Flag Etiquette

[hops_scout 9]

Right now, if you look at www.usma.edu, you'll find a picture of the Yankee's opening day. Guess what... nice, big flag HORIZONTAL!

[Fat Old Guy 11]

" It provides guideline for how the Flag SHOULD be treated. It is not a law."

 

Sorry, but it is a law. It is part of the US Code which are the laws of the land. There are no penalties for violating these laws since the Supremes decided that showing disrespect for the flag was protected by the 1st Amendment.

[Region 7 Voyageur 10]

Is there a difference between a flag being carried and one being held? In a parade this flag in question would be carried. On the baseball field was the flag just held in a horizontal position? We all hold a flag in a horizontal position when we fold it.

 

I do not see what the great urgency is to have this large flag in a parade if the only way it can be done is by violating the U.S. Flag Code. Sure we have seen flags carried in parades horizontally. It still is not correct. I assume that those that carry the flag in that manner are just ignorant of the code.

 

Though there are no penalties involved with violating the U.S. Flag Code, all citizens should do their best to comply with it.

 

Now can we get people to stop wearing American Flag bandanas or using them to blow their nose?

[Region 7 Voyageur 10]

Red Feather posted:

 

"carry the flag

 

The rest of the nay sayers can pound sand, with a flag this size, respect for the flag and what it stands for is what matters. Not to mention what the lesson taught to the scouts carrying it. And what they will learn and remember."

 

I believe that respect for the flag and what it stands for means following the U.S. Flag Code. The lesson taught to scouts is that it is ok to treat or display a flag any way you wish. They will learn and remember that it is ok to display the flag in this manner because they saw Scouts do it in a parade.

 

 

 

[LittleCarl 10]

Well, as I expected, this has set off a firestorm of debate. I do appreciate everyones input here. It certianly has been enlightning. This debate can go on and on. The Troop Committee last night decided to not carry the big flag in the parade. Instead each scout will carry a 3'x5' flag on a staff. We will continue to find the right way to display this flag.

 

Thanks to all.

[Fat Old Guy 11]

"We will continue to find the right way to display this flag."

 

A really, really big flagpole

[LittleCarl 10]

I think you guys are missing the point here. We are not going to erect a pole for this Flag. We are not going to fly this Flag on a pole.

 

An earlier thread made a good point. We may have every right to carry this flag horizontally to the ground. However, it may not be exactly what the US Flag Code says, we may be twisting words and what kind of message is that sending to our scouts and future scouts.

 

I think to solve this and end my headache, it s time to retire this Flag.

[CC4LIFE 10]

Hi all,

As scoutmaster for the above mentioned troop, I would also like to thank everyone for their thoughtful insights. As a Master Sergeant in the Army Nat'l Guard, I could not be more proud than seeing smartly dressed scouts participating in such a patriotic manner. And I am soon going to put myself in harms way to defend their freedom to do so. I can also appreciate others views on this as relates to the U.S. Code.

This flag is the latest of a series of flags flown from a memorial to 9/11. We have retired one already. For our boys this is NOT a "biggest flag" issue. Our troop was part of the memorial dedication and continue a close association to that memorial.

As eluded to by little carl, our committee has decided that for now, we won't use the flag. We are, however, going to look into a official waiver by the appropriate agency. We don't want undue pressure being brought upon our scouts. Once again, Thanks for all the input.

 

[AggieScouter 10]

I got in on this debate a little late, here's my two cents:

 

If we want to get really picky, what about the flag on our Scout(er) uniform's right shoulder? The canton/union/field should be at the front, that is, the Scout uniform has it on backwards.

[AggieScouter 10]

I got in on this debate a little late, here's my two cents:

 

If we want to get really picky, what about the flag on our Scout(er) uniform's right shoulder? The canton/union/field should be at the front, that is, the Scout uniform has it on backwards.

[hops_scout 9]

Yeah, you're a little late, and it probably would have been best to just stay out of it. As it has been mentioned before (search), that is an Army thing whereas our uniform wouldnt fall into that area.

[hops_scout 9]

Yeah, you're a little late, and it probably would have been best to just stay out of it. As it has been mentioned before (search), that is an Army thing whereas our uniform wouldnt fall into that area.

