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I would like to thank a number of forumers who have guided me over the year.


Dessertrat,  Eamon, twocubs, Eagle99,  Fish,   Oldgreyeagle. goldwinger,



Lets just say that with their advice,  the inner city poor troop went from 6 members to over 50.    Moving from adult led/run to boy led and run.  I am proud of what that group of 6 have accomplished.   


Thank you.



Sadly I have seen a significant shift in all scouting forums that I don't care for and simply will not stand for without speaking out.    I see scouting moving from it's middle class base to the rich suburbs.    Requirement short cutting,  eagle chasing parents,  High dollar trips and Family adventure being the norm.  


Lost is the boy sized adventures,  the days exploring the creek or hanging with buds......My patrols are truly a band of brothers.  It makes me smile every outing to watch them in action.  I like to think that Dan Beard and Baden Powell are looking down on our program and smiling.


I wish you the best  









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Did my first EBOR as a District Rep for the first time in a long time last night.  I always get more out of them than the Scout does, and this one was no disappointment.  What an amazing young man.  S

I have always learned far more from those I have disagreements with then I ever learned from like minded individuals. It is in the attempt to understand their side of an argument, that I come to bett

Sometimes the chorus grows quieter because some members are driven off by the attack and harsh tone from other members. I very much believe this was cause of loosing some many member in the last coupl

I'm sorry you feel that way. Especially if my comments directed at you have caused you to make this decision. I've learned a good deal from you BD. 

Good luck with your scouting and personal endeavors going forward.

Per your request, I will close out your account.  


Edited by Sentinel947
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I'm sorry to see you go BD.  I see and share the frustration in your post and it's a shame you'll no longer be around to help counter that rich suburb direction that the BSA seems to be heading for - in the years I've been active in the forum, I've seen a lot of people heading that direction change course because of commenters like you who show a better pathway (and it sure does seem that people who come in looking for validation for their shortcuts and don't get it move on pretty quickly.


Good Luck and if you ever feel like hanging around the campfire again, we'll make a space for you.

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A few things:


1) Very sorry to see you leave. But can understand when something turns from fun to frustration, it's time to move on.


2) You have a lot t0 be proud of. You've directly touched the lives of 50 young men who need an adult leader like you. And that is just with this one troop. Think about how much of an impact you will have made when the 50 you worked with imitate you!.


3) Keep up the good fight in regards to keeping old school Scouting alive, making a difference to young men's lives, especially with those who need Scouting most.


4) In regards to someof the challenges you and your Scouts have faced locally, Always remember:

Illegitimi non carborundum!
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Gosh this makes me sad for some reason even though we've never much interacted over the years.  But I understand.  I'm about ready to give up, but my giving up will be in real life at the troop level due to those things you share.  they don't see what they are doing and I haven't made a dent.  We could use a strong leader with his head on straight like you are, and this forum could use your perspective as well.  Take care.

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BD, such a drama queen. :laugh:


We are kinda stuck until National promotes hiking and camping independently with your mates as the pinnacle scouting experience.


Well, whatever. If I never see your posts here, but we cross paths on the trail ... it will be a win!

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Sorry to see anyone leave in frustration over a forum.  I remember the days when Ed Mori and Bob White used to duke it out.  It could get bloody...and embarrassing when you realized that there are hundreds of "lurkers" (youth and adults) getting their impression of Scouting from the comments here.


BD, thank you for toiling in the trenches, where the rubber meets the road.  That's where Scouting takes place, after all.  Not here, Not in Irving, Not at the Council office full of overpaid Executives.  You may never know the impact that you made on impressionable young men, but if you have saved just one, it was worth it.


Scout on, brother.

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<<Sadly I have seen a significant shift in all scouting forums that I don't care for and simply will not stand for without speaking out.    I see scouting moving from it's middle class base to the rich suburbs.    Requirement short cutting,  eagle chasing parents,  High dollar trips and Family adventure being the norm. >>



The packs and troops I have worked with have all been marginal units in lower middle class to poor areas.  Unfortunately,  they are marginal units because of lack of interest by a lot of the families living in those areas,  while rich suburbs recruits scads of boys just by ringing a bell.



Unfortunately,  a lot of people lack the time, money and inclination to participate in Scouting.  If they don't join,  then the rich suburbs are supplying a larger part of the membership.



I've donme my best to swim against that tide by recruiting more lower middle class and poor people,  and more Latinos in particular. Very tough sledding is the bottom line.


Personally,  I'm put off by "High Adventure Bases"  and the super expensive Disneyland style of national attraction that BSA national seems to be growing as a program.  I have no interest in that,  and my aim is quality Scouting programs that are locally based and low in cost. 


<<Requirement short cutting,  eagle chasing parents>>



Nothing new there,  unfortuantely.


Personally,  I'm worn out and aiming to retreat from Cub Pack responsibilities I've shouldered or back stopped for nine years.  Not easy to do,  however. 


I'm not going to be a program leader under the new Cub Scout program.  Not interested in learning how to run a new program where my old skills have been made ob solete.


I was aiming to stay out of recruiting this fall,  but have been dragged back into it for the pack I've worked with,  and we have a recruiting night tonight.  We need to find a Tiger Cub and a Wolf Den Leader among families recruited tonight. 



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Going to vent for a minute here.


First off, I am sad to see BD leave the forum.  I respect him for what he has done with his troop.  He obviously loves working with this group of kids.  Hats off to you.  When someone mentioned that he was the second to leave in as many weeks, I didn't know who until I looked at the name change and last post of someone.  That is a shame as well, as even though we didn't agree on everything, I got a lot of great advice from him.


We have a very diverse group of people here, not only from a political point of view but also demographically and troop make up.  My God, we go from @@Stosh having two scouts in his troop to folks like @@Eagledad and others with more than 50.  I may not agree with everything that @@Stosh posts, but I have tremendous respect for him.  His love of scouting is obvious when he starts a troop from scratch.  @@Eagledad is another person that I can tell loves Scouting (maybe not everything, but the general premise).  I personally know @@TAHAWK and he has way more experience in Scouting than I will have if I stay involved for the rest of my life!


My point is we don't always agree on everything but we should always agree to be civil to each other.  I don't know why BD thought that @@Hedgehog was getting personal and is dropping out of the forum, but he has a point that there is some personal digs that happen and NOT only in the I&P section.  I have been on this forum for over 10 years and have learned a great deal from most, if not all, of you, especially when I first stepped up as SM 10 years ago.  I hope some of you have learned something from me.


As I have said many times, I don't agree with everything national does, but I stay involved in Scouting because I really enjoy working with the boys and seeing them grow from boys  to young men. Recently, my first Eagle Scout got married.  It made me feel old, but it also made me smile knowing that he has become a man and is starting his own family.  Who knows in a few years his son may come into the troop!


Sorry for the rambling rant.  This is not my way of saying that I am leaving the forum, because I am not.  I have too much to learn and too much to share with others to let a few people ruin it for me.  This is just my way of saying let's be a little nicer to each other on here, even if we don't always agree.


Thanks to all of you for your insight and guidance you have provided to me and thanks to BD for all his hard work in scouting.  Good luck to you with your troop.

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