagle94-A1 said:

 In regards to coed troops with segregated PATROLS ( emphasis, sorry about the confusion earlier) that is from Mike Walton. I can't find the quote, but it is on Facebook. And considering how well connected he is, he tends to know more than the average Scouter. He is one of the top volunteers who attend the annual meetings.

 

Single gender programs are definitely the way to go....unless it’s inconvenient or National can’t figure out which way the wind is blowing on this today, or National realizes volunteers and a few councils will just do whatever they want anyway.:(

Edited by an_old_DC

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Since the program has not been officially released we really don’t know what bsa will do. They could do something totally different from what they’ve said they’d do. 

Edited by Back Pack

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14 hours ago, cocomax said:

Two months ago I saw a video in which a Cub Master was sitting with her son and daughter and was being interviewed by CNN about girls joining the pack and those words came out of her mouth.  I will never forget that. 

Meh. We all (myself included) are susceptible to saying dumb stuff when we are put on the spot that may not be factual or even how we really feel after further consideration. If, as you say, those quotes don't come from anyone of importance in BSA, then why give them any weight or relevance on this topic or allow them to rent space in your brain?

Besides, you probably know in your heart that it isn't even a valid statement so why allow that phrase to taint your perception of Nationals - especially when it did not disseminate from Nationals. Per this board, Nationals has enough problems already without having to own stuff they didn't even say. ;)

 

Don't let "fake news" form your opinion especially when you know it is fake.

 

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9 hours ago, The Latin Scot said:

Wait ... what?!? But, we constitute a MASSIVE portion of the Scouting world!

Not any more. Didn't you hear that LDS is quitting scouts? Oh wait, that was another rumor. :D;) 

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14 hours ago, cocomax said:

Two months ago I saw a video in which a Cub Master was sitting with her son and daughter and was being interviewed by CNN about girls joining the pack and those words came out of her mouth.  I will never forget that.

 

Lots of wild things have been said by and about BSA members and programs in recent years during cable news interviews. If we took each of them at their word, we all should have hung up our uniforms by now because the imminent destruction of the organization upon passage of any of the recent membership policy changes should have already happened by now, as predicted by many an interviewee. 

Average opinions about anything don't make for good cable news interviews. Extreme viewpoints do. 

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10 hours ago, The Latin Scot said:

Wait ... what?!? But, we constitute a MASSIVE portion of the Scouting world! How can they just exclude our position like that? Where did you hear this? 

I am shocked and appalled, lol. 

 

It was in one of the reports regarding the survey and was in the fine print. I need to be more specific though as not all LDS scouters were excluded. WESTERN REGION'S results excluded LDS folks, and that region has the bulk of the LDS membership.

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59 minutes ago, Eagle94-A1 said:

 

It was in one of the reports regarding the survey and was in the fine print. I need to be more specific though as not all LDS scouters were excluded. WESTERN REGION'S results excluded LDS folks, and that region has the bulk of the LDS membership.

Assuming this is true then the only reason I would exclude would be that I knew they were gonna leave anyway. Very interesting, if true.

I disagree to some degree with Hawkwin in that yeah we can drive ourselves crazy reading BSA tea leaves but the problem is when they lack trust and transparency this is a direct result; folks start arguing hypothetical because they want to get their position on the table since some folks at BSA seem to lurk the boards.

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9 minutes ago, Tampa Turtle said:

Assuming this is true then the only reason I would exclude would be that I knew they were gonna leave anyway. Very interesting, if true.

Except that despite how desperately some people seem to wish it were true, the Church has no plans to leave Scouting at this time. Mercy, people just can't let this one go, lol.

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8 minutes ago, Tampa Turtle said:

we can drive ourselves crazy reading BSA tea leaves but the problem is when they lack trust and transparency this is a direct result; folks start arguing hypothetical because they want to get their position on the table since some folks at BSA seem to lurk the boards.

The single most important ingredient in the recipe for success is transparency because transparency builds trust.

Transparency is not about restoring trust in institutions. Transparency is the politics of managing mistrust

We believe that transparency creates trust

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2 hours ago, Hawkwin said:

Not any more. Didn't you hear that LDS is quitting scouts? Oh wait, that was another rumor. :D;) 

I'm about ready to go all Don Quixote on these darn rumor mills. :rolleyes: :laugh:

Edited by The Latin Scot

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2 minutes ago, Jameson76 said:

The single most important ingredient in the recipe for success is transparency because transparency builds trust.

Transparency is not about restoring trust in institutions. Transparency is the politics of managing mistrust

We believe that transparency creates trust

Your first sentence seems inconsistent with you nest sentence.  To me, "build" is consistent with "restore."  But that is me.

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3 minutes ago, The Latin Scot said:

Except that despite how desperately some people seem to wish it were true, the Church has no plans to leave Scouting at this time. Mercy, people just can't let this one go, lol.

False Memory Syndrome, Mandela Effect,...where large groups of people remember an alternate history.  Learned all about it from X-files this week.  :D

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