Jump to content

Recommended Posts

Why should they have to?  Our former Prez didn't have to.

 

:) and if one can't provide one, they are in no position to prove it either way.  Where do you think 8 year old kids learn how to get away with anything they want unless they have lessons like this?  :rolleyes:    I just saw someone here in America can prove he is heir to the British monarchy.  Good luck with that.  I'm thinking the British laws are taken more seriously than we on this side of the pond.

Link to post
Share on other sites
  • Replies 63
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Posts

And that is really the whole bone of contention in a nutshell - the idea that someone who is transgendered really isn't transgendered just because they say they are.  There is a divide between the peo

Sure it does.   If BSA required you to put your gender from your birth certificate on the membership application, and you didn't, you've committed fraud.   It would be the same not checking the bo

When I joined, nobody asked to see my birth certificate, either.  They took my parents word for it too.  The difference is that my parents weren't lying.   This girl's parents should not be afforded

Well, the issue here is that at face value, the unit violated state antidiscrimination law by accepting the membership, then later kicking the kid out.  So the council had a legal and public perception loser on their hands.  Settle the suit and have a lesson learned. 

 

Was fraud committed by the family? Because the BSA rules in force at the time was to use the sex listed on the birth certificate.

 

Can you have discrimination where fraud was the basis for the membership in the first place?

Link to post
Share on other sites

Was fraud committed by the family? Because the BSA rules in force at the time was to use the sex listed on the birth certificate.

 

Can you have discrimination where fraud was the basis for the membership in the first place?

 

 

Did it say that in the application? The last version of the app I've seen just asks for gender, not providing any standard by which gender is established. If the parent talked to the pack leaders about it, which it sounds like the mother did in this case, checking the "male" box isn't necessarily fraud. We don't know exactly what was said between the parent and leaders. Maybe she asked for guidance and a leader told her to check the "male" box. 

 

We don't know, hence the "rush to judgement" I mentioned earlier. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Applying for membership in a male organization using a male organization application when one is not male, can be construed as fraud.  Rush to judgment, just produce a birth certificate and that should be plenty of evidence one way or the other.

 

Were the parents asked to provide a birth certificate? Was there anything in the application that stated that birth certificate gender must be indicated on the app? 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Were the parents asked to provide a birth certificate? Was there anything in the application that stated that birth certificate gender must be indicated on the app? 

 

No, the application asks what IS the person's sex, not what do they think or what they want it to be. 

 

The application asks what IS the person's address and phone number, not what they think or what they want it to be.

 

As soon as one opens the flood gates, it is only a matter of time before BSA leadership will accept pedophiles because after all, these people love to work with children just like everyone else.

 

While one may think that pedophiles working with children unacceptable, I for one see no difference with that than giving young men free access to young girls' restrooms and locker rooms.

 

It just depends on whether one is the parent of a daughter or not.

Link to post
Share on other sites

No, the application asks what IS the person's sex, not what do they think or what they want it to be. 

 

The application asks what IS the person's address and phone number, not what they think or what they want it to be.

 

 

In New Jersey that's actually not how it works. Self-identifying gender is even allowed on a NJ drivers license. 

 

So in this case, in this state, yes indeed the gender is what Joe and his parents say it is. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

In New Jersey that's actually not how it works. Self-identifying gender is even allowed on a NJ drivers license. 

 

So in this case, in this state, yes indeed the gender is what Joe and his parents say it is.

 

I'd like to be a 6'4" Swedish ski instructor. Just because I put it on a form doesn't make it true...or honest.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Were the parents asked to provide a birth certificate? Was there anything in the application that stated that birth certificate gender must be indicated on the app? 

 

I know you didn't ask me, but I would bet a dollar that the answers are No, and No.

Link to post
Share on other sites

As soon as one opens the flood gates, it is only a matter of time before BSA leadership will accept pedophiles because after all, these people love to work with children just like everyone else.

 

Sooner or later, every thread in Issues and Politics ends up in ridiculous analogies like this.

  • Upvote 1
Link to post
Share on other sites

In New Jersey that's actually not how it works. Self-identifying gender is even allowed on a NJ drivers license. 

 

So in this case, in this state, yes indeed the gender is what Joe and his parents say it is. 

 

In my state it is illegal to sell butter produced outside the United States.  After all does anyone know what is going on in the food production beyond the scope of the FDA?  Or Wild Alaskan Salmon, a product of China (yes, that's what the label said),

 

Sooner or later, every thread in Issues and Politics ends up in ridiculous analogies like this.

 

And it wasn't that long ago that I thought anyone thinking females could be BOY Scout leaders, and the boys could be gay, and the leaders could be gay and now girls can be boy scouts if they lie on their application.  What makes one think this analogy is ridiculous?  Just exactly when will we be getting to the bottom of the slippery slope?

Link to post
Share on other sites

In my state it is illegal to sell butter produced outside the United States.  After all does anyone know what is going on in the food production beyond the scope of the FDA?  Or Wild Alaskan Salmon, a product of China (yes, that's what the label said),

 

 

Ok. But we're not talking about butter or salmon. Were talking about gender identity, and the rules about that are pretty clear in the state in which this case took place. School laws in NJ are similar. The fraud suggestion just doesn't hold up. 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...