The PLC Has Decided: Mixed Aged Patrols in May

[Stosh 3452]

This is sort of why I started the Crew. To allow us a program that can hit the skids if the youth step back.

 

By hitting the skids, I mean we just do a little camping, a service project here and there, whatever I'm interested in at the time and is pretty easy on my wallet. In other words, if you want to act like a patrol that hikes and camps with your mates, fine. If you want to do something bigger, here's who you call.

 

There is no way adults would allow me to do that with the troop. Now that I'm the old guy in the room, I can nudge them away a little. The den moms and dads think I'm a little crazy, but usually a little chocolate and coffee fixes that. The general excuse is the boys are too busy to focus. If they said that to a sports coach they'd get a line like "Well, I guess he can focus on the bench." But somehow, that's an acceptable excuse for not putting in their own hour a week.

 

this is where you and I differ, I DO run the crews I have been involved with exactly like my troops.  Just a bit of adjustment for age maturity, but pretty much the same.

 

Just last night I was at an orientation meeting for a new crew I am setting up.  I suggested they break the crew into smaller groups, maybe those that were friends hang together, maybe those interested in canoe/kayaking hang together, maybe those that backpack and camp hang together, those that bike hang together, etc. 

 

They run the show....

 

They can go after advancement if they want....

 

If you don't want to pay for the activity yourself, better plan some fund raisers, etc.

 

It's the same spiel as I would give if I was setting up a troop.

 

It's pretty much the same as I am currently running my Webelos den of boys.  They sit and work as patrols and have "PL's", do flags, etc. just like they would starting out in a troop.

[Eagle94-A1 2687]

back. I mentioned

 

1B) And this is where I think I'm balancing on the high wire between advising and mentoring vs. adult leading. I want to incorporate a little more ceremony into inducting new members, COHs, etc. I'm use to having meaningful ceremonies for investing new Scouts with their Scout Badge/rank, and receiving their neckerchief and woggle when they join the troop and commit to staying. I'm also use to a little more ceremony at COHs than " The following Scouts earned their Second Class Badge...."  Also want the youth doing the bulk of the COH instead of the adults, if not the whole thing. ( FYI Troop growing up Scouts handled giving out ranks up to First Class. Star, Life,  MBs and some special awards were given out by the adults.)

 

 

Want to clarify why I feel like I'm on a balancing act. I want change, I want to make it more meaningful. I think having them do more would help improve. Build esprit de corps and develope a sense of spirit. I want to hand a bunch a scripts to the SPl and say pcik one.

 

But asking my son about it, i.e. improving COHs with ceremonies he tells me "advancement isn't really important, "everyone gets it, no one fails," "it's not a big deal"." and "Earning ranks is more ha.ha fun than serious.". So he doesn't think it would matter. BUT the only ceremonies he's seen are Cub Scout ones.

 

 

 

More ideas to improve the troop.

 

3) More PLCs. The PLs and other youth running the meetings need to get together more often and prepare. Very haphazard

 

4) This is one that I want so badly, and now that we got several First Class Scouts or higher, and are going to mixed aged patrols, I WANT THE PLs, ASPL, SPL AND SELECT SCOUTS TO SIGN OFF ON THE S-T-2-1 (up to their actual rank, i.e. a 2nd Class PL can't sign off on First Class requirement). At the moment it's only the adults who sign off.

 

More later

[Sentinel947 1205]

Eagle 94, have I sent you my wishlists from when we started this process in my Troop?

​I recommend you create something like your list above in a document.

 â€‹In that document, outline in order of importance your ideas. Include with them where the official BSA resources support your idea, and why the change would benefit your scouts.

​I found that tool invaluable in securing support for different changes.

[Eagle94-A1 2687]

I pecked a list a while back when I was out with the shoulder   I mentioned some of it, not all of it, at the PLC/ planning meeting back in December, but didn't do the entire list.

 

Part of the challenge for me is not stepping on folk's toes. Yes, I've been with the troop 2 years, but it's been as a committee member and as I could make it. Traditions, location of equipment throughout the church faciltiy, how the weekly ops of the troop, etc I'm still learning. Plus I do not want to step on anyone's toes, especially the SM's.