[Owl62 13]

Even though carrying this large Flag is a technical violation of the US Flag Code, I think the intent is good and the manner of display is respectful.

 

I have no problem carrying or displaying such a large Flag horizontally as long as it is done respectfully with intend to honor the Flag and what it stands for.

 

On 11 September 2001, there was a Soldier in NYC who was shown wrapped in a Flag - technically inappropriate, but it brought tears to my eyes for another reason. Some of you will underand why. Personally, I was proud of that young Soldier.

 

 

There are examples of of actions that show far more disrespect for our Flag:

 

Displaying, worn, torn, tattered, faded Flags.

 

Making Flags into articles of clothing or baggage.

 

Failing to show proper respect when the Flag passes by such as in a parade (stand, remove hat, etc.).

 

Failing to show proper respect when the Flag is raised, lowered,passes by, or when the National Anthem is played.

 

Just discarding an unserviceable Flag in the trash.

 

Deliberately desecrating the Flag.

 

Homeowner associations declaring display of the Flag as a violation of the association agreement.

 

And it appears that many in this country think that the last words of the National Anthem are "Play Ball" or "Start Your Engines".

 

I personally consider cutting the Flag into pieces during Flag retirement ceremonies as desecration and I will not participate in that. Cutting the Flag up for such a purpose is not mentioned in the US Flag Code either but it is routinely done, even by Scout units. The preferred method of retirement is by burning and or burial.

 

I was once at a Flag retirement ceremony at a Scout activity. When the Flag was placed in the fire, we were asked by the program director to turn our backs and walk away from the fire in a show of respect. Respect our Flag by turning our backs and walking away! I was the only person that remained, at attention, watching until every part of that Flag was consumed by the fire. I was not about to turn my back on that Flag!

 

Just please respect our Flag.

 

I once observed an elderly man in a wheelchair at a parade, struggle to his feet, stand at attention with his hand over his heart as a Color Guard carried the Flag past, while nearly everyone around him just sat on the curb. I have no idea who he was but it was obvious from his actions and bearing that he once served in the military. And he showed respect.

 

I have heard a suggestion that unserviceable Flags be buried with Veterans. I think that is a very good idea - and acceptable. What more appropriate honor for a Veteran to rest forever with a Flag that will be guarded by the Veteran for eternity by a Veteran who served under the Flag.

 

Our country it the only one that I have been in or know of where the display of the Flag is widespread and common - not just from government facilities, but from our homes, our vehicles, and our persons. People from other countries usually do not understand this passion for our flag. I do.

 

The Flag is a very personal symbol for me. I was born under it, serve under it, and I will respect it and safeguard it.

 

Why must we argue over things like this? - the well intended display of our Flag.

 

The Flag stands for all this country was, is, and will be. It is a symbol of sacrific, honor, unity. It is ours. Just please respect the Flag for what it stands for.

 

[Owl62 13]

Even though carrying this large Flag is a technical violation of the US Flag Code, I think the intent is good and the manner of display is respectful.

 

I have no problem carrying or displaying such a large Flag horizontally as long as it is done respectfully with intend to honor the Flag and what it stands for.

 

On 11 September 2001, there was a Soldier in NYC who was shown wrapped in a Flag - technically inappropriate, but it brought tears to my eyes for another reason. Some of you will underand why. Personally, I was proud of that young Soldier.

 

 

There are examples of of actions that show far more disrespect for our Flag:

 

Displaying, worn, torn, tattered, faded Flags.

 

Making Flags into articles of clothing or baggage.

 

Failing to show proper respect when the Flag passes by such as in a parade (stand, remove hat, etc.).

 

Failing to show proper respect when the Flag is raised, lowered,passes by, or when the National Anthem is played.

 

Just discarding an unserviceable Flag in the trash.

 

Deliberately desecrating the Flag.

 

Homeowner associations declaring display of the Flag as a violation of the association agreement.

 

And it appears that many in this country think that the last words of the National Anthem are "Play Ball" or "Start Your Engines".

 

I personally consider cutting the Flag into pieces during Flag retirement ceremonies as desecration and I will not participate in that. Cutting the Flag up for such a purpose is not mentioned in the US Flag Code either but it is routinely done, even by Scout units. The preferred method of retirement is by burning and or burial.

