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Camping MB and long-term camp

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I think many of the posts support what @@JoeBob stated. Scout-made shelters, igloos, tee-pees, hammocks, lean-to, bivouacs, tents, etc., should count. Ready-made shelters (except summer camp tents) or cabins or lock-ins, or sleeping on a ship (unless on deck under the stars) and anything that would hardly be considered "roughing it" should not. Only one long-term should count, not more.

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I guess I am over 2 years late to the party here.  I support Skeptic.  The BSA states that the scoutmaster determines when a requirement is passed off.  I thought it was very disrespectful that Hedgehog and Krampus were bullying Skeptic with their made up scenarios.  

The weeklong scout camps I go on, often have a canoe overnighter where the scouts paddle across the lake and camp on their own.  This gives them a unique camping experience and I always give the scouts credit for 1 night camping for their second scout camp.  They are doing everything needed to camp like selecting a site and pitching at tent.  BTW the National BSA is out of their minds nuts.  RIP BSA.

 

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Welcome to the forum, @Koolio.

This is an old thread and I didn't go back and try to re follow it. One thing to note is both Hedgehog and Krampus haven't been heard from in a while.

We consider this a virtual campfire, so pull up a virtual chair and introduce yourself. It might be easier if you go to the new to the forum section and start a new thread.

Thanks,

Matt

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On 12/3/2015 at 7:50 PM, Wilson-KY said:

Thank you - here's the post (no longer in an invisible font!):

 

Need the group's help on this one. Scout went to summer camp for the full week in year one. In year two Scout attended three days/nights. Camping MB says "you may use a week of long-term camp toward this requirement." We have varying opinions if the days/nights in year two can be counted, because it wasn't "a week." MB also says all campouts since becoming a Scout may count toward the requirement, which may also be causing confusion.

 

So do the days in week two count toward the MB requirement? Scout met the other requirements to count these days, as he was at camp each day and night and slept in a tent.

 

Thanks.

IMHO, it should count, however, it's kind of skirting the rules.  That, and IMHO, camping is when the majority of learning to be a Scout occurs.  Honestly, 20 nights is a very poor minimum number of camping nights to be considered a decent Scout.  If I were running things, I'd require 50 nights (but allow non-Scout camping as part of that) in tents, under tarps, or under the stars.  

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On 6/10/2018 at 4:08 PM, MattR said:

One thing to note is both Hedgehog and Krampus haven't been heard from in a while.

I'm back (and probably just for a limited time).

On 6/10/2018 at 12:59 PM, Koolio said:

I guess I am over 2 years late to the party here.  I support Skeptic.  The BSA states that the scoutmaster determines when a requirement is passed off.  I thought it was very disrespectful that Hedgehog and Krampus were bullying Skeptic with their made up scenarios.  

The weeklong scout camps I go on, often have a canoe overnighter where the scouts paddle across the lake and camp on their own.  This gives them a unique camping experience and I always give the scouts credit for 1 night camping for their second scout camp.  They are doing everything needed to camp like selecting a site and pitching at tent.  BTW the National BSA is out of their minds nuts.  RIP BSA.

First, for the Merit Badges, it is the Merit Badge Counselor, not the Scoutmaster.  Second, a Merit Badge Counselor cannot add, subtract or change requirements.  The specific requirement is:

Camp a total of at least 20 nights at designated Scouting activities or events. One long-term camping experience of up to six consecutive nights may be applied toward this requirement. Sleep each night under the sky or in a tent you have pitched. If the camp provides a tent that has already been pitched, you need not pitch your own tent.

The question is what constitutes a long term camping experience.  BSA provides guidance here: https://blog.scoutingmagazine.org/2015/06/24/ask-expert-isnt-camping-night-camping-mb/

Under that guidance, it is clear that summer camp, 50 milers and High Adventure are all long term camping.  You can count up to six nights only for one of those events.  Krampus and my examples were designed to show that "bending" the rules is a slippery slope and many absurd results could be justified.  I see this all the time in units where the Scoutmaster thinks that they can make all the call regardless of the BSA program.  At that point it isn't Boy Scouts, its Scoutmaster Bob's version of scouting.  

Your situation is a close call.  It does meet the spirit of what short term camping is, but it is nonetheless during a long-term camping experience.  Ultimately, I see this no different as my not counting our 50 miler (they packed up your gear each night so each night was a different camping experience) or Seabase (some scouts slept on deck under the stars two nights during the trip) or the outpost at NYLT or the kids who did the Wilderness Survival merit badge at camp.

Ultimately, you are teaching the wrong lesson to your Scouts because your approach is to encourage doing the bare minimum and skirting the rules based on an adult exercising discretion they don't have.  A lot of our Scouts earn the Camping Merit Badge and then get the National Outdoor Award with a gold pin because when you add in the long-term camping nights, they have over 50 nights camping in the time it took them to earn 20 nights for the Camping Merit Badge.The senior leaders (all 10th grade) in our Troop all had well over 50 nights camping with one just breaking 100 nights (it would be 135 if you counted the nights he spent last summer as camp staff).  At the end of the summer, some of our Webelos Crossovers will have 11 nights ( 5 nights camping and 6 nights at summer camp).  Over half-way there in four months.

Merit badges are earned, not given.

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