 

I've tried to talk to the SPL, and do so when I can. The problem is the NSP. Since I am the NSP ASM,  I've spent more time with them and trying to keep the other adults off their backs than I can talking to SPL.

 

One other item I would like to do is send a few youth to NYLT. I have not read the syllabus, let alone staffed it, but if it is even 1/2 as good as the old JLTC and BA22 courses I staffed and participated from, than it is something that these guys need. Funny thing about that is youngest son's den chief, soon to be ADL. I've worked with the DC extensively in the OA and he staffed Cub Scout day camp for me. he's a NYLT grad and was SPL last year, and is a great Scout. Anyway he visited the troop after the pack meeting, becasue he needed to give our new Scout his AOL plaque that came in for him. He noted the issues  and not only promoted NYLT but made the comment, " ... and once they come back from NYLT, the adults needs to let them follow through, otherwise it will eb a waste of everyone's time and money,"  I've seen first hand what happens when you get gung ho folks coming back from JLTC and BA22, but the adults don't want to change.

[Stosh 3452]

It's not that the adults don't want to change, it's more they don't want to give up control of the program.  But the scout is totally correct, unless the adults are willing to get out of the way, NYLT or any other training for the boys is totally a waste of money.

[Eagle94-A1 2687]

So very true. Troop that is slowly falling apart that I've mentioned in other posts had that happen. The old SM, just before stepping down, sent 2 Scouts to NYLT, to take the troop to the next level. When the new SM took over, some of the things the NLYT grads were trying to implement were overruled and ignored by the new SM.  Long story short, both NYLT grads transferred to another troop in our town that had 3 folks in NYLT that year. That troop also happens to be the best run troop in the district IMHO.

[Stosh 3452]

@@Eagle94-A1 puts the blame on the decline in scout leadership squarely where it belongs. "When the new SM TOOK OVER, some of the things the NYLT grads were trying ti implement were OVERRULED and IGNORED BY THE NEW SM!

 

Where in BSA literature does it say this is acceptable for any Boy Scout or Venturing program?  Whoever vetted this new guy probably just grabbed the closest warm body, got him in uniform and turned him over to abuse the boys... all with the BSA's tacit blessing.

 

I see this as the #1 reason why we no longer have troops of 50-80 scouts and instead have units struggling, if not creatively cheating, to get their 5 warm bodies to be legal once again at recharter time.

 

Scouting used to be the #1 program for developing qualified adult leaders of sound character in our society.  Now it's a family fun camp school of kids that learn to identify the trees at the playground.

Edited April 7, 2016 by Stosh

[TAHAWK 1420]

There is such a shortage of adults, that failure to follow mandated method is tolerated.  Not only is there no official pressure to offer Boy Scouting but there not even recognition of adults who do the job or the units they serve.

 

______________________________

What could BSA do if the Patrol method was important to BSA?

[blw2 433]

back. I mentioned

 

 

Want to clarify why I feel like I'm on a balancing act. I want change, I want to make it more meaningful. I think having them do more would help improve. Build esprit de corps and develope a sense of spirit. I want to hand a bunch a scripts to the SPl and say pcik one.

 

But asking my son about it, i.e. improving COHs with ceremonies he tells me "advancement isn't really important, "everyone gets it, no one fails," "it's not a big deal"." and "Earning ranks is more ha.ha fun than serious.". So he doesn't think it would matter. BUT the only ceremonies he's seen are Cub Scout ones.

 

My gut tells me that your son is more like the typical scout than you might think.  Trying to remember way back, I want to say that I had a similar opinion of ceremony as a kid.  It was a silly thing then.... and honestly still is to me.

I'm talking scripted ceremonies full of fluff, candles, etc....

Just taking it seriously, gives it more importance in my thinking.  Don't throw out the patch in a baggie, but instead a simple few words, come to the front, pause for a firm handshake and perhaps a photo (not one of those shake hands and sit back down before the dust settles on your chair). Just a solemn and sincere recognition is better than some trumped up thing in my thinking.  But that's just me.... I wonder if your son would agree.

 

 

3) More PLCs. The PLs and other youth running the meetings need to get together more often and prepare. Very haphazard

 

4) This is one that I want so badly, and now that we got several First Class Scouts or higher, and are going to mixed aged patrols, I WANT THE PLs, ASPL, SPL AND SELECT SCOUTS TO SIGN OFF ON THE S-T-2-1 (up to their actual rank, i.e. a 2nd Class PL can't sign off on First Class requirement). At the moment it's only the adults who sign off.