 

I was once at a Flag retirement ceremony at a Scout activity. When the Flag was placed in the fire, we were asked by the program director to turn our backs and walk away from the fire in a show of respect. Respect our Flag by turning our backs and walking away! I was the only person that remained, at attention, watching until every part of that Flag was consumed by the fire. I was not about to turn my back on that Flag!

 

Just please respect our Flag.

 

I once observed an elderly man in a wheelchair at a parade, struggle to his feet, stand at attention with his hand over his heart as a Color Guard carried the Flag past, while nearly everyone around him just sat on the curb. I have no idea who he was but it was obvious from his actions and bearing that he once served in the military. And he showed respect.

 

I have heard a suggestion that unserviceable Flags be buried with Veterans. I think that is a very good idea - and acceptable. What more appropriate honor for a Veteran to rest forever with a Flag that will be guarded by the Veteran for eternity by a Veteran who served under the Flag.

 

Our country it the only one that I have been in or know of where the display of the Flag is widespread and common - not just from government facilities, but from our homes, our vehicles, and our persons. People from other countries usually do not understand this passion for our flag. I do.

 

The Flag is a very personal symbol for me. I was born under it, serve under it, and I will respect it and safeguard it.

 

Why must we argue over things like this? - the well intended display of our Flag.

 

The Flag stands for all this country was, is, and will be. It is a symbol of sacrific, honor, unity. It is ours. Just please respect the Flag for what it stands for.

 

[Owl62 13]

Even though carrying this large Flag is a technical violation of the US Flag Code, I think the intent is good and the manner of display is respectful.

 

I have no problem carrying or displaying such a large Flag horizontally as long as it is done respectfully with intend to honor the Flag and what it stands for.

 

On 11 September 2001, there was a Soldier in NYC who was shown wrapped in a Flag - technically inappropriate, but it brought tears to my eyes for another reason. Some of you will underand why. Personally, I was proud of that young Soldier.

 

 

There are examples of of actions that show far more disrespect for our Flag:

 

Displaying, worn, torn, tattered, faded Flags.

 

Making Flags into articles of clothing or baggage.

 

Failing to show proper respect when the Flag passes by such as in a parade (stand, remove hat, etc.).

 

Failing to show proper respect when the Flag is raised, lowered,passes by, or when the National Anthem is played.

 

Just discarding an unserviceable Flag in the trash.

 

Deliberately desecrating the Flag.

 

Homeowner associations declaring display of the Flag as a violation of the association agreement.

 

And it appears that many in this country think that the last words of the National Anthem are "Play Ball" or "Start Your Engines".

 

I personally consider cutting the Flag into pieces during Flag retirement ceremonies as desecration and I will not participate in that. Cutting the Flag up for such a purpose is not mentioned in the US Flag Code either but it is routinely done, even by Scout units. The preferred method of retirement is by burning and or burial.

 

I was once at a Flag retirement ceremony at a Scout activity. When the Flag was placed in the fire, we were asked by the program director to turn our backs and walk away from the fire in a show of respect. Respect our Flag by turning our backs and walking away! I was the only person that remained, at attention, watching until every part of that Flag was consumed by the fire. I was not about to turn my back on that Flag!

 

Just please respect our Flag.

 

I once observed an elderly man in a wheelchair at a parade, struggle to his feet, stand at attention with his hand over his heart as a Color Guard carried the Flag past, while nearly everyone around him just sat on the curb. I have no idea who he was but it was obvious from his actions and bearing that he once served in the military. And he showed respect.

 

I have heard a suggestion that unserviceable Flags be buried with Veterans. I think that is a very good idea - and acceptable. What more appropriate honor for a Veteran to rest forever with a Flag that will be guarded by the Veteran for eternity by a Veteran who served under the Flag.

 

Our country it the only one that I have been in or know of where the display of the Flag is widespread and common - not just from government facilities, but from our homes, our vehicles, and our persons. People from other countries usually do not understand this passion for our flag. I do.

 

The Flag is a very personal symbol for me. I was born under it, serve under it, and I will respect it and safeguard it.

 

Why must we argue over things like this? - the well intended display of our Flag.

 

The Flag stands for all this country was, is, and will be. It is a symbol of sacrific, honor, unity. It is ours. Just please respect the Flag for what it stands for.