When is it OK for an ASM to raise their voice and yell at a Scout?

[ItsBrian 284]

3. After talking with other ASM's, it turns out that 3 ASM's convened beforehand on how to handle the situation. They came to an agreement that they needed to be firm with a talk in front on the Troop.

 

Then it’s on all 3 of them.

[Beagles 0]

Why would an ASM ever address such an issue unless the SM and SPL asked him to?

Our had to leave early the night before and our elected SPL was not available to attend camp as he was at the Jamboree. So we had ASM's, a handful of volunteer parents and an ASPL in place.

[Beagles 0]

Welcome to the forum, Beagles.

 

I think things are really messed up when a boy's merit badge "homework" has priority over building a bonfire. 

It was the last day of camp. It wasn't the actual bonfire for end of week activities - it was the building of the bonfire.

 

Either he finishes his homework and earns the badge or it goes as a partial, to be worked on NEXT year at camp. The badge was Eagle required Environmental Science which is not offered by our Troop locally.

[Beagles 0]

Thanks everyone for the input. We are scheduling a conference between the SM, the ASM's in attendance and the parents (myself included) of the 2 boys in question, to discuss the full nature of the events as they unfolded. I do believe there was some mis-communication going on between the boys and leadership. 

[Back Pack 431]

Our had to leave early the night before and our elected SPL was not available to attend camp as he was at the Jamboree. So we had ASM's, a handful of volunteer parents and an ASPL in place.

So the ASPL wasn't in charge? The SM should have made that clear.

[ItsBrian 284]

I have a feeling your SPL is like the “stone†for the troop, where issues occur without him there.

[David CO 1783]

Thanks everyone for the input. We are scheduling a conference between the SM, the ASM's in attendance and the parents (myself included) of the 2 boys in question, to discuss the full nature of the events as they unfolded. I do believe there was some mis-communication going on between the boys and leadership. 

 

I'm sure there was.

 

You said that your son talked to the ASM about having merit badge homework to complete.  Did the ASM or the ASPL excuse your son from helping out with the bonfire?

 

I'm trying to figure out why the 3 ASM's felt that the 2 boys ditched their responsibilities.

Edited September 29, 2017 by David CO

[Stosh 3452]

And it is clear who's really in charge, running the show.  When are the adults going to learn that if one stays out of it, they never get caught holding the bag.    The more the adults get in there and mess with things, the more obvious it becomes that they don't know the first thing about running a Boy Scout troop.  3 ASM's ??? where's their SM babysitter.  This should have been handled by the SM, even if it meant the discussion was postponed until a later date and time in a different location.

[David CO 1783]

SM babysitter?  Good grief. 

[Stosh 3452]

Well, if the ASM's aren't going to behave, they need a babysitter.  Not everyone's maturity matches their chronological age.

 

I've worked with youth all my life, produced fine Eagle Scouts, young men going off to Seminary and a lot of boys in the military serving their country.

 

Never in the past 50 years did I ever give any of them "both barrels" (good grief) as has been suggested.

Edited September 29, 2017 by Stosh

[qwazse 4342]

It was the last day of camp. It wasn't the actual bonfire for end of week activities - it was the building of the bonfire.

 

Either he finishes his homework and earns the badge or it goes as a partial, to be worked on NEXT year at camp. The badge was Eagle required Environmental Science which is not offered by our Troop locally.

There is no MB that has to wait to the next year of camp. Scout is given his partial the last day of camp. The day he comes home, he e can contact a counselor in his community, explain whatever he didn't complete at camp (although it should be clear on the partial what requirements were completed), fulfilli what was lacking. Counselor signs card, boy takes the remaining two portions to SM, SM signs scout's portion, and retains unit's portion as a minder to record advancement with council and order the patch. The whole process could be done in a couple of days ... depending on what the scout does in his free time.

 

So, someone wrongly instilled a "now or never" sensibility in this scouts mind. That added unecessary drama.

[Back Pack 431]

Addressing the actions of two scouts in front of the troop is worse than asking them to sing for lost gear. It's demeaning and embarrassing. The asms should be ashamed of themselves for such a poor decision. Would they do that to their own kid?

[David CO 1783]

Addressing the actions of two scouts in front of the troop is worse than asking them to sing for lost gear. It's demeaning and embarrassing. The asms should be ashamed of themselves for such a poor decision. Would they do that to their own kid?

 

Yep.

[qwazse 4342]

Addressing the actions of two scouts in front of the troop is worse than asking them to sing for lost gear. It's demeaning and embarrassing. The asms should be ashamed of themselves for such a poor decision. Would they do that to their own kid?

I suppose none of you were ever cussed out for your poor strokes by a Red Cross aquatics director who once flew in the Women's Air Corps.

 

There's a special place (chain smoker's section) in heaven for Beatty. She's probably still waiting for one of us to meet there after a drowning incident.

 

Could the ASM's have done better by deferring decisions to the SPL? Yes.

Should they be the brunt of everyone else's ridicule? Adults need to have fun somehow.

Should they promise Johnny they'll do better next time? Yep.

Ashamed? Naw. They got the boys home alive and well.

 

Let the SM know. Especially if the scout is still so bitter about it that he's not attending meetings. Move on.

[SSScout 1615]

Lots of "if onlys" and  "what I woulda dones" here.

 

""The work is done by whoever shows up"".   

  Everybody (you, me, them)  has to make choices as to what is important when.   MB?  Now? Is it possible to complete  later? Will I be able to help at other service projects?  

Did the other Scouts voice the idea the MBcompleters had "diched them"?  Is that where this came from?  Did some other Scouts choose the project over completing their own MBs?  Colors the issue....

 The ASMs' alleged comments/diatribe/discussion   might better have been done at a SMMinute.  Make it obvious the values that are valued (completing  assigned duties, project "cheerful service", supporting buddies, pride of successful completion), maybe the MB completers could have fulfilled their "duty to others" with another job...  but that would 've been on them to offer, rather than the ASMs insisting, yes?  This comes with maturity and experience.   And, hey, what is Scouting about if not gaining maturity and experience?

 

IMHO, the ASMs dropped the ball.  Counsel the MBcompleters PRIVATELY. Give them the opportunity to Do The Right Thing themselves, rather than dragging them thru the gauntlet of the Troop.  This ain't Marine Corps Bootcamp.