 

More later

just a question..... but is the need for more preparation your perception as an adult, based on the way YOU & I think the meeting ought to run.... or do they see the need for it? 

[TAHAWK 1420]

Allow that adults should know more about possibilities.  Presenting options, if they are really options, that the Scouts have not thought of is perfectly consistent with TPM, as is trying to convince them to exercise their power to chose in a particular direction.  (Yes, a line can be crossed  So don't.)

 

The troop I was with for twenty-five years was weak on ceremonies (opinion).  Cattle calls.  Literally 12 seconds to award Life. Parents not happy.  We had the leaders witness the really fantastic ceremonies (opinion) at a troop in the neighboring district.  The leaders decided to do more.  We had a dad who was an amateur theater hobbyist as a resource.  The ceremonies improved (opinion).

[qwazse 4344]

... up to their actual rank, i.e. a 2nd Class PL can't sign off on First Class requirement)....

Just to blow your mind a little: why not?

 

Say the PL has a busted gamb and can't complete swimming reqs until a couple months. He can still observe and cheer on his mates at a properly supervised aquatics area, then put his pen to their books while they are drying off. Say he's still nervous about land navigation, but lines up a hike with a buddy who says he's ready as navigator and an instructor as backup and he tags along. After his buddy identifies the ideal logs on this side of the ravine to trim and cross to the other side, why shouldn't he sign off?

 

Make the rules simple: PL's can sign off on ST2F rank advancement, period. He doesn't have to be first to rank up to lead his boys in ranking up!

[blw2 433]

"PL's can sign off on ST2F rank advancement, period."

is that written someplace?  I have been wondering what the ultimate written rule is on that topic.... not troop traditions, but the bottom line rule...

if PL signing off up to 1st class....

then who has the authority to sign off on requirements for star, life, eagle?

[Stosh 3452]

Public speaking  and teaching require speech with slow, deliberate and audible characteristics.  Pauses for emphasis, gestures, etc. are all things I teach my boys.  While there is very little OA theatrics involved, the boys do quite well with the MC of a COH.  The reading parts are usually a bit up-tempo and often slurred a bit with the speed, but as the boys get older and more comfortable, that gets better.

 

I find my boys tend to "do their own thing" when it comes to COH's and other times when they need to "get up front and talk". 

 

At a COH one of the patrols (designated before the COH starts, and goes up front, welcomes everyone, etc. then distributes the awards for this patrol member.  He then hands off the duties to the next PL who does the same and hands off to the next PL.  The last PL does his thing and then thanks everyone for coming and invites them to stay for refreshments.

[TAHAWK 1420]

"At a COH one of the patrols (designated before the COH starts, and goes up front, welcomes everyone, etc. then distributes the awards for this patrol member.  He then hands off the duties to the next PL who does the same and hands off to the next PL.  The last PL does his thing and then thanks everyone for coming and invites them to stay for refreshments."

 

Sounds great !  

[Eagle94-A1 2687]

My gut tells me that your son is more like the typical scout than you might think.  Trying to remember way back, I want to say that I had a similar opinion of ceremony as a kid.  It was a silly thing then.... and honestly still is to me.

I'm talking scripted ceremonies full of fluff, candles, etc....

Just taking it seriously, gives it more importance in my thinking.  Don't throw out the patch in a baggie, but instead a simple few words, come to the front, pause for a firm handshake and perhaps a photo (not one of those shake hands and sit back down before the dust settles on your chair). Just a solemn and sincere recognition is better than some trumped up thing in my thinking.  But that's just me.... I wonder if your son would agree.

 

just a question..... but is the need for more preparation your perception as an adult, based on the way YOU & I think the meeting ought to run.... or do they see the need for it? 

 

My troop did ceremonies,and the had some meaning and were special. Talking to some of the guys today parts of it are still remembered, especially our Investiture ceremony. But yes, it seems as if ceremonies are not a big deal.  As for the PLCs, I'd say both. SPL realizes that he needs to do something besides texts and emails. But we only meet 2-3 times a year as a PLC, just after the election and training. That's it.